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Last Chance Hotel?

Discussion in 'Narrow Gauge Railways' started by lynton&barnstaple, Jul 18, 2010.

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  1. Nexuas

    Nexuas New Member

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    That has the elements of a WHHR management press release, just a minute element of the truth, but a whole lot more left unsaid.

    Heritage trains have run on the Rhe, but there is currently not a regular heritage service. Yes you can ride in a heritage carriage on an NGG16 or Funkey hauled train, but there is not a regular timetabled heritage train using a small engine and a handful of heritage carriages. (I know the old WHR went bust running small locos and a handful of carriages) I think this is an experience that some people want to have, there is a market for it and it is one which appears to be currently neglected. The WHHR could help complete this aim, the FR could do it on their own, but at the moment no one is doing it!!!

    Anyone who is expect things to change overnight is a bit deluded, if the WHHR's position is to change it will happen slowly. If the FR are to work with this change this will also take time. It may well be the FR's position relies on the WHHR not calling it's bluff and compromising... There could be a major panic at harbor station if the WHHR turned up cap in hand willing to do a deal on their terms.

    Remember tomorrow is the first day of the rest of our lives...
     
  2. lynton&barnstaple

    lynton&barnstaple New Member

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    A great deal of importance is being placed on 'heritage trains'. One has to say that the FR has made huge contributions to heritage narrow gauge. Seeing the wonderfully restored vintage coaches that get attached to FR trains, as an example, attests to this. Nevertheless, I would always choose one of the modern coaches to ride in for comfort, the tea trolly etc.

    The remaining original WHR coaches, are, to say the least, damned uncomfortable if very pretty. I would hate to take a round trip on the RhE in one of them. There may be a very small number of enthusiasts who would elect to take a 'heritage train' over the length of the line on special occasions but I doubt that a regular service would attract patronage.

    We are really talking about Russell, which still seems a country mile away from completion. Given the choice of riding behind the replica of 'Lew' or 'Russell', right now, I think 'Lew' would win hands down.
     
  3. SpudUk

    SpudUk Member

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    Of course you would say that 'lynton&barnstaple'
     
  4. lostlogin

    lostlogin New Member

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    A complete round trip may be too much, especially as below Dinas is not original track bed, but properly marketed I am sure there are punters. The Talyllyn outside peak I think run a heritage/vintage train, I am not sure if there is a premium to travel I have not checked, and have done so now for several years. Presummably there is therefore a market for it or they would not run.

    The difference between a regular TR train and a hertitage/vintage one is probably not that huge at times as like the FR they use their original stock in regular service. The difference on the WHR would at present be much larger and accordingly the appeal may therefore be that much greater. However I doubt if it is anywhere presently in the FR thinking as they will be concentrating on running through to Port and having enough stock to cope with hoped for demand.

    With regard to comfort of carriages then I will accept you at your word but I have to admit that on the FR I find some of the original stock more comfortable than the modern. Even in my younger days I was not built to perch on some of the narrower seating in the corridor stock
     
  5. SpudUk

    SpudUk Member

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    Corridor stock on narrow gauge can be very bad. I remember visiting the FR when I was young and feeling so crampt just so there could be a corridor that no-one could really ever walk down!!

    There is definately money in a WHR heritage train, just as there was money in the W&LLR forking out to build a brand new heritage set of Pickerings!!
     
  6. SillyBilly

    SillyBilly New Member

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    There is very little money in heritage trains in comparison to the bigger picture, that's why they run big trains, just like that piece in SR £270k on tiny heritage trains, £2m or was it 3 on big trains.
     
  7. Nexuas

    Nexuas New Member

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    I assume the die has now been cast, not sure how it will have fallen?
     
  8. Christopher125

    Christopher125 Member

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    As far as im aware, they didnt - the money was donated.

    Chris
     
  9. SpudUk

    SpudUk Member

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    But it must of been of suitable benifit to warrent the expenditure...
     
  10. Christopher125

    Christopher125 Member

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    I believe they are mainly used for special events, which is why they could only be justified if someone else paid for them. As beautiful as the Pickerings are, the more modern foreign carriages are more practical.

    Chris
     
  11. AndrewT

    AndrewT New Member

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    The third Pickering should be outshopped from Blodge next week. It is drop-dead gorgeous.
     
  12. Russel does look a country mile from completion however john look closley and it isnt!
     
  13. SpudUk

    SpudUk Member

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    They carge a premium to ride in the pickerings don't they? Surely thats all the WHHR want to do? The odd Special with heritage stock charing a premium price? They don't expect access to a lot of the line do they? I would have thought a junction station between the WHHR/WHR would work better then WHHR getting access to quite a large portion of the line as they lack the resources to operate it properly, stock wise...surely?

    The foreign stock are also lovely...I must admit I do like all the W&L's stock, and is a lovely line to ride on. Where do the Hungarian coaches come from? Might be doing a road trip next year and would like to see as much narrow gauge on the way as possible...
     
  14. lynton&barnstaple

    lynton&barnstaple New Member

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    As I understand it, WHHR was originally offered the opportunity of operating occasional heritage specials over RhE starting at Harbour Station.
    WHHR now seem to be insisting on being able to operate a scheduled service between their station and Port Croesor, which is something quite different.
    Does anyone know how the AGM went?
     
  15. AndrewT

    AndrewT New Member

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    The silence from the other end of town is deafening.
     
  16. lostlogin

    lostlogin New Member

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    Which may also have been a preferable response from yourself. Maybe you wish for there to be no resolution and you do not wish to see WHHR stock running on the WHR under any terms but this is an example, whether deliberate or not, of the sort of comment that as an outsider I do really does wish to see.

    If there is ever to be any chance of a resolution there will have to be talks and the parties will have to kiss and make up as in any relationship the longer before either side starts biting its tongue the longer before there is any chance that might happen. When I see comments such as yours, whether accurate or not, all I think that is going to do nothing to help bring the other party round to your view point and why for once can somebody not set an example and show they are better than the rest and keep quiet.

    I appreciate that may not have been your attention as I note you seem to enjoy short pithy responses on here but in my view often they do not come across well on a Forum in that on a first reading they can seem or slightly snide or condesending.
     
  17. TonyW

    TonyW New Member

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    AndrewT is the Ffestiniog Railway's Press Officer.
     
  18. lynton&barnstaple

    lynton&barnstaple New Member

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    "there will have to be talks and the parties will have to kiss and make up"

    Lostlogin,
    The thing you still seem to be missing here is that this is not necessarily a dispute that the FR/RhE needs to resolve. For any agreement between parties, each side needs to have something that the other wants.

    As far as I can see, there is nothing that the WHHR can offer which is of vital importance to the operation of the RhE.
     
  19. lostlogin

    lostlogin New Member

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    I appreciate that basically it is the WHHR who have much to gain and the WHR/FR little or nothing. I also appreciate that the WHR/FR can carry on regardless of the WHHR.

    I like to think though, and I may be very naive, that the FR or many of them are enthusiasts just like most of us are. If not they would not run galas like the quirks and curiosity weekend, done a superb job on some of their vintage coaches etc. Accordingly I like to think that they would actually like to see Russell and a rake of heritage/vintage coaches whether original or replica one day running through the Aberglaslyn past. Even if only as part of a gala and on terms argreeable to the FR. That is only ever going to happen if both parties one day can sit down and talk amicable.
     
  20. Idriverussell

    Idriverussell New Member

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    That explains why the FR's PR is so good!
     
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