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LMS 2P 4-4-0

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by joshs, Dec 30, 2012.

  1. BrightonBaltic

    BrightonBaltic Member

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    And we have a grand total of fifteen examples out of 353 2MTs (of all four classes) built. Just under 4.25%. Pitiful.
     
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  2. The Saggin' Dragon

    The Saggin' Dragon Part of the furniture Staff Member Moderator

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    Not really sure what your point is, the locos that survived did so largely by chance, there was little or no thought given to practicality at the time. You cant change that, no matter how much it might seem illogical to you.
    The fact that a few folk want to restore a 4F doesn't really detract from other projects, there is no guarantee that they would give their time or money to your particular favourite in other circumstances.
     
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  3. MarkinDurham

    MarkinDurham Member

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    Hammer, nail, head.

    Mark
     
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  4. Dunfanaghy Road

    Dunfanaghy Road Member

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    The ganger of Frimley Aqueduct PW gang in the 1970s had started as a fireman at Heaton Mersey. Said exactly the same about 4Fs / 3Fs.
    Pat
     
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  5. pmh_74

    pmh_74 Member

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    I can’t argue with your other points but the Robinson locos were designed to the GCR loading gauge which is no more or less generous than any other loading gauge of the era. Yes the London Extension has wide-ish bridges compared to some lines but ‘continental loading gauge’ is a myth; no such loading gauge even existed back then. I defy anyone to take one of the Nene Valley’s continental coaches to Quorn and take it to Loughborough by rail without taking the roof off. Even the little NSB 2-6-0 which was at the GCR in the 70s couldn’t run until the platform edge stones at Quorn were moved inwards.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  6. LMS2968

    LMS2968 Part of the furniture

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    I admit the GCR isn't my area of expertise and bow to superior knowledge.

    My understanding though was that the London Extension was built in the expectation of the opening of a Channel Tunnel and the loading gauge designed to accommodate European vehicles, or is that another myth?
     
  7. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    Something of a myth. See this page (https://www.devboats.co.uk/gwdrawings/loadinggauges.php). Hat tip to @Jimc.

    Tom
     
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  8. misspentyouth62

    misspentyouth62 Member

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    which 2MTs specifically have you in mind of justifying greater priority over something else - and specifically what else?
     
  9. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Who's fault is that though? Not the preservationists, virtually everything that survived scrapping past 1970ish survives today does it not? And as @Jamessquared has helpfully demonstrated in the past, when it came to rescuing steam locomotives from Barry Scrapyard, the smallest ones went first, followed by medium, leaving the big ones 'til there was nothing else left.
     
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  10. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    Don’t let the facts get in the way of a good old rant though ...

    Tom
     
  11. Reformed Sniper

    Reformed Sniper New Member

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    The fact is that without one scrapyard in Wales and a hell of a lot of effort from the preservation movement there would be very little left of our steam heritage. We should cherish each and every steam locomotive that has made it to 2020 regardless of any supposed flaws. To suggest otherwise is, frankly, idiotic.
     
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  12. Cartman

    Cartman Member

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    If all we had were 2MTs on heritage lines, it would be like the real railway where virtually every Loco you see is a 66.
     
  13. S.A.C. Martin

    S.A.C. Martin Part of the furniture

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    You say that Andy but I’ve found a large body of evidence that suggests footplatemen can be entirely parochial...!
     
  14. Spamcan81

    Spamcan81 Nat Pres stalwart

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    Another thing our Baltic friend fails to appreciate is that no matter how "useless" a loco was on the big railway, it will still be eminently suitable for working a heritage railway.
     
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  15. paulhitch

    paulhitch Guest

    I am not so sure this is entirely so. 41313 hung around at Barry for a considerable time before the Ivatt Trust came looking for spares. The "story goes" they were persuaded to buy the whole machine by D. Woodham, rather than components thereof. Perhaps we can get back to the original topic.
     
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  16. S.A.C. Martin

    S.A.C. Martin Part of the furniture

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    And how boring would that be?
     
  17. paulhitch

    paulhitch Guest

    Rather less boring than Bulleids. Most of the paying customers would not care any
    way.
     
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  18. garth manor

    garth manor Member

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  19. Jimc

    Jimc Part of the furniture

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    Continental gauge is indeed a myth, but inches count in this game, and there was a lot of variation at the inch level. Amongst gauges I've been able to find dimensions for rail to platform horizontal measurement, for instance, varied from 2ft2¾ on the LNWR and NER, to 2ft5½ on the LSWR. The biggest variations of all were in eaves height, which is what's giving container traffic all those headaches now.
     
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  20. 35B

    35B Resident of Nat Pres

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    As much to the point, would our view of railway heritage be any less one-eyed?
     

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