Royal Duchy series 2014

And that's the problem, they purposely overload the trains so they are forced to have "assistance". Why not leave it at 9/10 coaches including support coach? Or whatever the ideal load for a class 7 loco on a given route is.
I would be willing to pay a bit extra for guaranteed non-assisted haulage.

 

I don't think 12 behind a BoB on the route would be too heavy if the locomotive was in top nick would it? Not an expert on Bullieds but they did prodigious work back in the day, as indeed has Tnagmere in previous years. I wonder if they do have an issue with the loco at the moment. There's no other locos available most of the time now so I guess they have to make do and if that's diesel assistance it's a great shame as it is not what we pay for. Back to Sunday, 9 over the banks is on the absolute limit for a Class 7 so I suppose we can only hope the diesel was because of the load and not because of an issue with the engine. Based on the runs in 2012 she should be allowed to tun on her own and make a mockery of the banks. Will still take enough money to pay on the day on the TBE just in case.

 

Have to admit, 34067 must be the most untrusted main line steam loco out there.
Don't suppose the con rod incident helped plus the slipping incident the other week on one of the rare occasions when it was allowed out to play on it's own.

 

And yet my experiences of '67 are quite different. Had a great run to Exeter a few years back with Honiton stormed in fantastic style. Same for the WSE, Evershott and Upwey climbed without a hitch. A shame she seems to be a bit mercurial these days.

 

I too have had some excellent runs with 34067 but her reliability has been suspect for quite some time. And climbing banks in the wet can sometimes be problematic. I'm not sure, but I suspect it is being fed with poor quality coal at the moment, certainly not the good quality Welsh coal on 34046 and 5029.

 

I agree but in the past Tangmere has managed 11 coaches unassisted out of Weymouth after the diesel caught fire ( either on the way or on the way back from Yeovil with Tangmere).

 

This is the latest schedule for tomorrow's run. I'm sure that David will update uksteam shortly. <BJ>

Exeter St Davids [EXD]10:27-10:49
Dawlish Warren [DWW] pass 11:01
Dawlish [DWL] pass 11:03
Teignmouth [TGM] pass 11:07
Newton Abbot [NTA] pass 11:13
Newton Abbot West Junction pass 11:15
Dainton Tunnel pass 12:11
Totnes [TOT] pass 11:29
Aish Emergency Crossover pass 11:43
Ivybridge [IVY] pass 11:50
Hemerdon pass 11:58
Lipson Junction pass 12:08
Plymouth [PLY] 12:12-13:08
St Budeaux Jn. pass 13:15
Saltash [STS] pass 13:19
St Germans [SGM] pass 13:25
Liskeard [LSK] pass 13:38
St Pinnock Viaduct East pass 13:45
Largin pass 13:46
Lostwithiel [LOS] pass 13:56
Par [PAR] 14:02

 

Its not that the trains are purposely overloaded.It is I am sure more to do with the profit margin. A tour like the ACE involves a lot of people and a lot of time from WCR, NR and SD. Other trains like the Duchy are repeat itineraries and so cost a lot less to run.

Don

 

Yes quite right. I timed many very good runs with the light pacifics on heavy loads in the days of steam including even time Basingstoke to Woking with 12 on and a fabulous run with 34019 (unrebuilt) on 20th June 1965 when it had 13 and a van total 500 tons. With an NE driver, Sullivan, we topped Roundwood at 55 mph from a Winchester start and then ran from Basingstoke to a sigs stop outside Woking in even time, max 77 mph. Brother Yeti was also on this.

It is also the case that light pacifics on 12 were regularly booked over Honiton bank on summer Saturdays eg 21st July 1962 unrebuilt 34068 0n the 1145 am Waterloo to Sidmouth and Exmouth and on 18th August 1962 rebuilt 34052 on the 1115 Waterloo to Plymouth, Padstow and Bude. Not only that but the 1035 down was booked a class 5 on 12.

Tangmere is quite capable of taking 12 over Honiton if in reasonable condition. I have to say though that my long held view is that there are few left out there who really know how to look after steam engines, particularly temperamental ones like unrebuilt Bulleids. The team at Tyseley being an exception of course as can be seen by the quality of performances turned in by their engines.

I will be there tomorrow though my back up is 5043 not 60019.

