If you register, you can do a lot more. And become an active part of our growing community. You'll have access to hidden forums, and enjoy the ability of replying and starting conversations.

S&C Pathfinder Charter - Aug 2018: Now 16/3/19 and with 60163

Discussion in 'What's Going On' started by Big Al, Jul 24, 2018.

  1. iancawthorne

    iancawthorne Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2010
    Messages:
    1,503
    Likes Received:
    3,574
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Brampton, Cumbria
    I certainly can't think of any. Also no days where there were three steam specials on the S&C, but there have been a good clutch of two's. The nearest which comes similar would be the two Eric Treacy special's in September 1978, both directions over the S&C, shared between 3 different loco's.
     
  2. 16Ventnor

    16Ventnor New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2015
    Messages:
    85
    Likes Received:
    66
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Pershore (Worcestershire)
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
  3. 1020 Shireman

    1020 Shireman Well-Known Member Friend

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2013
    Messages:
    2,393
    Likes Received:
    1,918
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Relaxingly retired
    Location:
    Deep in the country
    Disgusted with Pathfinder. The 'old' company would never have run a diesel assisted train to celebrate such an iconic event in the history of steam hauled trains. I must admit I forgot they were part of the Riviera Trains Group along with TBEL. We know to our cost over the last few years the way TBEL operates. Every train will run if enough customers pay to make it cost effective for them. They will cancel if the loading is insufficient and then you do get money back. No steam, who cares? A diesel will do. Fire risk? run with a diesel inside. But this is a new low.

    I think that sadly we have to accept it's very much a Buyer Beware Market we 'trade' in with Ts&Cs that are not in the spirit of fair trading and providing what is advertised. We want to keep steam on the mainline so we have put up with them.

    GEI is the worst of all things for we enthusiasts. They only confirmed that there would be an assisting diesel today and the first most passengers will know about it is when they get their tickets tomorrow at the earliest. If you want to cancel when you get the tickets. technically there will be no refund under the Ts&Cs as it's less than 5 days before the date of running. Cancelling last Friday was the last day to get a 50% 'refund' in the form of a credit note on what was paid in real money in good faith for a steam hauled railtour. Then of course the credit note can only be used on a future Pathfinder or TBEL train.

    I wondered if we might have a pleasant surprise and Pathfinder would provide a proper refund against the form of payment we made. They claim we genuine enthusiasts for whom any form of diesel interference on an advertised steam hauled train is abhorrent, are really small in number so it wouldn't cost them very much.

    But a reality check. The first thing they told me when I rang to inquire about cancelling was that any refund would be made in accordance with their Ts&Cs. Not even "in good faith under the circumstances we'll hold your money over for another train".

    It's an good(?) example of the law of diminishing returns. We did cancel on Friday. Under the Ts&Cs we've lost £250 on the 4 Standard Class tickets we bought. To book on another advertised steam hauled train will likely cost us a further £250 plus the credit note. If for any reason that train won't be steam hauled, the odds are we won't find out until the 50% refund window kicks in again at the earliest. So potentially for an outlay of £.750 made in good faith, all we could have is a credit note for £250. And so it could go on....
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2018
    green five and Jerr Grey like this.
  4. 26D_M

    26D_M Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2009
    Messages:
    4,416
    Likes Received:
    1,680
    It is a very poor quality of service you describe and whilst extreme examples, perhaps, do illustrate that there is an element of a captive audience to be exploited in the sense the customer has no real bargaining power, other than withholding their repeat custom. As I've said before, it seems incredibly complacent of the sector to operate in this endemic fashion but maybe we are wrong and there will always be a ready supply of unwary customers.
     
    Jerr Grey likes this.
  5. bleeder4

    bleeder4 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2017
    Messages:
    361
    Likes Received:
    317
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Worcester
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Yes I noticed that. I'll see what Pathfinder suggest in their letter today but I suspect I'll have to get off at Crewe and get service trains to New Street and thence back to Bromsgrove. With the train stopping for an hour in Crewe I can probably get into New Street just as the charter leaves Crewe!
     
