Vintage Trains 2024

47 815 "Great Western".

 

The Lord Mayors show.

(Two errant branches were removed with Photoshop................................by royal appointment)


"Earl of Mount Edgcumbe", 16/03/24.

 

Finally got the video from Saturday up onto Youtube.

 

No. 47815 'Great Western'

 

Shap Mountaineer by Henry Elliott, on Flickr
Sorry its late ..........been waiting for paint to dry lol

 

Nice photos of a great run..
I asked who the train crew were on the day at Crewe, as below:-

North
Driver Alastair Meanley
Fireman Sam Perry
Guard Alex Fowles

South
Driver Kevin Cronin
Fireman Simon Horrobin
Guard Bruce Pollard

 

Thought details of the day would have been posted before now but as they haven't been thought I'd put something together.

UK Steam Hauled Tour No. 947

The Shap Mountaineer 16th March 2024

At last there was a train worth travelling on in 2024. The Shap Mountaineer promised unassisted steam behind the superb 5043 from Carnforth to Carlisle outward; then from Carlisle to Crewe on the return. For us it was going to be almost a repeat of the train 5043 headed on 20th June 2009, the main difference being then we had steam from Crewe to Carlisle on the outward. The performance that day with 9+GUV was a bit special. I checked back and we also had 9+GUV on the Carnforth D&UGL to Carlisle leg of the ill-fated Coastal Explorer on the 19th September 2015. That was a bit good too.

Unusual for this year the day dawned bright and sunny in Crewe. The man on the gate on the station told us the train would be off Platform 12 as booked. There were quite a few fellow passengers already there. More joined including most of the usual suspects and timers. A VT steward told us there would be 8 carriages behind the Class 47 with Standard Class on the back. On time 47773 rolled in with 7 on. The train would therefore be a bit of a lightweight 8+GUV. Carriage G, where our seats were, was 'tail end Charlie'. Such is life but we'd be up front for the long climb to Shap in the afternoon.

Bit of a faux pas with seating. Our tickets said seats 9,10,11&12 Facing and Back on Tables 5 and 6. Whoever had laid out the table numbers at Tyseley had started from the wrong end of the carriage so seat numbers didn't match Table numbers. Our tables were now 11&12. Me and 'Cardiff' John had the milepost side table. Spotting facing and back we shouldn't miss any posts that are there. Judith, John and Diana had the other table of our usual 4+4.

We left on time and had an uneventful RT run to Preston. We were about to leave right time when we didn't. After a few minutes the ontrain announcement told us a passenger had been taken ill and we had to wait until a Paramedic or Ambulance Crew attended. Bit of confusion there and we had no idea what actually transpired. We hoped the passenger recovered. We were close to 50 minutes late departing and those of us used to travelling on the CME couldn't fail to notice we were in their path. RTT showed the CME being 22 minutes down after the stock arrived late at Euston earlier. We did wonder what would happen at Carnforth as we were obviously well out of our path.

We watched RTT and OpenTrainTimes and by Lancaster the CME was only 10 minutes behind us. North of Lancaster the green WCR Class 47 passed us going south. Odd that but we guessed it was caused by 2 trains needing to be in Carnforth D&UGL at the same time. We had the feathers to enter the loop and ran in on the road normally used to release the electric/diesel from the front of the train. 47773 was detached and let out onto the mainline to run to Grayrigg Loop where it would remain until we'd passed Grayrigg Summit. It was then going to shadow us to Carlisle 'just in case' and assist with the shunting around the station. There was no intention to turn the whole train.

About 15 minutes after we stopped in the loop, the CME with the Mk2 'coffins' rolled in on our left. Must have been a bit hot on board as some passengers were fanning their faces with the brochures. No toplights to open. 86259 was released and went out onto the mainline and set off for Preston. The green Class 47 came into the loop a bit later and coupled on to the rear of the train.

Carnforth to Yealand Summit

The Castle with GUV and POB in tow - watched it on a number of Railcams on Friday - came off shed and backed onto our train. After the brake check we were ready to leave with no sign of Tangmere backing on to the CME. We got the signal to leave so it appeared that Control had taken the decision to let us out in the CME's slot. We left at 1123, 47 down. Thanks to 'Scrat' for the crew information; Driver was as expected, Alastair Meanley. Our fireman was Sam Perry.

