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STEEL, STEAM & STARS II - Llangollen Rly - 18 to 26 April 09

Discussion in 'Galas and Events' started by lil Bear, Jul 5, 2008.

  1. tractionenginedriver

    tractionenginedriver New Member

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    Just slightly off topic, when the Llangollen extends to Corwen wheres the station going to be? or are they going to get the original station back off ifor williams trailers?
     
  2. lewis.maddox

    lewis.maddox Member

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    Where have you got that idea from ? #-o[/quote:1knmfer3]
    Because if Llangollen hasn't extended then there won't be a gala. But i'm persuming there will be another SSS in 2 years at a different location.
     
  3. Martin Perry

    Martin Perry Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator Friend

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    Discussed elsewhere on the forum but basically due to the removal of a low bridge between the station site and the existing trackbed (and the fact that it is occupied by Ifor Williams), there are currently no plans to rebuild to the original station. The planned site for the new station is here
     
  4. Andy N

    Andy N New Member

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    Where have you got that idea from ? #-o[/quote:1by92qd3]
    Because if Llangollen hasn't extended then there won't be a gala. But i'm persuming there will be another SSS in 2 years at a different location.[/quote:1by92qd3]

    Steel Steam and Stars isn't an exact 2 yearly thing..
     
  5. Martin Perry

    Martin Perry Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator Friend

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    Where did you pick up that particular piece of information from?
     
  6. jimbo

    jimbo New Member

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    I think the lads could do with a good rest now & put their energy's into getting on with the Grange. After all thats what its all about. The galas are great I know , but they are a means to an end. An SSS3 to Corwen is something to look forward to in a few years.
     
  7. tractionenginedriver

    tractionenginedriver New Member

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    Ahh thanks for that saggin dragon
     
  8. Thompson1706

    Thompson1706 Part of the furniture

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    I would think that this Gala has considerably raised the profile of the 6880 group & the Llangollen Railway and will hopefully encourage more shareholders to subscribe to the Grange project. I've seen plenty of quality photos on this forum (the ones with the fog were exceptional !) and hope that the photographers who attended also spent money riding the trains. If you didn't, get rid of your guilt by sending a cheque to the 6880 fund. If we keep the momentum going we might have a Grange running at S.S.& S 4.

    Bob.
     
  9. lil Bear

    lil Bear Part of the furniture

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    Well don't persume / presume. There is a pm function, please use it if you want to know information instead of posting complete crap that some people will take as gospel.

    Steel, Steam & Stars is not just 6880 Society. It is the 6880 Society AND Llangollen Railway. Without the two none of what has been achieved would have been possible, and we are forever thankful of the volunteers who gave up their free time to help make it the success it was.

    We may have had the imagination, vision and determination to make it work, but we needed the working members' effort/skill to make it work as well as it it did. That is why we ran the members special, it cost us a significant amount of money just to run that one train and provide food, but to pay for all the effort put in over the 9 days would have cost a lot more.

    As I have said previously, SSS2 took 2 years of planning and organising. This time myself and the rest of the Planning team would like a rest if a similar amount of effort is required for a third whenever that will be. The location though is obvious, it can only be one place.

    For now though enjoy all the photographs/videos from this event, we certainly are. When the time comes for SSS3 we will let you know. It is quite hard to keep us quiet when we want to be heard.
     
  10. Flying Fiver

    Flying Fiver Member

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    Ok, for all those that know me, are you sitting down, good, (inhales a deep breath!),
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    can we keep the dukedog!
    :smt002
     
  11. richards

    richards Part of the furniture

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    ... but what could the Bluebell have in exchange?

    Richard
     
  12. Thompson1706

    Thompson1706 Part of the furniture

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    Well, we have got a nice class 46 doing nothing !

    Bob.
     
  13. 6880rules

    6880rules Member

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    I would rather not keep the Dukedog and I am quite happy to send it back to the Bluebell

    I await the the response and I am happy to explain why
     
  14. 5944

    5944 Resident of Nat Pres

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    The cost of the tarpaulin between the cab and the tender?
     
  15. Martin Perry

    Martin Perry Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator Friend

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    You don't like loco's that are built inside out?
     
  16. Andy N

    Andy N New Member

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    Go on
     
  17. 6880rules

    6880rules Member

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    Ok I am in doubt that 9017 in black at Llangollen has been a huge success this is due to the fact that this visit has been well overdue for many years, eleven photocharters proves this.

    If 9017 was to stay at Llangollen for ever then she just becomes part of the working fleet like 7822 the exclusivity is gone 9017 becomes an everyday Llangollen Loco.

