If you register, you can do a lot more. And become an active part of our growing community. You'll have access to hidden forums, and enjoy the ability of replying and starting conversations.

Narrow Gauge New Builds

Discussion in 'Narrow Gauge Railways' started by SpudUk, Jan 13, 2010.

  1. meeee

    meeee Member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2006
    Messages:
    864
    Likes Received:
    1,319
    The FR already has the perfect engine for the line and that was built in 1879. I can think of nothing that would ruin the unique feel of the FR more, than some ugly rebuild of an NG15 or NGG16. There's another railway for things like that.

    Just because the FR makes engines work for a living dosn't mean it asks too much of them. From the footplate you can tell these locos are working within thier limits. The main FR fleet has been tuned up over the years to cope with the high workload and to ease maintaince, and that doesn't mean adding expensive gadgets like GCPS or lempors.

    Rather than building new engines i would prefer to see some of the engines we've already got overhauled, like Welsh Pony, the ALCO and Prince.

    Tim
     
  2. The engines seem to be struggleing and i dont mean they work hard the strain on componant parts is vast i feel in years to come the fr will have to look towards this option the heratige argument comes into play too
     
  3. SillyBilly

    SillyBilly Member

    Joined:
    May 19, 2007
    Messages:
    512
    Likes Received:
    6
    Occupation:
    Student
    Location:
    Penrhyndeudraeth
    No it doesn't! You don't get efficient traditional steam engines, because it's a 200 year old technology and besides that what is wanted is a heritage experience, for example take Prince the pimped out England engine, then Palmerston which is the true FR experience that everyone relishes. True, there are very few original pieces left on some FR engines because the hard work has nackered them, but things get replaced and patched up, as they should be, this is the only way you keep the real heritage alive with all the iconic engine names. Besides we have the LT & Princess which are preserved examples of original locos.

    There is nothing worse than suggesting the FR needs locos of a different design, or built in a different way, the FR runs locos that were designed to run on the railway for a reason, because that is railway heritage. Running a cut down NG15 on the FR is like running a Bullied Pacific on a branchline in Yorkshire, plain wrong.
     
  4. TonyW

    TonyW New Member

    Joined:
    May 23, 2006
    Messages:
    156
    Likes Received:
    5
    The FR's loco fleet is constantly evolving. After all, no two locos are the same!
     
  5. weltrol

    weltrol Part of the furniture Friend

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2008
    Messages:
    2,784
    Likes Received:
    658
    More to the point, look at the development of the fleet.

    Original company:
    4 small England engines ( Prince, Princess, Palmerston, Mountaineer)
    2 large England engines (Welsh Pony, Little Giant)
    1 prototype Fairlie (Little Wonder)
    1 modified Fairlie (James Spooner)
    1 single Fairlie (Taliesin)
    2 improved Fairlies ( Merddin Emrys, Livingston Thompson)

    Preservation added :
    Penrhyn ladies Linda and Blanche ( both 0-4-0T, rebuilt into 2-4-0TT.)
    Alco (Mountaineer)
    2 more Fairlies ( Iarll Merionydd, David Lloyd-George)
    1 rebuilt single Fairlie
    plus some other speculative acquisitions which have moved on (K1, Harrogate gasworks 0-6-0)

    The Festiniog fleet is constantly evolving as TonyW says, because if you look at the latest rebuild proposals, the Fairlies will receive modified bogie frames, monobloc cylinders and piston valves, a vast improvement in theory over the existing cylinder blocks and slide valve chests bolted around the frame.
    Speedometers are fitted to relieve the drivers the tedium of counting telegraph poles, superheaters are fitted to improve efficiency, the track is constantly being improved, new carriage bodies to replace worn out ones, replicas of long lost original vehicles, etc all show progress and improvements made since the line opened.

    As the thread is effectively 'Narrow gauge new builds', then the response must be that the Festiniog is, in effect, building new locos based on old designs, but improving them far beyond their original capabilities and specifications.

    Frank N.
     
  6. paullad1984

    paullad1984 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2007
    Messages:
    918
    Likes Received:
    428
    Hmmmm how about a new build "Little Wonder"?
     
