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The 10A Allocation

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by GWR4707, Apr 8, 2019.

  1. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

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    24L, 11A, 10A? We know what the locos carry so that's how it's known. What is true is that since preservation, the locomotives that have been allocated there or have been temporary visitors there must be the longest list in the UK. That's basically down to one person......some legacy.
     
  2. 60017

    60017 Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    Yes, the man who started it all. Peter Beet.
     
  3. std tank

    std tank Part of the furniture

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    Yes John, got to agree with your statement. Peter was a great man , who is sadly missed.
     
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  4. Robin

    Robin Member

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    UKSteam suggests that the industrials still at 10A are:

    Barclay 0-6-0F 1572/1917 “Lancaster”
    Barclay 0-4-0ST 2134/1942 “WTT”
    Barclay 0-4-0ST 2230/1947 “Cooke & Nuttall”
    Barclay 0-4-0F 1572/1917 2268/1949 “Glaxo”
    Peckett 0-4-0ST 2027/1942 “Wee Willie”
    WC&I 0-6-0ST /1887 “Lindsay” (mentioned in that loco’s thread as possibly moving on)
     
  5. acorb

    acorb Well-Known Member

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    Not quite correct. Black 5's and Halls are theoretically now allowed 65mph subject to individual vehicle acceptance (VAB) approval. B1's are now limited to 70mph, however, Mayflower's owner wishes to restore it's 75mph limit. Individual locos can apply for higher limits through their VAB, such as Tornado did, which remains cleared for 90mph.
    The Duchess, A1 and A4's can now be cleared for 80mph if they have fixed headlamps (but not Merchant Navy's, which I found odd!), but are limited to 75mph when hauling mk 1 stock. This is even stranger as the same Mk1 stock is cleared for 90/100 mph when hauled by diesel / electric.
    Confused? You bet!
     
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  6. Sheff

    Sheff Resident of Nat Pres

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    Thanks. I was typing from memory - dangerous at the best of times!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  7. class8mikado

    class8mikado Part of the furniture

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    Having looked at the RSSB document - a formula for loco speeds is alluded to but not detailed but seems to be roughly
    Permitted speed = wheel diameter in inches rounded up to the nearest 5mph. less 5mph for 4-6-0's ( due to proportionately more weight on drivers ? hammer blow ?). less 5 mph for two cylinders. less 5mph for pre grouping or early grouping Era locos with other factors such as piston stroke/ speed and balancing also taken into account
    So A4, Duchess, Pepp A1 80mph
    Scotsman, all the Large wheel 4-6-0's and 6ft 2 inch ( Bulleids, DoG) pacifics = 75mph ( an exception having been made for Britannias even though they have only 2 cylinders)
    6FT 2 INCH 4-6-0's B1, Std 5 ? and SirLamiel =70
    Black 5 and Hall = 65
    and so on and so forth
    Applying this to new builds would allude to P2 = 75, Patriot =75 ( Just) Clan =70 (unless its allowed the same dispensation as Brits = 75) V4=70 ?
     
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  8. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

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    This all seems like a sensible attempt to bring logic and engineering to the speed limit regime although as we know, individual loco owners may also have their own overlay of loco handling/speed guidance as seems to be the case with the Duchess at present.

    With regard to the 10A allocation, apart from the stretch of WCML over which they operate where a loco with a turn of speed is helpful, cross country and other routes around the north west don't really require fast running so the fleet is fairly flexible in that respect. Of course, the moment that WC sends one of their locos down south, that situation changes with tight paths in many areas.
     
  9. Victor

    Victor Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    Aaah, no need for concern there, WC locos can manage anything that's put in front of em, they're used to a varied flexible work load.:Happy:
     
  10. Enterprise

    Enterprise Part of the furniture

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    Makes a lot of sense if WC stands for West Country!
     
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  11. Victor

    Victor Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    :oops: Ooops, West Coast Railway Company.:D
     
  12. martin1656

    martin1656 Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    stands for reason, doesn't it, gauge friendly capable of a good turn of speed ( handy when theres a fast up your tail) and no matter how much you hang on the drawbar, don't sit down very often these days rail head conditions permitting of course .
     
  13. class8mikado

    class8mikado Part of the furniture

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    Really surprises me that Bulleid didnt put rubber tyres on them, wouldnt work ? you say... that never stopped him
     
  14. 30854

    30854 Part of the furniture

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    Point of order: That'd already been done on pre-war railcars on the GNRI (several early ones, at least some converted from conventional buses) and LMS (the Michelin contraption*) .... and worked OK in service. Jus'sayin'. :)

    * there's still one of these serviceable in Madagascar .... hireable too, if you're ever down that way.
     
  15. Victor

    Victor Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    Rubber tyres ??


    Paris Metro
     
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  16. 30854

    30854 Part of the furniture

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    56614b6a523c7309cd957d0eba620667.jpg.cf.jpg
    It's one uploaded by pinterest[dot]com.
     
  17. GWR4707

    GWR4707 Resident of Nat Pres

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    After their experiences with Tangmere, not sure WCRC would necessarily agree with you, although to be fair the rebuilt ones with the foibles ironed out don't seem too bad.
     
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  18. 30854

    30854 Part of the furniture

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    Wasn't that down to a cock-up with a non-spec split pin in the end? Plus, '92 did pretty well on it's mainline stint, way back when ... and did so without detuning. Roll on 21C11!
     
  19. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    Not much good with track circuits, though.
     
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  20. mdewell

    mdewell New Member

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    I would have thought that would cause problems (durability if nothing else) with traditional brakes working directly on the tyres. So some other braking arrangment (disc brakes?) would likely be required.
     

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