Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by Hicks19862, Apr 22, 2020.
Is he still with us but supporting the IoWSR these days?
We'll let that one go then! (My niece lives in Perth WA over 2 Summer's she's had 1501, 7714, 6960 and 75069 diesel wise she's enjoyed 9531 and the one I'm most proud of 40106)
No it was Charlie Kentsley who lived in a bungalow next to Rolvenden Station but I understand where you are coming from
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That’s an almost Hitchcockian shift of the goalposts to make your point (though you almost blew it by allowing a teensy-weensy modicum of equivocation in your final paragraph - if you are going to be didactic, do it properly, man!)
Memory tells me that a businessman, or men, in South Wales were keen on buying one or two sets for charter work. I suspect that the problem of where to keep them was the reason that the plan failed. It should also be remembered the the W.R. sets were NOT all First Class and had been sucessfully used for private charters, notably by Swansea Football supporters.
Again, I've banged on about this at length miles up thread somewhere!
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In fairness I'm not really 'Looking Back with 21st century eyes' as I was there at the time and the 1960's preservation had moved onto 1969, it was already fairly obvious that the K&ESR was not going to be a comuter route and most Austerities were still earning the NCB a living working a darned sight harder, with a darned sight more knocks, bangs and steam leaks than the little P class had pushing a few trucks around at Hodsons Mill. In reallity the only Austerities that would have required less work than 'a life expired P' were the WD surplus examples, and that was only if You could get Your hands on one before the NCB did, Granted at around this time the WD were scrapping literally brand new examples, but that was because they were redundant stock, not because they had offered them for sale and had no offers. In simple terms, the P was available and accesible, good usable Austerities weren't.
Regarding the selection criteria of early preservation groups, I'm reminded of some old paperwork I stumbled across at Didcot a few years ago. Back in 1965 when the GWS were looking at buying a Hall, they had a number of inspections carried out on in-service engines in order to determine which one was best to go for. In the end they settled for Burton Agnes Hall, a contender which had been chiefly remarkable for being the only one not built by the GWR. Anyway, the report for this and the other engines still exists, and it's pretty apparent, as you might expect, that no-one was thinking much beyond the life of the current tubes. But even with that in mind, it still made me chuckle that one of the things which swayed the decision in Agnes' favor was the superior condition of the paintwork. If only life was still that simple...
Oh that's absolutely wonderful, and a fantastic illustration of how ambitions have grown.
I can kind of understand that. The first time I saw the B12 would be probably around 1987 and it was just a pile of bits then. I recall seeing the rusty driving wheels just dumped on the grass at Weybourne. It had been like that I understand for many years. On the same visit with my dad, saw too the Quad art coaches outside at the back of the sheds in a derelict condition.
In the 1980s the NNR railway was very much an industrial tank loco and Mark 1s railway. It is only really in the last 25 years or so that it has really made the huge leaps forward that means the B12 and other gems time has come. With the B12 it was sent to East Germany to Kloster Mansfeld in 1994 and rebuilt there back into working condition. I had my first ride behind it at the GCR 2 years ago.
I have a huge amount of respect for the M&GN Society and the NNR for persevering with the restoration of the B12 in the ‘80s and early ‘90s. Seemed like so many hurdles, bad luck and opposition they had to overcome.
Well worth all the aggro tho' ..... it's such a unique and handsome machine.
No offence to Black Prince. The B12 is the flagship of the NNR.
It probably was, but this wasn’t a factor back then, loads of Mk.1 coaches and DMU cars were being bought for preservation with asbestos in them right through the 80s at least.
I think one of the biggest omissions is the lack of a class 128/129 parcels DMU in preservation. The last 128s weren’t scrapped until 1991 and these had more powerful engines than a regular DMU so one would have been perfectly capable of hauling a couple of carriages around a preserved railway. I’m surprised nobody bought one.
Wouldn't disagree with that at all.
Found a link which explains much of the saga... Interesting reading...
Would make an interesting book.
I’d love to read an in depth history of the NNR from the conception of the M&GN Society up to the present day
In the early 1970s the SVR had many of the locos at Barry examined by a T.G. Dentith, who I believe was a fairly senior former BR traction engineer. I was given a copy for the use of the NYMR group that I founded to purchase a standard 2-6-4T (which turned out to be 80135) but it is striking that the bulk of the information collated in the report was the thickness of tyres and whether or not a loco had a complete set of motion!
It is also interesting to note that the report focused mainly on the smaller engines in the yard, only mentioning bigger engines if they were seen to be in exceptional condition. It's an interesting piece of documentation that refutes PaulHitch's regular assertions that Barry preservationists were obsessed with big engines. I may still have a copy somewhere, if I can find it I'll scan and put it on the board for all to access - don't hold your breath, though!
That sounds like a fascinating document to pick over! And yes, if you look at the dates of "rescue" the small engines had all gone before all the medium engines had, and likewise wit the big ones.
The thing to remember is that although boilerwork, for example was expensive, there were companies about that would take it on, Granted NOT to the standard that We would expect now,and the road steam people had taught Us that things like re-tubing could be done in the back garden (OK on a steam roller rather than a Black 5, but I would imagine that You get the point) BUT where would you obtain the bronze to make a big end bearing? We didn't have the disposable income to give to charity like we have now, and whilst heavy industry had the machinery and capability to forge connecting rods, for example, they were also so busy that such a thing would be regarded as a 'Job' and priced likewise, tales of going to have a chat with the foreman might have got you a usable 'Offcut' of (insert appropriate material) but it wouldn't have got You access to His non ferrous scrap box
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