If you register, you can do a lot more. And become an active part of our growing community. You'll have access to hidden forums, and enjoy the ability of replying and starting conversations.

Rother Valley Railway

Discussion in 'Heritage Railways & Centres in the UK' started by nine elms fan, Nov 4, 2012.

  1. Enterprise

    Enterprise Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2005
    Messages:
    4,213
    Likes Received:
    2,080
    If the relationship between the two societies is as unclear as these recent posts suggest, then the potential exists for the same nonsense that plagued the WHR/WHHR.
     
  2. howard

    howard Member

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2006
    Messages:
    278
    Likes Received:
    209
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired Ship's Engineer
    Location:
    Sandwich Kent
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    I don't think they will need to borrow Chatwelton, she's owned by a RVR member!
     
  3. martin butler

    martin butler Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2008
    Messages:
    3,440
    Likes Received:
    384
    The relationship is hardly unclear, as in all organisations there are some both in the RVR and Kesr who are anti building the extension, for very different reasons, some on the Tenterden side , because they feel it will not be in our interests to extend, and would have prefered us to have stopped at Northiam , and some at Robertsbridge who are former members who left the Kesr and dont want anything to do with us, then you have the other view, that to extend is going to happen so lets prepare for it and make the best of the opertunities it creates, from my own point of view, its going to happen,, so we might as well get ready for it, its going to add to our costs, yes but 4 extra miles per round trip shouldnt cost us that much in increased maintaince costs, compared to what we have to do already, our increasing maintaince at the moment is because of mistakes in the past when overhauls were put off, so by the time we have to think about running beyond Bodiam, our stock and engines should be in far better condition and will have engines that are better suited to longer runs and more economical in their useage
     
  4. Fireline

    Fireline Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2008
    Messages:
    844
    Likes Received:
    277
    Gender:
    Male
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    As I understood the position, and maybe Mike Hart can clarify it, the intention is to use the RVR's own 03 to provide the motive power, and use a wagon fitted with seating together with the SR brake van as the formation. Primitive, yes, but effective. There was, when I last heard, no intention to use steam at Robertsbridge due to the lack of maintenance facilities, not to mention coal and water, down there. There is no reason why the GWR railcar couldn't go there when completed, as it would probably be too small in capacity for KESR services on normal running days. The RVR had the intention of running the shuttles without drawing on our resources, so that the income derived went into their coffers to help with the extension work.
     
  5. seawright

    seawright New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2012
    Messages:
    162
    Likes Received:
    26
    That is what is stated on the RVR's website which would fulfil the trusts immediate objectives of a running line and sufficient rolling stock to enable them to run a service. I would not expect this to be sufficient once the two lines are connected.
     
  6. The Saggin' Dragon

    The Saggin' Dragon Part of the furniture Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2006
    Messages:
    15,146
    Likes Received:
    5,434
    Location:
    1012 / 60158
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    'plagues' present tense?
     
  7. Enterprise

    Enterprise Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2005
    Messages:
    4,213
    Likes Received:
    2,080
    I agree, I should have written plagued. I have changed it.
     
  8. martin butler

    martin butler Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2008
    Messages:
    3,440
    Likes Received:
    384
    Right i understand now, i was thinking that the shuttles were going to be hauled by Charwelton hense the need for Kesr staff, riding on a wagon fitted with seats ??, thats going to be an experience, whats that scum class? who knows it might catch on, save us the cost of restoring vintage coaches, we could just fit woodern planks across the partitions and save thousands on restoring the vehicles
     
  9. Fireline

    Fireline Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2008
    Messages:
    844
    Likes Received:
    277
    Gender:
    Male
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    I doff my cap, Martin. I have heard from an RVR Trustee. He has confirmed that KESR staff will operate the shuttles on the RVR, as well as all engineering trains. There is no intention at present for RVR staff to crew trains. I am now off to stick my head in a bucket....
     
