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Network rail been given ok to chop part of Liverpool rd line Manchester

Discussion in 'Heritage Railways & Centres in the UK' started by charterplan, May 18, 2014.

  1. David R

    David R Well-Known Member

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  2. John Stewart

    John Stewart Well-Known Member

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    I suspect that a further challenge won't get far. Mark Whitby has to remember that it is quite lawful to affect the historic environment adversely provided that the correct procedure is followed and the decision maker (in this case the Secretary of State) is satisfied that, on balance, it is in the public interest. That is quite properly a political decision. I think that Mr. Whitby's scheme has great merit but it came along too late in the day.
     
  3. Robin Moira White

    Robin Moira White Nat Pres stalwart

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    And is the saving worth £20M plus?

    Especially given that the historic station is preserved, just disconnected.

    Robin
     
  4. John Stewart

    John Stewart Well-Known Member

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    Robin, it's so nice that you have emerged from deepest Somerset to cast an eye over affairs in the north. I made a site visit before commenting to NR's consultation and the whole area gives credence to the supposed comedians' phrase of "it's grim up north".
     
  5. Robin Moira White

    Robin Moira White Nat Pres stalwart

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    I am privileged, both in my 'legal' working life and the assistance I have provided to a heritage railway or two, to travel the length and breadth of the UK (well, almost). And I have indeed visited Liverpool Road Station several times.

    Given that it can never be a terminus of a line running stock consistent with its venerable origins, I do struggle to understand the benefit of maintaining its modern main line connection to any role it can fulfil in heritage terms, and especially not to the extent of costing modern infrastructure providers a cool £20M.

    But always pleased to be educated by those not addled by 'Thatcher's Gold' as we are in these parts!

    Kind regards

    Robin White
     
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  6. David R

    David R Well-Known Member

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    John

    I think that's very unfair to Manchester - the centre is vastly better than it was 30 years ago. I think it's much more a city on the way up than on the way down.

    David R
     
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  7. John Stewart

    John Stewart Well-Known Member

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    I was thinking of the banks of the Irwell.
     
  8. DJH

    DJH New Member

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    The link is only one part and there may be a future opportunity to reinstate it despite claims it cannot. Either way the link has already gone and track lifted up to the end of the MSI railway. Track lifting of 2/3s of the Museums line begin early next year.

    The bigger challenges are the chord cuts off 2/3 of the MSI track and separates parts of the site i.e. the Jesse James bridge over the Irwell with the station itself. The bridge set the height of the whole site as its own height was dictated by ships on the Irwell. It's the case of reading it not as one structure but a number that tell an important story. Beneath where the new line cuts through the site has the old stables for the original taxi service as well as access to the old arrivals station. The cattle dock is being demolished along with the goods drops next to it. The stables and arrivals station will be altered as footings for the new bow string bridge need more intrusion compared to a girder bridge. Later viaducts that fed what is now on the old Granada site and the museums main building around the Irwell are going as they are in the way. The only reprieve is there was at one point discussion to remove Water Street bridge which has now been reversed. Those aware of the history of the predecessor over this street will understand why keeping this was one historic win.

    One positive. There had been discussions some years ago of opening up the old arrivals station down to the Irwell to connect to a boat service. The site West of Water Street Bridge is owned by a developer who had hoped could be redeveloped into fancy flats. As part of the chord NR will buy the site out from the developer which means it would open up an opportunity to use the area under the track more usefully as it wont be able to used for much else.

    Duncan
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2015
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  9. nanstallon

    nanstallon Well-Known Member

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    I can't recall getting any gold from Mrs Thatcher. The name rather puts me off the brew, but Exmoor Gold is well worth being addled by!

    John
     
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  10. DJH

    DJH New Member

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    Just to say Planet will be running at Liverpool Road on the 30th December.
     
  11. DJH

    DJH New Member

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    For those interested just to say Planet & Agecroft No1 will be in steam today at Liverpool Road along with weather permitting the M&B coach.
     
  12. RA & FC

    RA & FC Member

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    The last ever day of running the full line. A shame I can't make it.
     
  13. nanstallon

    nanstallon Well-Known Member

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    Is there going to be an enthusiast special, before the link goes?
     
  14. western nobleman

    western nobleman Well-Known Member

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    Sadly the mainline link was lifted before Christmas (not sure of exact date).

    As per the above the last runs over the old internal layout were two days ago (using Agecroft No 1 & Planet). Track clearance was to start immediately to make way for the new Ordsall curve, reducing the usable museum running line to the short distance between the entrance and the west end of the 1830 station building.

    The long siding on the north side of the MOSI site has been severed from the shortened running line and due to the geography of the museum it would be very difficult to reconnect.I'm not sure whether the museum management will retain this stub or attempt to re-use the alignment for other purposes.

    The specials which did run on Tuesday were notable for the almost total lack of advance publicity, not even on their own website, probably because the new management are rightly ashamed of their actions..

    I am not against either progress in general or the Ordsall curve in particular but it would have been possible to retain a revised mainline link. However MOSI managers thought that taking a £3m sweetener in return for giving up that right was a better option. The next item on their revisionist agenda is likely to be the closure of the Air & Space Hall & using the money saved to increase the emphasis in other areas far less connected to either science or industry.
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2016
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  15. Sidmouth

    Sidmouth Part of the furniture Staff Member Moderator

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    Those involved have been posting lots of last day images . It is suggested MOSI did not object and accepted a large compensation sum .

    I would love to have gone Tuesday but just back to work so no chance
     
  16. marshall5

    marshall5 Member

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    Is that fact or merely speculation?
    Ray.
     
  17. John Stewart

    John Stewart Well-Known Member

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    I'm sure that a low level swing bridge, just skimming the new tracks, could have been put in for less than this so the loss of connection isn't really down to cost but to the fact that NR just didn't want the inconvenience.
     
  18. western nobleman

    western nobleman Well-Known Member

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  19. Spamcan81

    Spamcan81 Resident of Nat Pres

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    I can't believe that she doesn't consider the aircraft to be part of the museum's story. Avro was founded in Manchester for heaven's sake. :rolleyes:
     
  20. DJH

    DJH New Member

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    To clarify:

    The enthusiast special was the Branchline Society one.


    Last movement over the connection was the Museum battery rescuing a toasted diesel.


    Below is a set of clips I put together of Planets last revenue earning service to Ordsall on Tuesday.


    Duncan
     
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