As soon as we got onto the mainline we were a tad concerned at the thick dark smoke emanating from the chimney of 5043. Hardly GWR style. The loco had been standing for an extra 45 minutes so we weren't expecting fireworks on the 2 1/2m 134r Yealand Bank. We hit the 134r at 39 but settled into a sensible steady climb, speed falling back to 36.2 by the summit. In 2015 with 9+GUV we crested the summit at 36.5. Got no details for the 2009 run.

Yealand Summit to Grayrigg Summit

We were 3 1/2 miles from the start of Grayrigg Bank and time for Sam to really find out how good the coal was. Down the mile and a half of 293f speed only rose to 56. Hmmm. Then things got better and on the 2 miles of level track speed rose to 65. The smoke was a bit cleaner and that wasn't a bad speed to take onto the 173r at mp12 3/4. We were definitely not short of steam and the distinctive 4-cylinder sound drifted back to us at the back of the train as the Castle attacked the foot of Grayrigg Bank. Speed fell to 62 a mile in; to 59 at 2 miles in; and to 56.1 at mp15 3/4, the end of the 173r. The gradient then steepened to 3/4m of 153r where speed fell only a little to 55.6 at mp16 1/2. Bit of relief on 3/4m of 392r and back to almost 57. From mp17 1/2 there's a hard mile of 111r and our speed fell to 51.1. That took us onto the mile and a half of 176r from mp18 1/2 with Oxenholme Station just after mp19. Good running saw speed rise to 52.7 through the station (54 in 2015) but fall a bit to 51.5 as we hit the 3/4m of 104r. We left it at 48.1. The hoped for 40+ at Grayrigg Summit was fading somewhat. On the next 3/4m of 124r we lost a bit of speed to 45.8. The gradient eased a little to 131r over the next 2 1/2 m. Plenty of work for the fireman but by mp23 3/4 speed had fallen to 41.6. (In 2015 speed was a rapid 53).

Just over 2 miles to the summit and plenty of noise and smoke as the Castle didn't give a lot to this section. We dipped below 40 as we passed Lambrigg, mp24 1/2; and to 38.1 at mp25. The Castle dug in then and lost nothing to the final mile and crested the summit at mp26 at 38. 47773 was ticking over in the loop ready to follow us up Shap 'just in case'. Alastair handled the Castle well on the climb but I doubt that Sam found firing the beast an easy task. We'd lost a couple of minutes and were 49 down.

The time from Carnforth to Grayrigg Summit was 27m 11.8s.

In 2009 we passed Grayrigg summit at 47; in 2015 an even better 49.3.

Grayrigg Summit to Shap Summit

Over the summit and the grade eased to a mile of 204f. Time to tidy the fire a bit but also to get up to speed for the mighty Shap some 7 miles away. Down the mile of 777r to Low Gill, only 56. Hmmm. Need 70 or more before Tebay. 1/2m of level and more noise as we got to 59. Better to follow on the mile and a half+ of 425f, left at 69.2. More effort from Sam and plenty of steam allowed Alastair to get us to 71.6 over the mile of level track to Tebay. (72 in 2015). Respectable but we expected closer to 75 with the load. Shap approach is a mile and a half of 146r. The Castle sounded superb but speed fell to take 65.2 (65.4 in 2015) past mp32 3/4 onto the 75r. Only 4 1/4 miles of it! It's lovely to hear the even 4 cylinder beat of a Castle tackling the steep banks. Drivers hope to find the sweet spot on the cut off and we hoped Alastair would. Mp33 was passed at 64.3; then the next mile to mp34 saw speed fall to 54.5. Bit higher rate of attrition than we expected with only 9 on.

By mp35 despite the racket from the front we were down to 43.6 so the almost expected 40 mph+ at the summit was unattainable. We crossed Scout Green Path at 41.6 and dipped below 40 at mp35 1/2, 39.1. Shap was still biting and by mp36 we were down to 36.5. As is the norm the rate of attrition eased, the remaining quarters to the climbing summit being: mp36 1/4, 35.7; mp36 1/2, 35; mp36 3/4, 34.3; then mp37, 34.2. Into the damp rock cutting to the climbing summit, mp37 1/4 also passed at 34.2. The GPS was rock solid and showed no fluctuation. No slip on the greaser and the Castle picked up to 37.4 as we passed the plateau summit mp37 1/2. A well managed climb but we'd expected nearer 40 with the load. That's just the timers. We have no idea how good the coal is but we do love to speculate. We'd pulled 2 minutes back and were now as we left Carnforth, 47 minutes down.

