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West Somerset Railway General Discussion

Discussion in 'Heritage Railways & Centres in the UK' started by gwr4090, Nov 15, 2007.

  1. Bayard

    Bayard Well-Known Member

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    As I said about an earlier post, perhaps wrongly in that case, this post is very much of the zeitgeist: it's not wrong for the management to do things wrong or badly, the only problem is people pointing this out publicly. It's the whistleblower who is punished, not the wrongdoer. As Sir Humphrey so memorably put it, "The Official Secrets Act is there to protect officials, not secrets."

    Regardless as to whether the decisions on 4110 and Washford were correct or incorrect, the fact remains that the way they were communicated were PR disasters. Not pointing this out in Nat Pres doesn't magically turn them into PR triumphs, but no, we mustn't complain, we must let the management continue, Ceaucescu-like, while the resentment from those directly affected builds up to boiling point, because to do otherwise would be "WSR-bashing" or indulging in "conspiracy theories".

    As has been pointed out earlier, "you can't make an omlette without breaking eggs", i.e. unpopular decisions often have to be made to get things done, but it is in the nature of unpopular decisions to upset people, that is why they are unpopular. The wise course is to lessen that upset as far as possible by politeness and explanation, neither of which appear to have been forthcoming from the Plc board recently and if they are not prepared to do anything to mitigate that upset, then they really should not be surprised if some of it is directed back against them.

    I seem to recall that the same sentiments were expressed when the fight was on to wrest another part of the WSR family from the hands of a board who seemed to be making the wrong decisions. I somehow don't think the WSR would have benefited if we had all sat on our hands saying "mustn't grumble" and just let them get on with it.
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2020
  2. AnthonyTrains2017

    AnthonyTrains2017 Well-Known Member

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    FB_IMG_1583427634587.jpg this is a picture of a train on the WSR; more on topic than the 100 pages of long posts.
     
  3. Maverick

    Maverick New Member

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    Over the last year I have watched and read the comments here around 4110 and have refrained from posting as I did not want to detract attention from the work to ensure the survival of the West Somerset Railway. Following recent developments and what I can only see as similarity’s in the treatment the 4110 group received I now believe it is time to speak up. Let me be clear the following is my own personal account/view and has nothing whatsoever to do with the other members of the 4110 group. I was extremely close to the goings on at the time being the conduit for all communications between the PLC, GWR4110Ltd, the WSRA and supporters pledging money.

    Over the summer of 2018 members of the loco department were made aware of the potential sale of the locomotive 4110 and several of us approached the then General Manager and head of Finance in order to establish the true extent of this sale. As part of this the newly formed group were invited to prepare a case for the WSR board around how 4110 could be retained, overhauled and put back to work on the West Somerset Railway. At this time the group was focused on the locomotive remaining owned by the WSR PLC and the overhaul being self-funded by the savings made from not hiring in locomotives. I have attached the paper I prepared for the PLC board meeting with the help of the other members of the 4110 group to this post.

    As 2018 went on and the extend of the financial problems facing the WSR PLC emerged focus moved from the PLC retaining ownership to the need for another group to purchase the locomotive. Throughout all of this work, the PLC and WSRA were involved. As a group we were consistently told that the WSRA had no funds to support the purchase but that 4110 could remain within the locomotive restoration fund to attract monies for overhaul. Work continued at pace throughout late November and early December within the 4110 group to prepare for a fundraising appeal. During this time we received chasing emails from the PLC Chairman confirming that he was supportive of a “People Engine” owning group and pushing us to launch as soon as possible. As is now public knowledge that is exactly what we did. The response was phenomenal and within 5 days we already had pledges covering more than 2 thirds of the £120,000 asking price. At this point supportive members of the WSRA trustee board approached us as a 4110 group asking if there was anything that could be done to help us over the line. Discussions were had, joint meetings held and agreement was made that we would be supportive of the WSRA purchasing shares within GWR4110Ltd for those people who wished to donate via them in order to recover gift aid. Given recent history as a group we were adamant that no one member should be able to hold more than 20% of shares within the newly formed GWR4110Ltd. This was to ensure that no single person gained control of the locomotive and that it remained a “Peoples Locomotive”. As these discussions were ongoing the emails and social media messages to myself from the PLC Chairman changed tone, one email even questioned why we were talking to the WSRA without the PLC being present. Email exchanges and demands escalated with the PLC asking firstly for a 51% share of GWR4110Ltd without any form of financial contribution (See previous statement re 20% ownership, something we were keen to protect) and then for the PLC to be able to appoint directors to the company. I personally received several abrupt and abusive messages which included requests to provide information of who had pledged money to the fund. Under GDPR rules this is something I refused to provide.

