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L B & S C R in Lancashire

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by 67379, Jun 27, 2017.

  1. 67379

    67379 New Member

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    In 1947 the private Whittingham Asylum Railway that ran from Grimsargh on the Preston to Longridge branch to the large County Mental Hospital at Whittingham bought a surplus D1 class 0-4-2T from the Southern Railway. Formerly LB&SCR "Riddlesdown" it was re-named "James Fryars" and ran on the line until withdrawn with boiler problems in 1956 - a year before the line's closure. My question - does anyone know of a photo of it from the Right Hand Side during it's time on the line?
     
  2. Cartman

    Cartman Member

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    There is a picture of it in "Railways in East Lancashire" By Martin Bairstow. I have never understood why they went all the way to the Southern for a loco, surely the LMS would have had something suitable? After the D1 was withdrawn in 1956, its replacement for the final 18 months of the line's operation was an 0-4-0 Sentinel from Bolton Gas Works
     
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  3. LMS2968

    LMS2968 Part of the furniture

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    BRILL in its very early days did a feature on that line, there might be one in there. I'll see if I can find it later.
     
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  4. The Saggin' Dragon

    The Saggin' Dragon Part of the furniture Staff Member Moderator

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    Probably went to a loco dealer?
     
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  5. marshall5

    marshall5 Well-Known Member

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    As I understand it the loco was purchased directly from the S.R. As for a photo will this do?
    Ray. D1 at Whittingham.jpg
     
  6. Cartman

    Cartman Member

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    It was also the last D1 class by a few years. The final ones were withdrawn by BR in 1951. This loco, all the way from the Southern, turning up in Lancashire, is just one of those fantastic oddities which makes the steam railway so endlessly fascinating.
     
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  7. LMS2968

    LMS2968 Part of the furniture

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    It was BRILL Vol 3 No 3 December 1993. There are three photos of the LBSCR tank, two show the left side and the other is almost head on. All were by F W Shuttleworth.
     
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  8. marshall5

    marshall5 Well-Known Member

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    Apologies for the over-brief reply earlier - I was just on my way out when I saw Mike's question and can now add a little more information regarding the CMHW's acquisition of 'Riddlesdown'.
    According to Cornwell's "The history of the Whittingham Hospital Railway 1884-1957" (an excellent read BTW) a 3 man sub committee inspected 2357 at Ashford works and, in Dec 1946, offered the S.R. 750 pounds for it plus delivery charges and the cost of minor repairs. The S.R. accepted the offer and Riddlesdown was towed as part of a freight working to Grimsargh in March 1947. It seems that the Visiting Committee (whoever they were) had contacted all the Big 4 companies but the Southern were the only one to reply. They had previously contacted several loco manufacturers for a new loco but none were available at the time. Even war surplus Austerities were only for "customers of national importance"! Re named James Fryers the loco worked until Nov 1955 when it was withdrawn for boiler repairs which were never carried out and the remains scrapped in 1957.
    I was lucky enough to visit the line shortly before it closed and rode in one of the 3 ex LNWR brake vans (which served as carriages) behind the sole remaining loco ex Bolton gasworks Sentinel 'Gradwell'. Some 30 yrs ago I wrote an article about the railway for the Liverpool Loco Group magazine - I still have a copy so will see if it will scan. The Ribble Steam Railway mag has also carried articles about the line e.g. https://ribblesteam.wordpress.com/2...sary-of-closure-whittingham-hospital-railway/
    Another photo of the D1, in happier times, at Grimsargh - the junction with BR's Longridge branch.
    Ray.
    . D1 at Grimsargh.jpg
     
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  9. Ploughman

    Ploughman Well-Known Member

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    Probably the same reason some SR locos ended up at Skinningrove Steel Works.
     
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  10. Cartman

    Cartman Member

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    One also ended up at Haydock Colliery
     
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  11. 67379

    67379 New Member

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    Last edited: Jun 27, 2017
  12. 67379

    67379 New Member

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    Have been on site today - I live in Horwich, not that far away, and I called in on the way back from seeing the 8f at Hellifield. I understood that the only remains were bridge abutments and platform supports at Whittingham station and a few embankment remains en route - but was amazed to find the loco shed still standing at the still intact and used maintenance yard/boiler room site.

    [​IMG]
     
  13. marshall5

    marshall5 Well-Known Member

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    Glad the photo was of use, Mike. According to Cornwell's history the loco arrived in Maunsell unlined green still carrying its Southern lettering and number on the sidetanks and was repainted with lining at Whittingham. Casserley's photo of it in 1932 clearly shows lining so maybe in the intervening 14 yrs it was repainted - possibly when it was used as a fire fighting loco during WW2. It appears that the air braking equipment was removed between 1/9/51 and 1/5/54.
    What scale are you thinking of for your model? I'd thought of doing one in '0' scale. Meteor did a D1 kit but I believe the range of kits was acquired by Ace although it doesn't currently appear on their website. 'Home of 0 gauge' also did one years ago but their range went to Redcraft who normally only supply models RTR. Northampton Model Supplies do a 100HP sentinel kit (the former Meteor one) if you want a model of Gradwell but it did have 'mixed' reviews.
    Hope this helps.
    Ray.
     
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  14. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    Cannock and Rugely Colliery got a Stroudley E tank as well ...

    Bradley quotes £745 as the price, and that "inspection showed the boiler, firebox and cylinders to be reasonably sound" with the repairs "to the boxes, tubes and brake gear". Prior to its sale, it had been at Ashford supplying steam to the works.

    Tom
     
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  15. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    Edit: Misread Ray's post ...

    Anyway, there's a photo here:

    https://mikemorant.smugmug.com/Trai...aneous/Private-and-light-railways/i-FLwd74r/A

    BTW, is there any evidence it actually carried a name while at Whittingham? Doesn't appear to have one in any of the photos I have seen - perhaps it was just an informal name/

    Tom
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2017
  16. 67379

    67379 New Member

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    I'm keeping it fairly simple - a South Eastertn Finecast kit with chassis in OO. I'd said I wouldn't make another model after doing a belpaire L&Y Radial Tank in brass a few years ago (built at home in Horwich!). This, I suppose, is the next one............

    I've already noted that a LNWR 4-wheel brake van kit is available should I want to do the whole train.....I do, however, have a full size 2' gauge Ruston to repair (hole in radiator) on the West Lancs LR, so I'd better not get too bogged down on the modelling board!
     
  17. 67379

    67379 New Member

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    The name was on the small oval plaque on the side tanks. Staff knew it as "Jimmy Fryer" - apparently the man was called "Fryer", not "Fryers"..he was an Alderman who was president of the visiting committee.
     
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  18. marshall5

    marshall5 Well-Known Member

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    Deleted.
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2017
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  19. And another example of its habit of having a 'prototype for everything', which would add interest to a model railway and which uninformed commentators would loudly proclaim is 'wrong'!
     
  20. marshall5

    marshall5 Well-Known Member

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    Like the USA tank based at Bank Hall (Liverpool) in 1955 or the ex Caley 0-4-0ST based at Preston around the mid 50's also!
    Ray.
     

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