Time from Carnforth to Shap Climbing Summit was 40m 7.3s.

Out of interest in 2009 we passed the Climbing and plateau summit at 40; in 2015, probably 40 and 42.5 (my timing sheet was confusing).

Onwards and downwards to Carlisle

We checked on RTT and OTT to see the progress of the CME. There were late running trains on the WCML and the CME, then only 12 minutes behind us, was looped at Grayrigg to allow the late running Manchester Airport to Edinburgh TPE to pass. This was the train due to pass us when we were in Penrith loop later.

We wondered if we could escape the clutches of Penrith loop. We ran down the 106r to pass mp39 1/4 at 65.8; then down the 142f to mp41, 71.2. Then down the 125f we passed Trimley Grange, mp43 at 76.3 and ran down the remaining 4 miles of 125f mostly around 75. We passed mp47 1/2 still at 74.8 but the brakes came in as we passed Eden Valley UGL. We slowed for the 25mph run into Penrith Loop, our speed only 16, where we arrived at 1221, 48 mins down. 47773 came into the loop behind us. Don't think Control were wrong looping us as the TPE rolled in only 5 minutes after us and departed at 1228. We were allowed out of the loop 2 minutes behind it.

We didn't seem to be in much of a hurry as down the mile of 616f we only got to 37. On the 1/2m of level track speed increased to 44. After a bit of 539r, 47.8, 2 miles of 189f was taken advantage of and speed rose to 68 at mp55. Down through Plumpton on 2 miles of level track we got to 72 and passed Calthwaite, 172f at 77.9. All down grade to Carlisle then. We passed Southwaite, on 3 miles+ of 228f, mp62 at 76.5; passed Wray after close to 2 miles of 184f at 76.4. Then it was 4 miles of 131f to Upperby and we held 76/77 down to mp65 3/4 before the brakes came in. We rolled into platform 3 at Carlisle Citadel at 1250, 45 minutes down.

We wandered down the front. Alastair told us he'd really enjoyed himself driving 5043 over Grayrigg and Shap. Bet he didn't think he'd drive a Castle over Grayrigg and Shap when he started working at Tyseley Works with a group of youngsters on the restoration of what everyone thought was 4983 Albert Hall but was actually 4965 Rood Ashton Hall a long time ago. Our fireman, Sam Perry had an S. Perry nameplate on the cabside. Nice touch. Presumably Alastair did on the other side. Our guard on the outward was Alex Fowles.

We thought we saw Martyn Soames alongside the POB. Didn't get the opportunity to ask if he or someone else was acting as pilotman.

Running Time from Carnforth to Carlisle Citadel was 80m 2s

The break

We'd been watching RTT and OTT and knew the CME was close to us and sure enough just as we got off the train we saw Tangmere at the head of the CME running into Platform 1. They were only 17 minutes down so Control did a good job managing both trains. Rare to see Steam locos at the head of trains in both Platforms 1 and 3 in Carlisle on a Saturday afternoon.

We wandered down the front. Plenty of coal left in the tender. Smallish lumps. General comment was it was OK. Can't complain as it got us over Grayrigg and Shap at decent speeds and times.

Sadly the Artisan '301 miles from London' Pub that had been on Platform 4 had closed. This was on their Facebook Site: 301 Miles is now permanently closed. It was not an option to renew the lease. Thank you for all your support and custom over the years. Thank you to all the great staff and their hard work. Great shame as we had spent many hours in there on CMEs drinking interesting beers.