  6. blink bonny

    blink bonny Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2012
    Messages:
    341
    Likes Received:
    1,344
    Location:
    northumberland
    4472, 35028 and this beauty. :) It was a bit busy that day. 09-Evening-Star,-Appleby,-30-Sepy-1978-fbook.jpg
     
  7. 16Ventnor

    16Ventnor New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2015
    Messages:
    85
    Likes Received:
    66
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Pershore (Worcestershire)
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Pathfinders was the agent for the Sugar Loaf Mountaineer on behalf of Arriva Trains Wales who pulled the trip (letter dated 5 days before the trip) and on calling Pathfinders I was told ATW had said there was no point in running the train with a diesel as it was the anniversary of the opening of the line. How refreshing and so upsetting in regard to this Saturday that the right 'call' wasn't made. Ironic also that it looks as though it may rain most of the day in Cumbria.
     
    green five, 26D_M and Jerr Grey like this.
  8. 1020 Shireman

    1020 Shireman Well-Known Member Friend

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2013
    Messages:
    2,393
    Likes Received:
    1,918
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Relaxingly retired
    Location:
    Deep in the country
    I see the weather forecast is now for heavy rain over Cumbria on Saturday. Lost interest in the train but I wonder if NR will lift the ban at the 11th hour?? Can't remember when or what train it was but we were on a diesel assisted train in a fire risk period and it rained heavily in the morning and most of the day.
     
    Graft on likes this.
  9. hatherton hall

    hatherton hall Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2007
    Messages:
    1,050
    Likes Received:
    347
    Some years ago, again during a steam ban, a Torbay Express, I seem to recall, was booked to run with diesel assistance due to the fire risk. Overnight on the Saturday it "chucked" it down in the West Country and NR took the bold and sensible decision to allow the King to run on its own and leave the diesel behind. There were no lineside fires during the day. Could that happen over this weekend? Be good if it did. Come on NR, you know you can!
     
  10. Dobbs0054

    Dobbs0054 Member

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2014
    Messages:
    869
    Likes Received:
    520
    Gender:
    Male
    NR must carry some share of the blame. A ban is a ban. So they should ensure that if they ban steam from the network due to fire risk then it is a total ban. No show pony with wisps of smoke on the front with a diesel doing all the work. If they cannot put a steam loco on the front at all then their T&Cs will melt away as they cannot deliver the product sold.
     
  11. Gladiator 5076

    Gladiator 5076 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2015
    Messages:
    2,324
    Likes Received:
    1,807
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Swanage
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    But as I posted on the Steam Ban thread we are talking about three trains Saturday, not just this one. So I guess they will need to be really convinced it will be safe.
     
  12. 26D_M

    26D_M Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2009
    Messages:
    4,416
    Likes Received:
    1,680
    NR has only approved the mitigation strategy proposed by the TOCs so I don't see they can be held responsible for devising the show pony option.
     
  13. 16Ventnor

    16Ventnor New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2015
    Messages:
    85
    Likes Received:
    66
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Pershore (Worcestershire)
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Yes I spotted that move as well but as we don’t have Priv’ it would need official sanctioning. Nothing came in the post today. Any news on the Bromsgrove issue from anyone who has had a letter?
     
  14. 16Ventnor

    16Ventnor New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2015
    Messages:
    85
    Likes Received:
    66
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Pershore (Worcestershire)
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Confirmed timings up on Pathfinders website but differ from those on RTT in respect to Bromsgrove and Cam&Dursley.
     
  15. bleeder4

    bleeder4 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2017
    Messages:
    361
    Likes Received:
    317
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Worcester
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Letters sent out today, according to their Facebook page, so should be in tomorrow's post. I've asked them via Facebook about the Bromsgrove issue, and will report back when / if I get a response.
     
  16. 1020 Shireman

    1020 Shireman Well-Known Member Friend

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2013
    Messages:
    2,393
    Likes Received:
    1,918
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Relaxingly retired
    Location:
    Deep in the country
    And with GEI there's be a water issue unless as it's 90 miles from Preston to Upperby. Still I suppose they could take water in Grayrigg Loop as that's now a booked stop.
     
  17. 5944

    5944 Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2006
    Messages:
    5,850
    Likes Received:
    3,192
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Train Maintainer for GTR at Hornsey
    Location:
    Letchworth
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Why, is the 66 going to need a top up? Blowing the whistle a few times won't use that much water!
     
    Dobbs0054, class8mikado and 5098 like this.
  18. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    May 30, 2009
    Messages:
    16,949
    Likes Received:
    15,583
    Location:
    1016
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    It's Tuesday. The trips are on Saturday. Every day between now and then should be 'typically August'. I don't believe that either the TOCs or NR are unaware of the significance of the date so why doesn't everyone wait until close of play on Friday to see where things are?
     
  19. 1020 Shireman

    1020 Shireman Well-Known Member Friend

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2013
    Messages:
    2,393
    Likes Received:
    1,918
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Relaxingly retired
    Location:
    Deep in the country
    Perhaps because we'll lose all our money Al.
     
  20. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    May 30, 2009
    Messages:
    16,949
    Likes Received:
    15,583
    Location:
    1016
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Yes I get that but was just looking on the bright side and the fact that every day from now on is one that should be better suited to a pure steam trip.
     

Share This Page