  10. howard

    howard Member

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2006
    Messages:
    278
    Likes Received:
    209
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired Ship's Engineer
    Location:
    Sandwich Kent
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Can I hit the bucket with a big spanner please?
     
  11. martin butler

    martin butler Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2008
    Messages:
    3,440
    Likes Received:
    384
    Howard, there is a queue you know, Now back to the end, if you please, and leave the spanner here, theres quite a few in front of you i beleave
     
  12. steamybrian

    steamybrian New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2008
    Messages:
    144
    Likes Received:
    2
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    South East England
    I can accept that the shuttle passenger service between Robertsbridge and Northbridge Street may begin operating at sometime in the near future- Think of number--1, 2, 3 or 4 years time? . Every year since the mid 1990s I have heard that the RVR are going to open shortly or next year..!
    I am still not convinced yet that the 2 mile section between Northbridge Street and Junction Road will be built within up to 20 years. Yes I know this will cause a big debate but the plain fact is there are still legal problems, infrastructure to build and the numerous other issues to sort. Yes I know there is an experienced Manager now on site but even the Welsh Highland Railway rebuilt their line mainly on existing infrastructure but it took years of complex legal problems before they even started work on the first section.
     
  13. John Petley

    John Petley Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2007
    Messages:
    2,520
    Likes Received:
    1,448
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Researcher/writer and composer of classical music
    Location:
    Between LBSCR 221 and LBSCR 227
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    I hope it won't take that long. Although the RVR project has had a long gestation, there's no doubt that the pace has picked up in the last couple of years - the bridge replacements, the tracklaying to Junction Road. OK, the hard bit is Northbridge Street to Junction Road, but some serious momentum is building, and some experienced players are involved.

    The other issue is, of course, the effect of the repoened Robertsbridge-Bodiam section on the exisiting K&ESR. I seem to remember some comments by the K&ESR General Manager on this subject, although to a degree, the issues are fairly self-evident. The RVR Section could end up being the most profitable part of the full 14 miles - a link with Network Rail at Robertsbridge enabling people to travel either down from London or up from the Coast and catch a train to Bodiam to go to the castle. Joint marketing by the railway and the National Trust could be organised and you've got the makings of a first rate day out. The problem is how to provide interest keep people on the trains for all or part of the remaining 10 1/2 miles to Tenterden. It's a pleasant rural ride (OK, one or two members of this Forum aren't too taken with the charm of the countryside through which the K&ESR passes, but that's beside the point). the problem is that you have a 50-60-minute journey going through nowhere of note. I believe that a small museum recently opened near Northiam station, and you can go from Bodiam to Northiam one way by train and back by boat along the river, but that's about it. Northiam itself is a pleasant village, but it's not, say Dunster or Goathland, and the station is a good mile from the village, along a busy road with no footpaths for much of the way. Wittersham Road is out in the middle of nowhere. I've taken a couple of pictures in that area , and I enjoy the tranquility of the countryside. It's a delightful spot, but who is going to get off a train just to enjoy empty space and listen to birdsong? Rolvenden station has the loco works and not much else, and it's only really after that when things get interesting - the slog up Tenterden Bank which will always be pretty entertaining, at least for the enthusiast fraternity, and then Tenterden itself is a charming place. Unfortunately, by now, any passengers who have joined the train at Robertsbridge will have been on board for 1 1/4 hours by now. Pretty as Tenterden is, can it justify such a long journey? This is the nub of the problem which the K&ESR faces. Of course, there is - and will continue to be - traffic (such as coach parties) which starts at the Tenterden end, bearing in mind that Tenterden will remain the most accessible starting point for visitors from East Kent, but visitors from the London area or beyond who may currently opt to start their trip on the K&ESR from Tenterden because of ease of accessibility compared with the other stations may well prefer to make for Robertsbridge once the RVR is open, espcially bearing in mind the possibility of arriving by rail.