We wandered down to the crowded Woodrow Wilson just for a drink. The Beer Festival was still on hence the crowd. Met Sean Emmett there and we had a chat about the water capacity of the GUV as it appeared we were running the 141 miles to crew with no water stop. Sean found some details online that stated the water capacity was 3000 gallons. That made sense as on the side of the GUV it said the maximum load was 14 tons spread evenly. 3000 gallons of water weighs in at 13.4 tons. The Hawksworth Tender has a 4000 gallon capacity with probably an additional 250 gallons in the scoop space. That makes 7250 gallons for the run to Crewe with the little matter of the 30 mile climb to Shap at the start of the journey. Doable but we weren't expecting any fireworks from the Castle.

When we got back to the station 5043 was on the train in the siding alongside Platform 1. 47773 was attached to the rear. We watched 5043 draw the train out of the sidings onto the mainline with both a different driver and fireman on the footplate. Thanks to 'Scrat' for posting they were: Driver Kevin Cronin with Fireman Simon Horrobin. We also had a change of guard to Bruce Pollard.

After a couple of minutes, 47773 drew the consist back into Platform 3. Quicker than 5043 propelling the stock back into the station, but there were concerned faces all round. They disappeared as 47773 was detached to follow us back to Crewe. As the POB was coupled behind the GUV we were 3 back for the return.

Carlisle to Shap Summit

Long blast on the whistle and we left at 1515, only 10 minutes down. A nice start for Simon, a mile of level track. We love the sound of a Castle getting into its stride. We passed mp68, Upperby, at 29.5 and Simon got prepared for a long stint of firing on the almost 30 miles against the grade!! The first part of the climb was a not insignificant 3 1/2 miles of 131r. The 4 cylinder beat got louder as speed rose to 31.2 by mp67, a speed held to mp66. Bit of a pickup then as the fire got hotter and we passed mp65 at 33.6. We left the 131r at just over 33. Pretty much as expected; no fireworks with water management in mind. The gradient eased to 184r for close to 2 miles of 184r on wet rail. Speed rose to 40.2 by mp62 3/4, and to 44 on a short level section. Not bad and nice and noisy with the smoke not as dark as on the outward. The gradient eased to 2 3/4m of 288r and Kevin accelerated the Castle to 46 at Southwaite; 47 at mp61 and 49.2 at mp29 3/4, the end of section.

So far so good. The next section is 1 3/4m of 172r to Calthwaite, mp58. Nice and noisy and solid climbing with speed only falling to 47.9. We were now on close to 3 miles of level track on dry rails. Very nice handling by Kevin got us to 59.2 at mp55 1/4 just after Plumpton. Looking and sounding good and on the 1 3/4m of 186r speed only dropped to 55.2. A bit of a respite then on just over 1/2m of 539f and 1/2m of level track where speed rose to 63 as we approached Penrith North Lakes. There was a rumour the Castle had a speed restriction through the station but that wasn't true as we blasted around the curve on the 616r at close to 64. Must have looked and sounded superb. Been a long time since a Great Western Whistle was heard up there. (In 2009 speed through the station was 71). At mp50 1/4 the gradient rose to 191/193r for a mile, left at 63. There was a mile of level track then before the long 125r. We left it at 62.2 and speed fell to 59 on the first 1/4 of the 7 miles of 125r at mp48.

Plenty of hard work for Simon to keep the boiler close to the mark. Kevin used the steam well and with little fuss we passed Eden Valley UGL, mp47 1/2 at 55.8 and mp47 at 53.5. The rails were dry for a while as we passed mp46 at 50 ish (Missed the post) and mp45 at 47.2. Castles don't really like long climbs like this. Kevin seemed to have 5043 well under control but by mp44 speed had fallen to 44.7. The attrition rate stabilised and we passed mp43 at 44 after a short slip on now wet rail. A further short slip was felt around mp42 1/4 and we passed mp42 at 42.7, a speed held for the last 3/4m to mp41 1/4. The gradient eased to 1 1/4m of 142r, left at mp40 at 43.2. this was followed by 3/4m of level track where speed increased to 49.5 at mp39 1/2. Typically of the Northern Fells there was a sting in the tail as the gradient increased to 106r for the last mile to the summit. Lovely sound from up front but we lost speed and passed mp38 at 44.9. Then onto the level plateau and we passed the Summit Board, mp37 1/2 at 51.4. This is a really challenging climb for any fireman and Simon did an excellent job and must have been glad to see the summit board.

Time from Carlisle Citadel to Shap Plateau Summit was 43m 3s.