  7. AndrewT

    AndrewT Member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2007
    Messages:
    735
    Likes Received:
    50
    Occupation:
    F&WHR Spin Doctor
    Location:
    Maentwrog
    We'd be happy to quote you a price for that.
     
  8. paullad1984

    paullad1984 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2007
    Messages:
    918
    Likes Received:
    428
    Wheres my lottery ticket!!!!
     
  9. ady

    ady Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2006
    Messages:
    2,369
    Likes Received:
    281
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Post office
    Location:
    South
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Parden Railway's Dinorwic? No where to run it though...

    That Bagnall loco that was used on the Kerry Railway?

    Pentewan Railway Canopus
     
  10. jtx

    jtx Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2007
    Messages:
    1,868
    Likes Received:
    855
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Happily retired
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    The engines do work hard, but they work within their capacities and are certainly not struggling. It's part of what makes the FR such a matchless experience. They are also maintained in superb condition and overhauled at appropriate intervals. I have been fortunate to drive on both the FR and WHR and I can assure anyone that none of it happens by accident. They know what they are doing.
     
  11. dace83

    dace83 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 7, 2007
    Messages:
    2,095
    Likes Received:
    4

    In the bin :)
     
  12. TonyW

    TonyW New Member

    Joined:
    May 23, 2006
    Messages:
    156
    Likes Received:
    5
    .....
     
  13. Sparky

    Sparky New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2010
    Messages:
    16
    Likes Received:
    2
    There have been comments about the maintenance of the locos, however whichever way you look at it, a loco designed in the 19thC to haul a load of empty wagons uphill or potter along a quarry level is probably not suited to being thrashed at 20mph with a load of heavy coaches on the back. Even the NGG16s seem to have trouble staying in working order for long!
    As for favourite new build suggestion: Lough Swilly 4-8-4 tank please!

    PS: talking of new builds, Hunslets don't seem to have sold any of the new build quarry locos. Could this be because they have no history behind them?:)
     
  14. paulhitch

    paulhitch Guest

    Although Hunslet have not sold a replica quarry loco. they have sold one or two "Wrens", apart from the example they completed for Kew Bridge. The latter carries a Hunslet works number.
     
  15. ghost

    ghost Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    May 29, 2006
    Messages:
    3,967
    Likes Received:
    5,064
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    N.Ireland
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    I would guess that price/haulage capacity/the recession has more to do with it than the lack of history.


    Keith
     
  16. ragl

    ragl Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2010
    Messages:
    1,749
    Likes Received:
    1,637
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Consultant Engineer
    Location:
    Shropshire
    Absolutely Keith,

    The only thing holding me back from ordering my "New Build" is a severe lack of money. A machine with history, s'pose that would be nice, but, being honest, I just want to play trains. I won't play the spurious "saving it for future generations" game, I support various preservation projects because of my own internal preferences & motivations. I'm just being honest here. As for the "New Build" when my finances allow - that would be a Fowler indirect drive loco - it would be a delight to watch all of those bits moving back & forth & round & round - more fun than enough!!!

    Cheers

    Alan
     
  17. meeee

    meeee Member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2006
    Messages:
    864
    Likes Received:
    1,319
    Considering that Linda and Blanche have now being doing this for the best part of 50 years covering over 500,000 miles in the process and are still going strong, your theory doesn't really stand up. Just because something wasn't built for that specific job doesn't mean it can't do it.

    As for double engines they were running around at 20mph+ with 100 wagons on the back long before anyone here was born. They have since been beefed up and are even better at it.

    I think you’re being a little harsh on the NGG16s there’s lots of things wrong with them but reliability isn't one. They have had some spectacular failures, but they cover between 10,000 and 15,000 miles a year in less running days than the FR. The facilities to maintain them are poor and the staff to do it few so they inevitably suffer a bit.

    Tim
     
  18. lynbarn

    lynbarn Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2006
    Messages:
    1,482
    Likes Received:
    482
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Working in the NHS as a Maintenance Electrician
    Location:
    Kent
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    How about a South African 2-6-4T Manning Wardle for the L&BR or one of those French Moroccan 0-6-6-0 Mallets lovely
     
  19. bressingham apear to of built a new loco in 2ft quite what it is im unsure of
     

Share This Page