    Well, whether it's 20 years as Brian suggests, or a lot quicker, the K&ESR and RVR have a while to work out how to address the above issues. It's a lot easier to summarise than to propose a solution, but I do hope that somehow the exisiting K&ESR will find a way of remaining viable and not suffering a reduction in traffic when the Robertsbridge section is opened. I wish them well.
     
  14. Fireline

    Fireline Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2008
    Messages:
    844
    Likes Received:
    277
    Gender:
    Male
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Well, I would suggest that you kick it, but....
     
  15. martin butler

    martin butler Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2008
    Messages:
    3,440
    Likes Received:
    384
    The problem is that for years the RVR have not done much, so hense the feeling in some quarters that it will take 20 years, or not at all, the people now calling the shots on the RVR will get it done, and it will be a lot quicker than most of us think, i would say no more than 5 years, depending on how soon the land can be purchased , the main obsticles are the farmer who is reluctant to sell, and the A21 , once faced with the stark choice of having his land valued at a fraction of what he things its worth if subject to a CPO and what ever the RVR offer him, he will come round, the A21 has agreement in principle i am sure, otherwise it wouldnt be happening , there are bridges ready to go in, to replace the two between Northbridge St and the A21, The statements by the GM are not helpful and are just his own , and not that of the membership or full board of the Kesr time will tell what the outcome is, it might well be that the Robertsbridge to Bodiam section will be more popular, in which case the operation will have to include more trains on that section, and a tailing off of Robertsbridge to Tenterden services , prehaps shuttles from Northiam to robertsbridge and an 2 hourly robertsbridge to tenterden service might be the answer the lesser gradient between Northiam and Robertsbridge would enable us to use the Terriers and P on this section with the vintage rake and by using Northiam as the terminus it brings the journey down to a comfortable 30 mins from either end
     
  16. Enterprise

    Enterprise Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2005
    Messages:
    4,213
    Likes Received:
    2,080
    I am not involved with either railway and comment only from the perspective of an enthusiast but if the connection date is as close as 5 years hence, shouldn't both societies have at least agreed outline policies to operate an integrated railway?
     
  17. martin butler

    martin butler Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2008
    Messages:
    3,440
    Likes Received:
    384
    its called internal politics , until these are put to bed and the railway takes it's collective head out of the sand, nothing can be agreed, after a bad trading year, the voices of those who say we can't do it because of cost etc are bound to get louder, but in the same breath, the railway found the money to top up the 6619 appeal to ensure we got it so already we are moving towards accepting that we have to look towards the future, why else have we now got 2 larger steam engines ? on the ground i would say there is no argument, but there are still those who are fearful of the future and would prefer to not think about it, until its already built , then go into panic mode because we don't have sufficient stock etc
     
  18. Andre

    Andre New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2007
    Messages:
    55
    Likes Received:
    21
    Occupation:
    K&ESR Commercial Manager
    Location:
    Tenterden
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    I assure you that the RVR/Robertsbridge extension is frequently discussed at length in manager meetings. Working staff also have access to minutes of trustee meetings. I'm not aware of any senior member of staff who is ignoring the challenges & opportunities that Robertsbridge will offer.
    It should be noted that the RVR is building the extension (to a spec agreed with the K&ESR), but it is the K&ESR that will operate any services.
     
  19. Andre

    Andre New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2007
    Messages:
    55
    Likes Received:
    21
    Occupation:
    K&ESR Commercial Manager
    Location:
    Tenterden
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Planning permission for the new Robertsbridge Station was granted on Friday. Plans are shown on the Rother District Council council website rother.gov.uk

    The planning application number RR/2012/1357/P
     
  20. martin butler

    martin butler Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2008
    Messages:
    3,440
    Likes Received:
    384
    Progress, Does anyone now dought that the people behind the RVR extension mean business, , in what is a very short time span Robertsbridge station (RVR) site will be transformed from a ramshackle collection of part restored wagon and coaches to a railway station waiting for its first train from Junction Rd.
    what will this say to local people in Robertsbridge, who have watched previous occupents not be able to make any headway on the site.
     

Share This Page