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Industrial Loco Updates

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by AlistairS, Apr 17, 2008.

  1. alexl102

    alexl102 Member

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    Further to my previous post, it appears HC 1366 is up for sale as the owner had an agreement with Tanfield that they could run it for 10 years, then had to hand it back ‘ex-works’. They’ve done this, and the owner has now decided to sell it now as a fully restored and working loco due to his age/health, rather than waiting another 10 years and selling it when in need of overhaul.

    In other Hudswell Clarke news, HC 750 Waleswood, the 0-4-0ST previously based at the Chasewater Railway in Staffordshire, is moving to a new home at Peak Rail in Derbyshire. She was on a low-loader this afternoon so I imagine arriving tonight or tomorrow morning!
     
  2. sleepermonster

    sleepermonster Member

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    Bagnall 2746 The Duke

    Vacuum drip valves at last! Delivered by LMS at Loughborough and fitted to the locomotive as in the photograph. Various piping and other components are still being made and fitted by the 8F at weekends and EVR staff during the week, but these are all but complete and the loco is operable. There is one fairly major item left, which is the installation of the concrete arch in the firebox. We have the fire cement on site, and an arch former is coming on loan next week; Simon Scott has arranged to borrow a concrete mixer. The loco will be in service at half term, but only really as a carriage heater, with most of the work to be done by a class 14 at the other end.

    Regards,

    Tim
     

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  3. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    A question for those knowledgeable about industrial locos.

    I came across these two Sentinels at Coalbrookdale this week:

    IMG_1769.jpeg

    The question is - what are they?

    Preserved British Locos says the one on the left is No. 6155 which "[...] was converted from a traditionally designed steam locomotive with a horizontal boiler which was powered via the cylinders to one with a vertical boiler using a chain drive to both axles. The conversion was undertaken by Sentinel in the 1920s, presumably after Sentinel Industrial Locomotives Ltd had been established in 1925. [...] The locomotive spent its working life under the ownership of the Coalbrookdale Co Ltd where it was no 5."

    The one on the right is said to be No. 6185 "Preserved Sentinel vertical boilered steam 0-4-0VBT loco No.6185 of 1925, originally built as Coalbrookdale Iron Works 0-4-0ST No.5 of 1865 and rebuilt by Sentinel [...] The locomotive spent its working life under the ownership of the Coalbrookdale Co Ltd where it was no 5. "

    So something seems garbled there. Firstly, presumably both locos can't simultaneously have been No. 5 (That looks like a cut and paste error to me - quite possible one of them was given No. 5 after the original 1860s loco was sold, but not both). More significantly, the original Coalbrookdale No. 5 still survives (indeed, is about 200 yards away from this pair!) So the story that 6155 was converted from the original No. 5 (i.e. presumably adding new boiler and machinery on the existing Victorian frames) cannot be correct either.

    IMG_1745.jpeg IMG_1747.jpeg

    So can anyone deconvolute the history?

    Tom
     
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  4. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    According to the IRS pocketbook, Sentinel 6155 was a rebuild of MW437/1873 and Sentinel 6185 was a rebuild of Coalbrookdale No6 of c 1865. The Coalbrookdale loco is No.5, also of c1865. That does make more sense that the info that you gleaned from the Preserved British Locos website.
     
  5. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    Thanks Steve - that makes more sense. The frame of 6185 seems to be quite similar to the existing frame on Coalbrookdale No. 5, in as much as I could see of it.

    Tom
     
  6. marshall5

    marshall5 Part of the furniture

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    I took a couple of photos of S6185 and Coalbrookdale No.5 in July 1975 and the first photo shows pretty clearly the frame cut outs for the cylinders.
    Ray.
    Just noticed that the same worksplate appears on the sandbox of both locos.
    02.75.16 S6185 Coalbrookdale  7.75.jpg 02.75.19 Coalbrookdale No5 1865 7.75.jpg
     
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  7. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    Should have mentioned in my last post that Manning Wardle 437 was of their class H. A similar (but later) class H was rebuilt by Sentinel and is still with us in that form and in working order, albeit currently under overhaul, in the form of Gervase.
    It’s in the back of my mind that the engine unit from S 6155 ended up in Sentinel 6515 Isebrook No.2 but I can’t lay my hand on a reference and I may be wrong in this. @Eightpot of this parish may be able to confirm or deny.
     
