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Saphos Trains 'Golden Arrow' - 26/10/19

Discussion in 'What's Going On' started by jackshepherd, Jul 31, 2019.

  1. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    It’s probably closer to 35 - 37 tons per coach for a Mark 1 - so there was never a hope...

    I’ve done those sorts of calculations before (I remember a similar instance with a Black 5 coming to grief on Parkstone Bank some years ago). I wonder what an acceptable margin is - even on your calculation, the required TE is about 92% of the theoretically available, which if nothing else is only going to be available at dead slow speed and with railhead conditions that allow that force to be applied. I wonder what an acceptable limit would be - my hunch is that once you start straying above 70% or so you are starting to ask for trouble. Surely train planning should not be about what can be achieved in optimal conditions, but what can be achieved even when conditions are adverse.

    Tom
     
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  2. Sheff

    Sheff Well-Known Member

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    Taking 35 tons you've already blown it. As this software is free to use and appears pretty acurate why aren't TOC's etc using it?
     
  3. gricerdon

    gricerdon Member

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    I don’t agree with that. First the Brit restarted the train on the 1 in 60 after sanding after it had slipped to a stand. It wasn’t beaten by the gradient. Also Jim Clarke told me the Brit would have been fine on normal rail conditions. See my column in HR
     
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  4. Bulleid Pacific

    Bulleid Pacific Member

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    Which is precisely what has been said several times by you, myself and others on the train in question. However, doesn't stop the gossip.
     
  5. Deepgreen

    Deepgreen Member

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    Yes, but take away the 1 in 60 element and the problem also goes. The gradient was the deciding factor in the conditions at the time. I don't think anyone's claimed that a 'Brit' couldn't take 12 up a 1 in 60 bank in perfect rail conditions, but it would have been tricky work even then.
     
  6. thickmike

    thickmike New Member

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    Jim Clarke is now an experienced steam driver, mostly on the ex-SR lines. He had an excellent mentor in his Dad, Don, who was arguably the doyen of steam drivers when he retired and subsequently became a TI. If Jim couldn't get them up Bearsted bank from 20 mph at the bottom I doubt anyone could. Having waded through 12 pages on this site there is still no clarity over who made the decision to run the train with a Class 7 and 12 on. Jim was in an impossible position on the day - decide not to go and cancel the train? He had to try and make the best of it - it would have been deeply unfair to put him and the unsung fireman (who made sure there was always enough steam) in the position of deciding to cancel the train.

    I don't know much about LSL but I do know that if I was the NR Area/Regional manager (whatever they are called nowadays), I would be thinking "no more steam around Kent in the Autumn - whoever's fault it might have been - can't take the risk of damage to my career".

    That's not what steam needs and whilst I am hugely sympathetic to all the passengers who had a disappointing and disrupted day, with respect, I care far more about steam next year and the year after. If we are not careful it will be nothing south of the Cumbrian Mountain Express.

    Best wishes to all for a steamy 2020 (Norwich here I come)

    Mike
     
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