    A few days later on the day we reached the milestone of £120,000 pledged, we received a joint email from the PLC Chairman and WSRA Chairman stating that they had agreed that the best route for the future of 4110 was for the WSRA to purchase the locomotive and that the locomotive was no longer on offer to 4110 Ltd. Within this correspondence the 4110 group statements included “An essential part of that plan will be a core group of locomotives owned by either the WSR plc or WSRA but not by external companies” and “to be clear the Ltd company practice would be under the board governance which sits outside of our ‘Railway family”. I personally took offence to the last comment re railway family. The 4110 appeal had brought broad support from active volunteers and members across the WSR, who were very much part of the WSR Family. Some people had even told me they were donating their pension funds to save 4110 for the WSR. The correspondence went on to offer an ultimatum of two press releases, one including 4110 Group support for this approach and one without. As a group we discussed at length and felt that given the messages of support and reasons people had given us that we could not support the approach. I replied stating that we understood the stance, but couldn’t support it and would continue with the process of establishing GWR4110Ltd and the relevant bank accounts should the PLC/WSRA approach not succeed. We sent a clear message stating such to all those who had offered funds to us. Many came back stating that they did not want to purely donate money but wanted to have tangible ownership of a locomotive on the WSR, some even said they planned to pass shares on through their family and future generations.

    The PLC and WSRA made their press release. Two weeks passed and sure enough the WSRA and PLC Chairman re approached us as a group. The WSRA appeal had failed to raise more than £13,000 and asked us to see if we could raise the money as soon as possible to purchase the loco along the lines of the early December plan. That we committed to try and deliver. We re contacted all those that had pledged money to commence the process of collection of the money. We were given a little over a week to do this and were told that the PLC desperately needed the money to stay afloat. At this time we were also informed that the PDSR had increased their purchase offer to £140,000. Many of the previous supporters dug even deeper into their pockets and we believed that we could match the PDSR offer. However time was against us and in order to ensure the PLC could survive we reluctantly had to tell the PLC Chairman that we could not collect the money within the tight timescales and that for the good of the railway we accepted that the PDSR offer should be taken.

    What / why am I digging up the past?: I believe the continued attempts for the PLC to “Have their cake and eat it” are being shown within the SDJR Trusts treatment. We were a group of dedicated WSR volunteers who continued to face constantly moving goal posts and changes of wind direction. As a member of the 4110 group I received a considerable amount of abrupt and abusive messages. We were inaccurately accused of acting fraudulently within Steam Railway Magazine (Something we have still yet to receive an apology for). As a group 4110 put a lot of effort into the appeal, we showed for the first time the potential for mass / large amount crowdfunding on the WSR with more money being pledged to the 4110 fund than any group on the WSR had received in the previous decade. This I hope had an impact on the track Renewal Fund.

    Why am I speaking up now?: Until the summer of last year I was an active volunteer within the loco department and had been for 10 years, however after speaking out on social media once my safety critical clearance was revoked and as with others I was removed from active WSR Volunteering. Since July I have remained quiet, mainly in the hope that one day I will be allowed to return to the volunteering role I loved. However since the latest inappropriate action towards the SDJR Trust I fell I have no choice but to disclose some of the facts of the 4110 “Saga”! This I am doing under the Public Interest Disclosure Act as I feel it is in the interest of all connected to the WSR to know. I have email and documents to support all of the above and am willing to share with any current Trustees of any WSR supporting organisations in order to support them to make their own informed decision.

    Out of all of this, the one ray of sunshine is that 4110 is currently undergoing restoration at the East Somerset Railway with a view to returning it to steam by 2022. The future for 4110 is bright and I can’t wait to see it running on a railway in Somerset, albeit the wrong one. I for one have offered my time to the ESR to support its overhaul.


    Chris Ruddick

    “Maverick”
     

    Attached Files:

  4. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

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  5. Jamie Glover

    Jamie Glover New Member

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    Having read the above posting plus all else concerning the toxic behaviour of the four people who form the WSR Plc. I fail to see how any intelligent person can support what is happening (and has happened) at managerial level within the WSR. The present PLC board seems to have all the undesirable skills of the long departed and unlamented Ex6.

    I sincerely hope that the S&DRT will contest the attempted cancellation of their lease in a court of law. If this is to happen? Then I urge WSR stakeholders to financially support the S&DRT legal expenses and not fund further WSR appeals until such time as the whole leasehold situation is successfully settled in favour of the S&DRT.

