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LYN

Discussion in 'Narrow Gauge Railways' started by lynbarn, Aug 23, 2010.

  1. darkangel

    darkangel New Member

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    The thing is............many people don't want to be "Spoon fed" the offcial line. The background is just as interesting, as are other peoples views & information no matter how hard it may be to swallow.
     
  2. guard_jamie

    guard_jamie New Member

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    Oh dear heavens this is RIDICULOUS.
     
  3. Axe

    Axe New Member

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    To: Martyn [lynbarn58]

    Responding as a member of the L&BR Trust who is both a working volunteer at Woody Bay, and a committee member of a L&B Area Support Group, I suggest that what you have written is not the complete story.

    I’ve no idea what your true criteria is for censoring L&B messages. What I do know is you have censored two of my posted messages, one suggesting that L&B members should purchase a book from the shop at Woody Bay in preference to buying the item from the Festinog’s shop at Portmadoc, so that our railway benefits from the proceeds. The second post of mine you stopped was a solution that overcame the difficulties encountered by people residing overseas who wish to donate money to the railway. Interesting that both my censored messages relate to funding!

    The bottom line is that the way you have choose to manage [Exmoor-ng} does nothing to improve the harmony within the railway. From what I understand your strategy is clearly upsetting a number of L&B members.

    Chris
     
  4. lynton&barnstaple

    lynton&barnstaple New Member

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    Frankly, I think that the attack on Martyn is very unfair indeed. I actually helped to moderate this forum for a while and believe me, it was a horrid task. Exmoor NG was started by Martyn and frankly, it does a pretty good job for the L&B despite not being offical in any respect. I think he deserves a medal to keep the thing going despite the unpleasantness of a very small number of people.


    "and constantly repeating the same old, same old stale opinions ad nauseum."


    This is the issue and the Engineer never stops. There are indeed other sides of the story with regards to the Bratton workshop BTW
     
  5. Old Kent Biker

    Old Kent Biker Member

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    Andy, I've given my criteria for moderating posts to Exmoor-NG. In the interest of maintaining some form of balance, while preventing this sort of downward spiraling discussion from getting out of hand, I try to let a wide range of opinions get aired. As I indicated, it's not what you say, it's how you say it that makes the real difference. I'm not here to defend my actions on Exmoor-NG. If you want to post, you can. If it passes moderation, it will be posted. That's just how it works. 'nuff said.
     
  6. lynton&barnstaple

    lynton&barnstaple New Member

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    Let's face it. A small number of disaffected and bitter people want to see the L&B project fail at any cost. Fail it will not because the potential for this fabulous railway is too great for that. Officals for the Trust are voted into power and can of course be voted out. Rather than just attempt to disrupt any L&B thread, the Engineer could stand for election himself.

    He describes the Bratton Workshops as being independent from the railway and not under its control yet in the same breath he states that funds had to be found every year to keep it going. £30,000 of funds. No company in its right mind would agree to such a deal.
     
  7. Old Kent Biker

    Old Kent Biker Member

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    Chris, It is the story as I understand and believe it to be. I support the greater L&B Project, in all its myriad forms. I have explained my criteria. I have no hidden agenda. They are as they are. As I said in reply to Andy, I am not here to defend my actions on Exmoor-NG. I don't need to.

    I can't remember the exact details of the two posts I rejected, or when they were (some time ago, I believe) If I recall correctly, one of them (having taken advice from a legally trained professional colleague) was effectively condoning illegal practices that could potentially be interpreted as being related to international money laundering and tax evasion and/or fraud! I believe we had an off-line discussion about them at the time (I usually do). If not, then contact me off-list and we can discuss them. I don't keep copies of rejected messages, so you may need to send them to me again. In response to your final point, from the feedback I do receive, the majority of L&B Members, do appear to feel that I and the fellow moderators do manage to keep the balance more or less as they would like. Again, as I said to Andy, 'nuff said on the matter, I think.
     
  8. Old Kent Biker

    Old Kent Biker Member

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    Thanks John, but Exmoor-NG was actually started, in December 1998, by another L&B member. I believe I am the third owner.
     
  9. TheEngineer

    TheEngineer New Member

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    If your going to Quote, don't twist it Mr L&B.

    I never said it was independant, and it was not until the people there were blacked by the management, I said it was a satelite operation and I never said it was not under the railways control,what I said is they thought they would control us but that was not on the cards and never is where volunteers are concerned. What I said was it was there to build the items that were needed and did very sucsessfully and at a very reasonable cost. I also said the railway did not own most of the machine tools.

    When your building large and complicated projects and your responsible for the end product, the price and the delivery schedule you don't want the hassle of day to day operations, getting in the way.

