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Sandringham New Build(s)

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by D6332found, Jan 29, 2017.

  1. pete2hogs

    pete2hogs Member

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    It wasn't actually a Gresley design although he bore the responsibility (and no doubt insisted on 3 cylinders with his conjugated gear and the general outline being compatible with the 'Gresley Look'. ) . They were designed by NBL. And depending on what drawings are available to the replica builders one needs to bear in mind two things - the first batch of frames were insufficiently strong and had to be replaced in short order and also the new build will not be subject to the drastic weight restrictions of the GER. One wonders if the civil engineers were ever told about the stronger replacement frames.
     
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  2. Flying Phil

    Flying Phil Well-Known Member

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    In view of the, fairly well known, problems that the "Patriot" group have had...
    ..Gav 106 writing...".Unfortunately things changed, management changed and the regular two guys who always worked on our loco at llan we put on other things, there was a variety of people doing work, instructed to do so in a certain way that wasn't correct. And may I point out that while we may be the only group that has been public about this (rightly or wrongly, but when you are spending public money you have to make a statement of some kind) we are not the only group to have been affected."
    It might be prudent for the B17 SLT team to issue some reassurance to their supporters that all is still good with regard to work done for them?
     
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  3. Gav106

    Gav106 Well-Known Member

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    To be fair they already have from what I understand. On top of that there hasn't really been that much done on the frames of the B17 up to now.
     
  4. Flying Phil

    Flying Phil Well-Known Member

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    Posted from another NP thread
    According to the latest B17 Spirit of Sandringham new build newsletter -

    "Yesterday when in conversation with the Chairman of the Llangollen Railway, we were informed that a restructuring of the business had been announced, to be effective immediately given their previous financial difficulties of the last two years and the restrictive nature for Wales in relation to the pandemic. Although ‘Engineering’ work had looked promising with the arrival of 9F No. 92212 for major overhaul at the end of March, this engine has since been removed from site. As a consequence four members of the Engineering Team were unfortunately made redundant as of the end of last week. These same people are also certified to work on Spirit of Sandringham. Thus it was explained that Llangollen Engineering can no longer provide people with the appropriate skills and competencies to work on B17 contracts. Retained staff (3) will only be assigned to boiler checks/maintenance and loco servicing for the railway’s own fleet of engines. The Llangollen Railway have expressed their sadness and apologised for this outcome. Therefore B17SLT are left with no other choice than to arrange transfer of the mainframe structure and associated items to another site where construction can eventually continue. A survey of possible sites in the East of England and further afield is being made including colleagues advice involved with Tornado and the P2 projects. Heavy haulage contractors, S.A. Smith of Biggleswade (Beds) have indicated a willingness to collect and move our assets from Llangollen to another site when one is identified and appropriate agreement reached with the host/owner. This is a priority. As we know, work at Llangollen was complete with no outstanding items to be delivered. Timing wise we are preparing to commence ordering first steel castings from William Cooks of Sheffield for the rolling chassis but delivery is to be the end of the year which allows time to relocate assuming a suitable site is found. Details about these issues will appear in the August edition of Steam Railway."
     
  5. 240P15

    240P15 Well-Known Member

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    Just some personal thoughts about this and please note that this is not any form of criticism.

    Since the A1 Trust/ P2 projcect already have their favour on LNER locomotives I think they could be a good candidate to finish this project. Maybe also the parts made for the other static(?) B17 could be included in the building progress?

    The B17 s are some great looking engines which it could be fantastic to see recreated some day.

    Knut:)
     
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  6. Gav106

    Gav106 Well-Known Member

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    Bearing in mind the situation that we are in there should definitely be some thoughts about groups merging. The A1 would be a fantastic fit for the Sandringham, especially as the drawings have all been done by the same person.

    If not then I think the best thing for the B17 might be to think about building their own shed. This is not a criticism of the B17, but they have been saving most of their money for the last year for the casting of the driving wheels. Then there will be lots more to save and spend on the machining and pressing of the wheels onto the axles etc etc, before there will then be money to spend on the chassis again. So if its going to be a while before much work takes place on the chassis there is probably going to be a reluctance from any company to accept the frames for a while.
     