    Marketing and keeping a preserved railway interesting is no easy task, 9017 appearing at Llangollen is marketable but only on a short time hopefully in four - five years basis.

    This was not my view but when mentioned to me it made sense

    keep it up you sleeve for another gala
     
  18. Fred Kerr

    Fred Kerr Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    It would appear that enthusiasts still haven't learned the rules of the market in which they act despite the 2 SSS Galas which presented the facts to them in the form of rare engines appearing at Galas.

    The role of visiting engines has been to generate visitors by providing a locomotive / locomotives which the public and enthusiasts would be unlikely to see in the hope that the number of extra visitors would more than cover the cost of bringing the locomotive to the line. In this context the heavy costs involved means that (a) the gamble has to be restricted to one or two engines only to support the home-based fleet and (b) the income from photography charters becomes an important element in the calculations re generated income.

    As 6880rules has stated it is the rarity value of the locomotives which attracts vistors thus the first SSS Gala was the gamble which brought a large number of rare visitors with a chance to provide both a larger variety and a number of unusual combinations to operate trains then topped off with the Grand Cavalcade as a Grand Finale.

    The visiting locomotives from that Gala were mainly GWR engines supported by BB 34081 92 Squadron so that the Locofest could help recreate a GWR programme that attracted sufficient visitors to justify the initial £30,000 movement costs plus the other costs that needed a lot of visitors to break even - which it did.

    More importantly the railway - especially its volunteer crews - committed themselves to the gamble and worked many unpaid hours looking after the visitors ( both personal and mechanical ) to establish a reputation that is hard to earn but easy to lose.

    The latest SSS has not only repeated this success but has used the reputation earned from SSS1 to raise the visiting locomotive pool to a new height - albeit at greater cost since visiting locomotives have to be brought in by road - and no doubt the 6880 Group is grateful to the local population for their support as the inconvenience of the moves must surely affect the town quite a lot.

    On this occasion the charters were an important part of the costings albeit geared to the return of Dukedog 9017 in unlined black and grateful thanks must be given to both the Bluebell for allowing it and Llangollen / 6880 for creating it and the photo charters for funding it with a reported £6000 + being reported as the ball park figure at the lineside.

    The second gamble this time was to operate for 9 days instead of the original 4 with a comprehensive timetable that took over 12 months to produce, that operated many unusual and never-to-be recreated pairings such as the pair of unlined black engines ( 5526 + 9017 )and the pairing of LNER Green ( 246 + 1306 ) and the return of the brakevan rides behind some unexpected motive power.

    The late bonus was the kind offer of 6100 Royal Scot which attracted many - if only to see what all the fuss was about re livery - and its inclusion in the pool was only one of the many highlights from a week of prolonged action that must surely have kept even the most critical of linesiders happy bunnies.

    To top the event off with a cavalcade that entered the Carrog arena to a burst of sun and a rainbow was something that no-one could predict but it set the seal on an event that garnered the success it deserved.

    BUT .. it only succeeded because the owners were happy to bring their locomotives and because the volunteer crews put in the effort to work the long hours ( 15 hour days from some volunteers ) that the timetable required and the paying public supported by travelling on.

    More important howver - and the nub of 6880 rules argument - is that the Gala succeeded because the locomotives were rare at Llangollen and the example of 7822 Foxcote Manor is appropriate. Although one of the home fleet with a good reputation for reliability few people visit the line to see 7822 as its "just another engine" but if the Dukedog could visit and provide the "Cambrian" pairing then a short burst of interest would ensue but soon evaporate as the pairing became "just another working".

    The success of SSS2 was the provision of such rare workings albeit for a short visit but the effort required to obtain one locomotive - let alone the 6 that were actually provided - and the time needed to produce a timetable to show them off to best advantage means that any future event will need much time to organise.

    The success of SSS2 was the rarity value of some of its visitors and - as 6880 rules confirms - whilst nice to see once or twice the rarity soon loses its attactiveness once it becomes commonplace.

    The moral ? The enthusiast is subject to the Law of Diminishing Returns and has to accept that while something may be attractive at first, once it becomes commonplace people will lose interest and support will drift away. Since the Heritage Movement thrives on change then the policy of "ringing the changes" will become more rather than less common if the movement and heritage lines are to survive.
     
  19. Flange bandit!

    Flange bandit! New Member

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    Well said Fred, i reckon you have it bang on there mate.
     
  20. GreggyB

    GreggyB New Member

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    Well done Fred, I have to agree, i think you have it spot on there mate.

    I have been really busy with school work and such, but will post on here when my pictures are up and viewable.
     

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