In 2009 we passed the Summit Board at 54. Castles aren't comfortable on long banks but both crews handled 5043 well.

Shap Summit to Carnforth

At last respite for our fireman. Down the 75f Kevin used the brakes regularly to keep speed down around 70; similarly down the 146f speed hovered in the mid to high 60s, Tebay South, mp31 passed at 65. We took 62 onto the 1 1/2m of 425r and left it at 57.6 at mp28 3/4. Seemed as if Kevin let 5043 run as there was little noise. The mile of 204r to the 'summit' of Grayrigg started at mp27, passed at 60. It seemed as if 5043 was just allowed to coast up it and we passed mp26 at 58. All downgrade/level for miles now and we flashed through Oxenholme at 69 with speed around 70 all the way down to Milnthorpe, mp13 1/2. Over 2 miles on the level speed fell to 53 and in heavy rain to 38.7 at mp9 1/2 after a mile+ of 293r. No point doing anything with Carnforth only 3 miles away. We crossed the down main into Carnforth U&DGL and stopped at the bottom of the yard at 1615, 12 minutes down.

Looking out of the toplight we saw some coal being taken forward but there was no tanker or hydrant so no water was taken. 47773 was in the Up goods ready to follow us.

Carnforth to Preston

The signal went to green and with a blast of 5043's whistle we were allowed out at 1700, 4 minutes down. No really hard firing for Simon to do now but there was still enough to do to keep the pressure to the mark for the 78 miles to Crewe. Down the 460f we reached 50 at mp4, 2 miles out. Short level to mp3 1/4, 54.4 and then a bit of noise up the 469r past Hest Bank, 56. We left the section at 47.9 and braked down to 34 as we passed mp1 not far from Lancaster Castle. A bit of noise as speed rose to 40.8 on the level. We ran through the station at 40.8 and hit the 3/4m of 98r at 39.4. Nice and noisy up this climb and the lovely 4-cylinder beat echoed around Lancaster. We came off it at 31 and speed rose rapidly to 59 down the almost 4 miles to mp17. Long level section through Calgate, 61; Bay Horse, mp15, 64.5; mp13 1/2, end of section 67.3.

Boring section for timers and the light was failing despite it being only 1715. Still we got most posts. For information, mp11, level, 68; Garstang, mp9 1/2, 1042f, 67.3; mp8 1/4, end of 1042f, 66.4; mp8, level, 65.9. Bit of excitement then, 2 1/2m of 644r, ending at mp5 1/4 at 57.9. From mp5 there's close to 2 miles of 1115r past Barton and Broughton PL, 56, left at mp3 1/4 at 55.4. Downgrade then to Preston where we arrived at 1735, only 3 minutes down, for our first set down of passengers.

Preston to Warrington Bank Quay

We were away at 1739, 4 down and just outside the station exchanged whistles with Tangmere on the CME approaching the station. Nice to see a passing train with a steam loco on the front at dusk.

Close to 3/4 of a mile out of the station we were doing just over 30 at the start of a bit of a climb. Not much of one at the start, 3/4m of 440r to Farington Curve, 20 1/4, 41.2. It steepened to 3/4m of 106r from mp20, ended at 39.8. There was some decent noise from up front and on 2 1/4m of 314r we ran through Leyland on the main at 48.5 and left the section at mp17 1/2, 48.2. Next was 1/2m of 110r to mp17, 45.9 followed by 3/4m of 432r to mp16+ 1/4, 50. From mp16 there's 1 3/4m of 936f where speed rose to 61 at Euxton Balshaw Lane. From mp14 1/2 we hit 1 1/4m of 114r, left at 51. Then over 2 miles of 235r/106r/296r/157r with a Gradient Post at mp11 1/2, 556r/636r, speed fell to 48.7. Think Kevin just let the Castle run rather than worked it. It was all downgrade to Wigan then. We ran through the station, mp6 1/2ish, 366f, at 62.5 and continued downgrade to Golbourne Jn where the mileposts changed. We passed mp187, the highest numbered WCML milepost, 473f, at 60. We struggled to spot the mileposts from there.