Don

 

In steam days, the permitted loads on steep banks were normally determined by the maximum load that could be restarted from rest in adverse conditions eg on a wet rail. This did not prevent engines successfully handling overloaded trains in good conditions, especially when it was possible to take a run at the bank and the line was relatively straight. Curves such as on the Devon banks can add a lot of additional resistance. In preservation I have seen engines which normally cope well on challenging banks, come to grief in adverse conditions and have great difficulty restarting a heavy train - 34067, 60800 and 60009 all come to mind. One of the worst places to be stopped is at the first signal out of Totnes heading westbound up Rattery which is situated under trees on a curve . Many drivers arrange with Exeter panel that they will be held east of Totnes if they don't have a clear road up Rattery bank. By contrast the climb out of Weymouth is relatively straight forward (as long as the fire is in good nick). Evershot bank southbound is no steeper, but is much more challenging because of the curves and the lineside vegetation.

 

I am afraid I don't rate 34067 very highly these days. The only decent run I ever had with her was the 9th July run a few years back ( the one with 48151 on the leg from Weymouth). Unfortunately all the other trips I have done with her, and there have been quite a few in the distant past, have had a problem at some point in the journey. This has got me into the habit of avoiding booking on any trips she is involved with.
I am very eager for 35018 to take her place down South when she returns to the ML.

 

We were lucky that the weather was good (its was July 9 )and the driver was Pete Roberts( there are pictures of Pete in the cab of a Bulleid at Nine Elms in the sixties). Pete had driven Tangmere with 13 on a month before up Sole Street.
I was on 5029 when we nearly came to stop ( 1 mph according to someone with a gps ) at an adverse signal Westbound out of Totnes and possbily in the place you mention. The crew was Ray Churchill and Dean Norris and 5029 was steaming well so we made it but it was a slog.

 

She is not as good as she was.

Some great performances behind her

Torbay Express - 10/8/08,
Canterbury - 14/6/09 13 on up Sole Street
Weymouth - 9/7/09 11 on unassited out of Weymouth

My last run was on the ACE in 2011 when she failed at Taunton.

 

I dunno where 34067 is concerned given it's previous track record ,I can well understand WCRC being prudent
, especially with NR watching of late, I am beginning to wonder, given that with steam locomotives, two supposedly identical machines can have wildly different characteristics, whether 34067 is just a less than brilliant example of the breed compared to 34092 (which sounds half decent on Youtube, but may be down to the Giesel exhaust), 34081 etc, it was noticeable when Tyseley had 4965, 4936 and 4953 all operating, Mike Notley suggested in his reports that 4965 is an excellent steamer, 4936 can sometimes be uncooperative and 4953 was a strong loco.

 

Has Tangmere failed ? 37706 just arrived BTM on RD ecs.

Don

 

37706 has just uncoupled and drawn forward and I can see smoke coming from SPM so I think it's safe to assume that it will be solo steam hauled - unless the 37 comes on the back!

 

Tangmere solo, just slowing for Yatton

 

Good news ! Just checking out hotel in Torquay. Hoping for 5 shots today.

 

No Maureen, just for once I don't totally agree with you. A fully in order Light Pacific can handle 12 cars on routes that. And they did back in the day. One of my best up ACE runs was with 34002, "Salisbury". 11 cars, not 12, but the extra car would perhaps have added a minute to the times. It had kept time to Salisbury where I joined the train. And Fred Hoare would have done a just over 76 minute run to Waterloo, (nearly 4 minutes inside the MN schedule), but for a long tsr and even longer signal stop near Brookwood.

It's down to loco preparation, coal quality and crews. And I am not pointing my finger at any of those over this trip as I have no positive info on any aspect of it. I just know from timing a large number of runs behind them in normal steam days what they can do in the right hands.

But, OK, in todays railway, (this is where I partly agree with you!), insurance on the back is sometimes needed. However, for such a critical train as the anniversary ACE all circumstances could have been taken into account to allow Tangmere to run unassisted, (including a lighter load to be totally certain that some unforseen issues can still be handled). Yes, a lot of people just don't care about a diesel pushing, I have consistently made that point here. It just means that the few purists like myself have been virtually pushed out of the market, with some exceptions still. But I do feel marketing such trips should be very open and honest in the future, which it is most certainly not all the time at present.

Incidentally, back on thread, and one of my exceptions, I have just heard that Tangy has done an even time run this morning. With no diesel on the back.