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Jacobite 2024

Discussion in 'What's Going On' started by alastair, Nov 29, 2023.

  1. 2857Harry

    2857Harry Well-Known Member

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    Observed having lovely chats saying “Give us MK1s back ya b**tards” ;) Jokes of course before anyone says anything!
     
  2. Andy Williams

    Andy Williams Well-Known Member

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    Interestingly, I see that that the new LSL Generator coach is CDL fitted.
     
  3. Charles Parry

    Charles Parry Member

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  4. RalphW

    RalphW Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Administrator Friend

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    I see Green Signals WCR hater gets his oar in. It's not as if any attempt was made to hide the occurrence.
     
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  5. richards

    richards Part of the furniture

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    I felt their reaction was more "not again" rather than hating. It does seem to be one thing after another with WCR.
     
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  6. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

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    It is a curious one given that had the train been travelling chimney first then the smokebox would have had to be level with the 'STOP' board and that is a harder distance to judge compared with when it's just a tender's length to get right from where the driver is positioned.
     
  7. acorb

    acorb Part of the furniture

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    The Scotsman is the Daily Express of the Scottish media I'm afraid and loves a bit of click bait. Nigel Harris seems also to be trying to drum up a bit of traffic for his new venture, with eye catching headlines and a bit of controversy.
    Look beyond the hyperbole and the reality is that this isn't a big incident (pretty common on the big railway) and West Coast have followed procedure.
    I am more than happy to criticise West Coast when they score an own goal, I don't think this is one of them.
     
  8. Gladiator 5076

    Gladiator 5076 Resident of Nat Pres

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    No I agree. Although if you read some other forums (including the one where our esteemed member for Grantham is a moderator) all incidents such as SPAD'S or overspeeds are down to OAO's, FOC,s or the likes of charter operators, i.e. anyone who is not what I would call an ex Franchise TOC.
     
  9. 30567

    30567 Part of the furniture Friend

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    It will be interesting to see how much airtime Green Signals gives to the report on the SPAD at Craven Arms which is at a totally different level of seriousness to the one at Morar. I suppose steam sells clicks, as does HS2.
     
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  10. peckett

    peckett Member

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    Any member not familiar with Morar ,this is 45212 going the other way ,stop board on the right .
     

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  11. 5944

    5944 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Quite. A train going 20' past a stop board protecting a very minor road is a bit different to the potentially very serious SPAD at Craven Arms. 359 times the emergency override switch had been operated to activate the crossing in less than 3 years. That's absolutely disgraceful.
     
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  12. Johnb

    Johnb Nat Pres stalwart

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    Considering the level of operations WC undertake, not just steam and the well over 30 years of age operation of the Jacobite I think that’s a bit of an exaggeration.
     
  13. 35B

    35B Nat Pres stalwart

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    Trains are driven by humans, and humans make mistakes. Whether the SPAD at Morar is a something or nothing depends on the specific circumstances, not who they work for or which news outlet picks up on it.

    I'm then left with a couple of thoughts:
    1. LSL is owned by someone with media interests, and a vested interest in WCRC appearing weak
    2. Craven Arms suggests a collapsed safety culture, and something that frankly leaves me surprised that the Safety Digest remained a Safety Digest
    3. The full RAIB report into the 2nd overspeed at Spital Junction highlights just how easily drivers can make mistakes.
     
  14. richards

    richards Part of the furniture

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    Would be interesting to know how often other railtour operators have had SPADs.
     
  15. acorb

    acorb Part of the furniture

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    I don't know of any other railtour operators that run a daily passenger service, so comparison would be irrelevant.
    I am sure the ORR will look at any anomalies and act accordingly.
     
  16. acorb

    acorb Part of the furniture

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    Nail on head. Which is why this is a non story.
    West Coast have had their corporate issues aplenty, this isn't one of them. Not wishing to speculate as to cause, but human error / misjudgment isn't a culture issue - which this article is trying to insinuate.
    By reporting the incident West Coast have followed procedure exactly as they should, which if anything demonstrates them abiding by the rules!!
     
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  17. 35B

    35B Nat Pres stalwart

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    Half true.

    With no comment for or against WCRC, I will just observe that reporting an incident in a public place with witnesses doesn’t say anything about root cause. For it to be evidence of anything, we would need further information.


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  18. acorb

    acorb Part of the furniture

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    It is up to the ORR to establish root cause which they will do in due course & I will not speculate further. My issue is media trying to link this incident with other ongoing issues, for which there no apparent evidence or connection.
     
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  19. henrywinskill

    henrywinskill Well-Known Member

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    The media only crawl out of the gutter when there is a chance of speculating. This incident is a private matter between ORR and WCR and will be brought to (hopefully) a happy conclusion.
     
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  20. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

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    I agree with that. Stopping in the correct place has become a key requirement on the network especially now that we have an increasing number of stations with platform markings to show where particular carriages will stop. Of course, the driver is usually at the head of the set of coaches. A steam charter just doesn't fit that model as there is always something (boiler or tender) ahead of the driver and the end stopping point.

    Given that the return Jacobite is booked to pause at Morar I am sure that it matters precisely where the train stops. I have more than a degree of sympathy for a driver who is controlling the brake by looking one way when his controls are in the other direction. It was just a mistake and only a 20 ft one at that.
     

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