    I would also pose the question. What is the best approach for uniting stakeholders, volunteers and shareholders into a coalition that can remove the toxic four? I earnestly wish every success to the WSR. However, I feel that it is something that can never happen with this group at the helm.
     
  6. Andy Norman

    Andy Norman Member

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    It is a pity the HPC project has not gone ahead as intended, the stakeholders in the schools and other agencies not receiving what they had agreed with them is causing much upset and bad feeling and some of those concerned have written to the people concerned to ask for a justification.

    I will also confirm that one of the schools Headteachers involvement whilst of course supported me by default was also through direct contact (in her professional role as a Board Member of the Opportunity Area Programme) with the WSRA Board, PLC Board & HPC Contacts with whom she had direct working relationships including meetings and correspondence.
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2020
  7. RailWest

    RailWest Part of the furniture

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    I note with some surprise that the one group NOT listed to receive copies are members of the PLC Board other than the Chairman. Is that perhaps an omission, or an assumption that JJP will distribute it within the Board anyway?
     
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  8. Andy Norman

    Andy Norman Member

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    Thanks. Very good point. The other Board members direct email address's don't appear to be in the public domain or available to know where to send to. If anybody has them I can pass them on and correct it.
     
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  9. Piggy

    Piggy Member

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    Thank you, Mrs Norman
     
  10. Monkey Magic

    Monkey Magic Part of the furniture

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    It would appear that there is a pattern of behaviour emerging.

    A very good letter but maybe a different font? (I know it is a little thing)
     
  11. staffordian

    staffordian Well-Known Member

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    I assume it's already been sent; if not, should intimated not be intimidated?

    (Para 3 line 5)
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2020
  12. Keith Sims

    Keith Sims Member

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    A brilliant example of what we have been suggesting! the more people who "stand up to be counted " the better. Thank you Mrs Norman. We must admit we sent letters all the directors by post to Minehead Station.
    Come on the rest of you interested stakeholders. shareholders. volunteers Have your say direct to the Board. Keith and Joyce Sims
     
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  13. Andy Norman

    Andy Norman Member

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    Yes it has and yes it should, thanks for the spot.
     
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  14. Piggy

    Piggy Member

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    Yes
    But let's nit got two pendatic .....
     
  15. mvpeters

    mvpeters Member

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    Please, let's not get bogged down in semantics - it's no worse than the average website content.
    This add-on is recommended: https://www.grammarly.com/grammar-check though, like all word-checkers, it won't catch everything.
     
  16. Greenway

    Greenway Part of the furniture

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    It was interesting to read the letter by Mrs. J. Norman. Straight to the point and hopefully it may bring a sense of reality and reveal the feelings of local people to the WSR PLC. boardroom. I note the destinations of those getting copies of the letter: two, at least, may prove rewarding
    Critics on the line, it appears (notable by their absence are the very few posts by WSR volunteers) it appears that they are gagged and/or expelled, while those, who are not volunteers but voice their views, are usually tarred with opprobrium.
    Much has been said over the years on NP about the WSR and its recent history, apparently resulting in a large loss of support. Whilst most of the infighting and other unpleasantness are history, however, I have a view of the future.
    The future for the WSR is not, as far as I can see, that exciting. Current health issues affecting our country will affect the line until mid summer, at least I believe, and that cannot help the bottom line of the WSR account. It was also recorded here that £500,000 is needed per annum to maintain the line operationally: the present appeal, as far as I can see, has only raised about a third of that since inception and appeals usually tail off after their initial launch! Interestingly a bank seems to have first call on the line so is the WSR really that solvent? But I am not an accountant, so only making an assumption.
    My own view is that the WSR, having alienating many supporters - often those who donated freely with financial assistance and their labours, - can only lead to a further loss of much needed income.
    I ask this question: Might there be a 'Fire Sale' further down the line?
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2020
  17. Snifter

    Snifter Well-Known Member

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    Look on the bright side, a particular individual can point to another single word slip-up in 3 years time. How happy he will be !
     
  18. 35B

    35B Nat Pres stalwart

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    That is the risk. And while I do believe in the genuine intent of the current board, those are the circumstances in which real harm could end up being done.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
     
  19. Roger Thompson

    Roger Thompson Member

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    The HRA website gives this email address for Mark Smith mark.smith@hra.uk.com and the Companies House entry for Tyseley Locomotive Works Ltd gives a postal address in Warwickshire for Bob Meanley
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2020
  20. Bayard

    Bayard Well-Known Member

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    Sadly the Team that Toppled the Toxic 6 are no longer available, it seems.
     

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