We coasted down to Winwick Jn, mp185 1/2, 639f, 67.6 and over 1 1/2m of 1010r from mp184 1/4, 66.2. Then Kevin touched the brakes as we were only a couple of miles from Warrington Bank Quay, our next set down. This was a shame as on the rare occasions steam ran up the WCML to Crewe we normally blasted round the curve through the station at 75ish. We duly came to a stand at 1812, still 4 minutes down

Warrington Bank Quay to Crewe

Only a short stop to set down passengers and we left at 1814, still 4 down. The light had gone now and mileposts were nigh on impossible to see. We thought we glimpsed mp182 so I rapidly zeroed my GPS as it was exactly 24 miles from there to Crewe. The tall mp158 is against the wall near the south end of Platform 11 at Crewe if you haven't seen it. I recorded 1/2 miles 'for the record'. We ran through Acton Grange Jn, 180 1/4, 400f at close to 40; passed mp179 (3 on GPS), level, at 57.8; mp178 (4), 567r, 55.8; mp177 (5), bit of 112r, 55.8; mile+ of 180r, mp176(6), 50.6; mp175, 330f, 54.3; Weaver Jn, 55ish; from mp330r, 1 1/2m of 330r to Acton Bridge, 56.4. Level or gently rising gradients, mp171(11), 440r, 54.7; mp170(12), 1981r, 53.5; Hartford; mp169(13), 360f, 56.3; mp168-166 1/2, 419r, 50.5; Winsford, mp165 1/2(16.5), 220r, 43.4; mp164 just off a mile+ of 300r, 38. Gentle rising grades to mp162 1/2, 43.6. It appeared Kevin had let 5043 run to manage the water. Doubt if Simon had to do much firing either which must have pleased him.

From mp162 1/4(19 3/4) it was level track all the way to Crewe. We passed Crewe Coal Yard at 23 and slowed to 8.5 at the final signal gantry. Fortunately we were not held there as is the norm and we crossed the running lines to get to Platform 12 where we arrived at 1850, 2 minutes early.

We didn't wander down to the front as it was raining and I had a 2 hour+ drive ahead of me. A member of the Support Crew went past us with the double standpipe for watering. Unfortunately it's nearer the north end of the platform so needs a long pipe run.

We'd had a seriously enjoyable day out with 5043, unassisted from Carnforth to Carlisle and from Carlisle to Crewe as promised. We passed 4,000 mainline miles behind 5043 on the return.

Thanks to Michael and all at VT involved in the organisation and running of a proper steam hauled train. 5043 looked immaculate and performed well all day. Great to see a Castle on an unassisted run over the WCML.

Thanks to both footplate crews who did an excellent job up front. Both firemen, Sam and Simon worked really hard and did an excellent job providing the steam for Alastair and Kevin to produce a fine performance from 5043 on the banks and elsewhere.

Thanks to Alex and Bruce our guards; the Support Crew; the Train Manager and on train stewards.

And many thanks to Network Rail for letting us run on the big railway and for excellent train regulation when things went pear shaped for us in the morning.

'Cardiff' John was happy that we were in plenty of time for him to catch the 1910 TfW Service to Cardiff. The 3 car 197 left 8 late as it was delayed on Crewe approach for some reason, but ran into Cardiff right time.

Judith and John were staying the night at the Premier Inn so walked with us to the Car Park. We had a decent run down the M6, M5, M50, A40 and 'the lane' despite the rain and we got home in a tad over 2 hours.

We're not doing anything now until the 30th June's Shakespeare Express from Worcester unless WCR get an exemption for their Mk1s and are able to provide RTC's customers with proper steam hauled trains. We're not holding our breath.

For those interested I'll drop the full timings in later.

 

Great report. Regarding the Shap climb and comments elsewhere regarding the work the 47 was doing pushing Tanmere on the WCME, I was at Shap Wells videoing both trains from a fixed set-up, with my camera in exactly the same place for both runs. When I reviewd the video I put on Youtube, it was noticeable how much quicker Tangmere was than 5043 for the same section, so I ran a test.

I timed both trains from the moment the loco entered the right hand edge of the frame until it passed the last overhead support just before going out of shot. The timings were interesting. 5043 did it in 83 seconds, Tangmere took only 53 seconds for the same distance, over 50% quicker.