  8. Fireline

    Fireline Well-Known Member

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    I am not 100% either, but I think that might have been the engine from Dom. Certainly Dom went to Quainton, and parts of it ended up on another Sentinel.
     
  9. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    Thinking about it, you’re probably right about Dom being the donor.
     
  10. clinker

    clinker Member

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    As I understand it, Dom was sold by the KESR in good faith to 'Quainton Road' around 1970, only the engine unit was salvaged and the rest of Dom was weighed in. (I have heard that the scrapping happened en route to Quainton)
     
  11. peckett

    peckett Member

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    According to the first edition of Ironstone Railways and Tramways (Eric Tonks 1959 ) No 2 Isebrook Sent 6515 /1926 ,Ex GWR 12 was sold to T E Grays Burton Latimer via Sentinals.No date given. I can remember this loco out of use at the end of their sidings by the main line. Scrapped by Reddens of Wellingboro in 1956.There is also a 1947 photo in IRT of No2 with the engine missing. Another one of their loco's was Ancoats MW 1091 /1888 ,which was rebuilt with a Sentinal boiler from a steam lorry in 1928, at Blackwells of Northampton .Their engineer later went to work for Sentinals at Shrewsbury ..Blackwells done a lot of loco' work, they repaired all the boilers from the South Durham Steel and Iron Co 's loco's in Northamptonshire. Photo attached of No5 on a wet IRS visit to Ellis and Everard Quarries ,Bardon Hill Leicester .16/06/1956.
     

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  12. marshall5

    marshall5 Part of the furniture

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    A little bit more about Dom here https://newsite.dockyardrailway.co.uk/?page_id=52 including when/where it was scrapped "In June 1962, It moved again, this time to the Kent & East Sussex Railway where it remained until March 1973 when it was sent to Aylesbury Scrap Metals, Griffin Lane, Aylesbury for scrapping. The locomotive was scrapped in April 1973. It is known that the crankcase of No. 6994 is in use in Sentinel No. 6515."
    Ray.
     
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  13. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    I don't know about S 6515 being scrapped by Reddens in 1956 but it was certainly extent at Thomas Grays in the 1970's and later went on to preservation. I understand that the engine unit and boiler was removed at some point in time and this may have been in 1956.
     
  14. peckett

    peckett Member

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  15. peckett

    peckett Member

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    Yes ,it was Ancoats that was scrapped in 1956.And the photo in IRT is also of Ancoats.
     
  16. clinker

    clinker Member

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    Ancoats was probably the first locomotive to be 'Converted' to a Sentinel, but I'm of a mind that it would have been earlier than 1928. I believe that this was before Sentinel built any loco's themselves. The Engineer at Blackwells was Kyrle Willians, uncle of LTC Rolt. Willians went on to set up the Sentinel locomotive division. Ancoats was probably fitted with the boiler and engine from an early Sentinel wagon, which would have meant that there was only one 'notch' in reverse, the Sentinel loco engines were similar to the 'Super Sentinel' wagon engine but without the crankshaft differential. These later (1923 til about 1928) Sentinel engines had two crankcase mounted camshafts (inlet and exhaust) which gave them enough 'room' to have cams allowing two notches in both forward and reverse although the road wagons still only had one reverse notch.
     
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  17. clinker

    clinker Member

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    Is it worth pointing out that Aylesbury is considerably nearer to Quainton Road than it is to Rolvenden?
     
  18. Miff

    Miff Part of the furniture Friend

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    Page 5 of the Tenterden Terrier (Issue no. 1, Spring 1973) shows at that time KESR believed the whole loco was going to Quainton. Maybe the new owner had other ideas.
    https://kesr.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/03/1-Spring-1973.pdf
     
  19. clinker

    clinker Member

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    I was certainly under the impression that Dom had been sold in good faith, but sadly things didn't work that way. I suppose that in a way it could be said that 1973 is 50 years ago, but the Preservation scene as We know it is now well over 60 years old.
     
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  20. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    I’m sure that back in the late 60’s/early 70’s several supposedly preserved locos were sold in good faith but then scrapped by their new owners. The Titanic Steamship Co and a Keith Rose come to mind.
     
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