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Swanage Railway General Discussion

Discussion in 'Heritage Railways & Centres in the UK' started by Rumpole, Oct 10, 2012.

  1. Steve

    Steve Part of the furniture Friend

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    Can't speak for 6695 but I never had or heard of any complaints with 6619, whose valves were pretty much spot on.. 6619 was underpowered for our (NYMR) diners but 4277 & 5224 were regarded as last resort locos for dining trains because they tended to spill the soup/wine/coffee.
     
  2. ady

    ady New Member

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    6695 does induce a 'sea' motion on the train. And its not just her a volunteer I know at Llangollen said that when 5643 was there, she had the same problem!!!
     
  3. ady

    ady New Member

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    maybe next year we have a short 'vintage' set available. :) the only issue where to find the money to do the rest of the ex. SR carriages...
     
  4. Gwenllian2001

    Gwenllian2001 New Member

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    It's not a 'problem', it's a characteristic of the class. They've always been like that. It's something to do with the inclined cylinders. Just look at the size of the balance weights on the wheels.
     
  5. Steve

    Steve Part of the furniture Friend

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    Most cylinders are inclined; except on GW locos, that is.
     
  6. The Saggin' Dragon

    The Saggin' Dragon Part of the furniture Staff Member Moderator

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    I seem to remember reading somewhere that the way to mitigate the fore-and-aft motion was to have the (coupling) shackle a little less tight than usual?
     
  7. matt41312

    matt41312 New Member

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    We certainly found this worked on the industrials at the Spa Valley. Fonmon and Lady Ingrid are notorious for it and this method allowed the engines to waddle but this wasn't transferred to the train behind.

    Matt
     
  8. Ann Clark

    Ann Clark New Member

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    How she is driven seems to be the answer in one direction but like other locos when she is drifting she shuttles
     
  9. gwr4090

    gwr4090 Member

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    It is nothing to do with the inclined cylinders. It is all to do with how the wheels are balanced. All 2 cylinder locos can generate this problem to varying degrees. I recall thet the Britannias were particluarly bad until they were rebalanced. It is not possible to balance out all the dynamic forces due to the reciprocating motion on 2 cylinder engines. There is always a compromise between the residual vertical forces which cause hammerblow on the one hand, and the residual horizontal forces which cause this shuffling motion on the other. The GW often balanced for low hammerblow at the expense of fore-aft motion. The effect of the latter can be noticed especially at speeds when it coincides with a natural resonance of the buffer/coupling system - unfortunately this often happens at around 25-30 mph. If I recall correctly, there were two or three different balancing configurations used on the 56xx, partly to reduce any discomfort to passengers. Four cylinder engines generally don't have this problem as the motion is inherently better balanced. Three cylinder engines lie somewhere in between. Incidentally high hammer blow can be very dangerous, and can actually cause the wheels to lift clear of the track in extreme cases.

    David
     
  10. Southernman99

    Southernman99 New Member Friend

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    The problem is apparent with most 2 cyl locos. Unfortunately, the GW slung two great dustbins on the front, which if you watch either any outside cylinder GW loco start with a heavy load you will see the cylinders dip with each stroke. Once on the road the dipping stops but you then hit the frequency of the fore and aft movement.

    I can remember hitching a ride behind 2857 on the GW limited. Customers had the catch their soup because of the fore and aft motion. I add it wasnt how the engine was being driven but because of the natural forces at work.
     
  11. Gwenllian2001

    Gwenllian2001 New Member

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    You may well be correct but it was noticeable that the Taff 'A's did not suffer from this problem but ran like the proverbial Swiss watches. The outside cylinder 51XXs also had a noticeable fore and aft motion but not nearly so pronounced as the 56XXs.
     
  12. Rumpole

    Rumpole Member

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    In a previous post I mentioned the Driver Experience goods train. While this isn't my photo, I just wanted to link to http://www.flickr.com/photos/davidpea/8687640631/ to give an impression of what the set currently looks like.

    The set is normally out a couple of times a month; not too bad to look at, even if you're not lucky enough to be driving it!
     
  13. paulhitch

    paulhitch Guest

    I am really out of my comfort zone here but as I understand it the G.W.R. o-6-2T's were prone to axlebox trouble because of the stresses put upon them by the (over?)large cylinders. In order to reduce this problem they were re-balanced on Stroudley's system whereby the crank throws are parallel to the coupling rod throws instead of being at 180 degrees to them as is normal with inside cylinders. By these means the stress through the axleboxes was reduced.

    Of course, the balance weights had to be larger and if the calculations were not quite right much surging resulted. The 56 and 66xx classes were intended principally for freight so this did not matter. The engine on the Swanage Railway was abominably (and I do mean "abominably") rough on the occasion I rode behind her and I do hope these problems can be rectified.

    Of course I may well have got this completely wrong and, if so, I apologise if I have.

    P.H.
     
  14. David P

    David P New Member

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    Hah! Thanks @SwanageNick for spotting this. Just before the heavens opened at Corfe on Saturday. Yep - I've got a few squirrelled away at http://www.flickr.com/photos/davidpea/sets/72157629775139975/ - keep trying to find new angles. Too rarely get round to posting any here.

    Is there an easy way of finding what's scheduled (and which way round)? It was a pleasant surprise to find 34028 on Saturday looking in good form.

    David P.
     
  15. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    Interestingly, as I recall, when Maunsell rebuilt the Stroudley E1 0-6-0Ts to E1R 0-6-2Ts for passenger use on the North Devon and Cornwall Junction, there were frequent complaints of rough riding, and eventually they were rebalanced along more conventional lines with crank and coupling rod throws opposite rather than adjacent!

    Tom
     
  16. Rumpole

    Rumpole Member

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    I have been discussing recently getting something put on the website about which loco is in use, but this is still in progress so for the moment it is probably easiest just to post on here or on Twitter and I'll respond as soon as I can. Certainly for this week I can say that 80104 is planned to be in traffic until Sunday, with Eddystone out on a Sunday lunch train and then planned to be in for next week (until the start of the Diesel Gala on Friday 10 May). Obviously things can change in the event of failure or suchlike, and if that is the case I'll update.

    In terms of which way locos face, this is very much dictated by the run round loop and watering facilities at Swanage. Because we were running shorter trains up until recently we were able to turn 80104, but with where the water tower is currently this means that when we run 5 coach trains (as we will be pretty much from now until the autumn) the tank engines have to face Swanage, and the tender locos have to face Norden. Otherwise we would need to go to shed every trip for water, which as the shed also doubles as our maintenance facility would seriously limit what could be done during the day.

    It is possible to turn locos down here, but its not something we tend to do too frequently. It is planned though to make a bit of a feature of this at this year's steam gala...
     
  17. David P

    David P New Member

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    Thanks - that's really helpful in relation to both planning, and understanding the background.
     
  18. 45076

    45076 Member

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    As its the Yellow timetable every day until Friday(2 Steam) its 34028 and 80104 working.
    Might be of use to anyone visiting the area during this weeks school half term.
    Both locos performing well today and all trains on time.
     
  19. cymroglan

    cymroglan New Member

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    I'd love to know what's working on Saturday 1st June, as I'm likely to be nearby that day. Thanks!
     
  20. Rumpole

    Rumpole Member

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    Sorry for the lack of response; unfortunately didn't notice it in time before I went on holiday. If you didn't go down there, it was 34028 on the service train and 80104 on the Driver Experience, with 30053 as the spare engine. 34070 is also now available for traffic after repaint, and was out and about on a test run on Friday.
     

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