I don't know if anybody bothered timing the Tangmere diesel combo, but just scaling up (I appreciate that this 'straight line graph' approach is wildly inaccurate) and going off your speed of 36.5mph at MP 36, Tangmere, with more than a 'little' help from behind was potentially doing something like 57!

EDIT. I've just had another, more accurate look at my calculation. I pulled up the respective videos on Photoshop and calculated the timing by the number of frames between the last three OH supports. The trainspotter in me coming out. 5043 was 198 frames, 34067 was 132 frames for the same distance, so I reckon Tangmere's speed when it passed MP 36 (and me) would have been 36.5 x 198/132 = 55 mph!

 

Fantastic to see 5043 on Saturday, and I haven't seen Shap so busy for years. I counted ca. 40 cars at Salterwath, and 40 at Scout Green. Assuming similar numbers at Greenholme, Shap Wells etc., and an average of say 1.5 people per car, you could reckon on there being perhaps 300 on Shap to see it.

At the same time, pay on the day seats were still available for the train. But if everyone who went out to photo, video or see the train on Shap alone gave a tenner each to Vintage Trains, we could add £3000 to the run (+Gift Aid, +folk at Oxenholme/Grayrigg/Penrith/Carlisle). A very small price for such a fantastic occasion?

https://vintagetrains.co.uk/make-a-donation/

 

Thanks for that, really interesting to see how it went and compare with 2009 when I was on board. Couple of small points;

• 2009 was load 9 plus POB, there was no GUV in the consist,
• regarding the WCR 47, its become the norm (I assume as it makes the shunt at Carnforth easier/quicker) for them to run her down onto the Morecambe north spur before the train arrives so she can come back up the down main to couple on the back when the stock arrives at Carnforth.

Oh an Albert Hall was 4983 (sorry) and in checking that I seem to have entirely missed that Tyseley have suggested that they are overhauling Rood Ashton Hall as an oil burner???? (but that's possibly for somewhere else!)

Thanks again.

 

Interested in 1020 Shireman’s comment that “Castles don’t really like long climbs…”. I thought that 5043 had proved that in their fully developed form, with such go-faster accoutrements as double chimneys and 4-row superheaters, Castles have nothing to fear from long climbs.

In this regard, it was a great shame that the much-anticipated Castle vs Beattock encounter promised by the ill-fated ‘Castle to Scotland’ tour never happened due to the weather necessitating diesel assistance. There’s some unfinished business on this account.

 

Is there any word about another trip with both Castles? I missed both of them in March and May last year, for different reasons.

 

Be nice to see them try and run the Coastal Explorer again as well, Castle past the bottom of the garden would be very agreeable!

 

Quite! Their modified form of you like was done for hills! Put it this way non of the castles I’ve seen seem to mind a good gradient to tackle!

 

Kev Cronin who was driving on the return journey told me just before departure from Carlisle that alas Beattock is unlikely to happen with the Castles which is a great shame.

 

Great report as always Shireman! Having spoken to both Alastair and Kev whilst at Carlisle on Saturday both of them sign to Carlisle via Shap but if the S&C was to happen again a route conductor would be required. I must say I'm surprised your not doing the tour on the 10th/11th May which I think will be the event of the year by quite some distance.

 

For those who like to look at the timing sets I've included the full outward and return runs here in pdf form.

 

Thanks. The 10th/11th May itinerary just didn't do it for me. Don't like overnight stays. Did the really enjoyable 2014 variant with 5029 from Westbury to Plymouth and back to Temple Meads. My kind of tour. One day; 50 year anniversary; on the right day; and with a noisy 2 row superheat single chimney Castle. OK it wasn't one of the locos involved in 1964 and 7029 did the Plymouth to Temple Meads leg but I'm not a great fan of the double chimney variants. 5043 is OK as at least it's a proper Castle built by the GWR in 1936 if modified by BR in 1958. Us not going and booking a 4+4 in Standard when only Di and I would have travelled means 8 other folk can go. I see Standard Class only has 3 seats available.

 

Ooops. Remembered the load was 10 but had no notes of what. Got 4920 in the back of my mind as some B***** sent it to Japan.As you say, an oil burner is for another thread.

 

Responded here. Tyseley Locomotive Works and VT Matters