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  7. Flying Phil

    Flying Phil Well-Known Member

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    The B17 Spirit of Sandringham locomotive (Frames etc) is now moving to CTL in Sheffield. This is where the Hengist Project (BR Std class 6 Pacific) are based, so a really positive outcome.
     
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  8. Bugler_John

    Bugler_John New Member

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    The entire static chassis (therefore including the frames) were checked and passed for Main Line approval in February 2019 (see B17SLT website), so there isn't anything more to be done at the moment. Since then, all efforts have been on designing all the components for the Rolling Chassis, the first part of which was ordered this week - the patterns for the 6 Horn Blocks. From info I have, other parts will be ordered shortly.
     
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  9. Bugler_John

    Bugler_John New Member

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    Certainly an excellent choice for a new home. Many of the castings will probably come from William Cook Castings (like those already on the chassis); William Cooks are also based in Sheffield, so very local for transporting the finished product. There is room to store the two tender chassis, so all the B17 SLT assets will finally be in one location - the website and the Facebook pages show track components already arriving at CTL Seal to get ready for the tenders. And with Hengist already there, CTL Seal have had 3 years working with one new-build and their team; a second locomotive will build on this expertise and also enable ideas to flow between the two new-build teams.
     
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  10. class8mikado

    class8mikado Member

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    Is it really three Years ? time flies...
     
  11. melp

    melp New Member

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    B17s and Clans - at the same site - I hope they can produce the calibre of improvements wrought on the DoG - another lame duck in service - but proven to be a world-beater when developed properly in preservation
     
  12. Kylchap

    Kylchap Member

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    I'm certainly looking forward to seeing the Duke back in action, I've only ever seen it once in operation. Definitely one I want to travel behind.
     
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  13. pete2hogs

    pete2hogs Member

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    Nothing wrong with the B17's as traction units - just they tended to deteriorate relatively quickly after overhaul. They disappeared quite early because a) Britannia's - and hence surplus newer B1's. b) Electrification. c) The GE being designated as the first part of BR to eliminate steam entirely.
     
  14. Wozzy18

    Wozzy18 New Member

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    The B17 frames just beat the Welsh lockdown and have now left Llangollen and arrived at CTL Seal's premises in Sheffield. The two tenders had arrived a couple of weeks earlier. (Photos courtesy of B17 Steam Locomotive Trust's Facebook page)

    Frames A.jpg Frames B.jpg Frames C.jpg Tender 1.jpg
     
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  15. class8mikado

    class8mikado Member

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    Is everything in place between the frames ? doesnt seem to be much by way of stretchers (of course the firebox and inside motion has to fit in somewhere)... My interest in this project has increased a little since i got one in N Gauge, looking forward to the 'webinar'
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2020
  16. Bugler_John

    Bugler_John New Member

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    Yes, everything is in place, from the front buffer beam to the drag box at the end. It is a compete chassis (more than just frames) and also main line certified. The trust, with its new location, is poised to move forward with making it roll. Some parts are already on order.

    But the trust should be complemented on a superbly planned move. From the notification to move the tenders in late June, and then the news about Llangollen Engineering in July, the Trust has searched for, and found, an excellent new home. In that time, the agreement was reached with CTL Seal, track panels built at the new site, the tenders moved from the Mid Norfolk and the static chassis moved from Llangollen to Sheffield, arriving two days ago.
     
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  17. Flying Phil

    Flying Phil Well-Known Member

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    Good to see the frames and tenders in their new home.
    Looking forward to seeing this progress......But I still like the option of making it into a B17/5 ...Mini A4!;)
     
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  18. Matt37401

    Matt37401 Part of the furniture

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    We’re not going to hear the end of this one until it happens are we? :p;)
     
  19. Bugler_John

    Bugler_John New Member

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    I like the streamlined version as well. And the option is always there. But first you have to have a basic B17 up and running! And yes, I do know the cab and the tender sides are different as well. But until you have a loco with cylinders, motion, boiler and a lot else, they are the same underneath the casing.
     
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  20. The Green Howards

    The Green Howards Part of the furniture Friend

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    I await Simon Martin buying the P2 frames from the Doncaster team and using them as the basis for an A2/2...
     
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