    Being separate from an operation is very useful in that respect. The "NEW" management thought they were going to put penalty clauses on the jobs, hey boys we are all in this together to do the best we can, penalty clauses might be great for oil companies and big PLC's but start that in preservation and you might get a rude awakening.Anyway beat them at their own game.

    People focused on delivering a product, such as a loco or a coach or any other item , do just that focus on what they are doing , they don't need a level of management who are not doer's managing how they work, telling them what to make next how much it will cost and when they will deliver it.

    You want that and it costs you !! Half a million to build a loco that should be about £200K.Who is having the biggest laught. I wonder.

    Added below.

    Oh and by the way I don't want to see it fail,I put quite a bit of effort and money into it to make it work, when many were saying "No Hope" but at present I can't see it going far either.

    I am not dissented and I am not bitter, just amused by the inability to deliver on price that I was told was to happen.

    No point one man standing for election when the other 9 have nothing in common with him.

    Pull up a new rake of trustees with practical ability , realistic targets and a workable fubnded plan I will probably join them.The cost of the workshop was £5000 per year, the manning it was the rest.

    It failed in principal because the management put work elsewhere and paid dearly for it.One man thought he could break the group.The resilience of engineers is usually a test to others.

    The only result in all this was that the L&B lost out because of the attitude and grasp for power and control of a few.


    Now I am not gainfully employed making metal bits fo nothing for the L&B project I have time to write on here.!!!!


    All jolly good I don't get dirty I don't get cold and I don't give away loads of money.




     
  10. Axe

    Axe New Member

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    Don't worry, I can.

    Money laundering refers to the process of concealing the source of illegally obtained money.

    The advice which I wanted to post merely suggested a route for transferring funds from overseas to the railway via a trusted intermediary. There was nothing illegal about the way the funds would have been transferred or routed, there should have been absolutely no secrecy about the transfer of cash between the parties, but it would have been presumed that funds from the foreign donor would have been obtained legally. In short, there was nothing whatsoever to connect the transfer of cash as money laundering because there was absolutely nothing whatsoever illegal or hidden within the transfer process.

    Chris
     
  11. Old Kent Biker

    Old Kent Biker Member

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    Chris,
    I accept that maybe the word illegal in "effectively condoning illegal practices that could potentially be interpreted as being related to international money laundering and tax evasion and/or fraud!" was incorrectly applied, but the rest of the sentance stands as written. There was a reputational risk in publishing that which I considered to be on dubious legal grounds. Having worked for several years with HMRC and several charities on charity tax matters, I know enough to know that I WAS NOT PREPARED TO TAKE THAT RISK. I did however contact the overseas gentleman off-list and the matter was dealt with to his satisfaction. As a result, no donated funds were lost to the Trust. End of story. Now, I'm off to bed Good night :)
     
  12. Axe

    Axe New Member

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    If you refer specifically to Andy [The Engineer], the last time I saw him was last year when he was splashing about in the River Yeo up to his waist in water brandishing a chain saw desperately cutting up a very large piece of drift timber that was threatening to destroy a pedestrian walkway built across the river during the 1890s by the same contractor who built the original L&B Railway. If you deem that as being part of a master plan to see the "L&B project fail at any cost", it isn't mine or many of the other volunteers who regularly turn out in support of the railway.

    Chris
     
  13. lynton&barnstaple

    lynton&barnstaple New Member

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    I am aware that Andy has been helping with the Exmoor Associates projects. My comments still stand though.

    "and constantly repeating the same old, same old stale opinions ad nauseum."
     
  14. TheEngineer

    TheEngineer New Member

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    Mr L&B I have a lot of time for some things and I dearly hope to see a new L&B that is accessable to everyone , and gives all those around and who visit it a sense of belonging.

     
  15. The Saggin' Dragon

    The Saggin' Dragon Part of the furniture Staff Member Moderator

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    Some of this makes you long for the S****beach threads .... :(
     
  16. paulhitch

    paulhitch Part of the furniture

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    Fans of "Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy" will recognise the likeness to the war between the V'lhurgs and the Ggugvunts. Enough please!

    P.H.
     
  17. The Saggin' Dragon

    The Saggin' Dragon Part of the furniture Staff Member Moderator

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    ... with a dash of Vogon poetry too :)
     
  18. Cambrian55

    Cambrian55 Member Friend

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    Never have so few people flogged so few dead horses for so long.

    :deadhorse:
     
  19. darkangel

    darkangel New Member

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    I find it fascinating...........
     
  20. TheEngineer

    TheEngineer New Member

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    To some readers

    I have been asked not to post any more by admin, the thread had 1220 reads yesterday up to 9 am this morning its had about 700 today so far, so someone must be interested enough to read the thread?

    If you have a particular interest about some aspect PM me and I am happy to answer any questions.

    Best Regards to everyone TE
     

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