If you register, you can do a lot more. And become an active part of our growing community. You'll have access to hidden forums, and enjoy the ability of replying and starting conversations.

Frankenbardic ?

Discussion in 'Railwayana' started by Snifter, Oct 23, 2017.

  1. Snifter

    Snifter Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2014
    Messages:
    1,332
    Likes Received:
    3,485
    Gender:
    Male
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    As the nights draw in, I was thinking about upgrading my Bardic lamp to LED. There have been a few posts on this over the years however as technology in this area is moving at pace, has anyone done a seriously powerful upgrade recently ? Has anyone gone to 9 volts or more ? The good news is that modern LEDs seem to handle either polarity as Bardics were assembled for filament bubs where +/- didn't matter
     
  2. TseTT

    TseTT New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2011
    Messages:
    66
    Likes Received:
    37
    I fitted a LED replacement bulb for my lamp. Its similar to this. Ebay 272804638344. or search for LED torch bulb.
    Mine is the 1 watt version, there was a 0.5 watt version available, but sold out.
    A couple of drawbacks are that the colours are a little washed out and also when the battery runs low it just goes out without warning.
    There does seem to be a 3 watt version available now. That would, I assume really wash the colours out.
    However the lamp is really useful to actually see with now.
     
  3. Snifter

    Snifter Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2014
    Messages:
    1,332
    Likes Received:
    3,485
    Gender:
    Male
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Thank you Mr TseTT,

    Washout with the green filter is a bit of a problem, even with a normal bulb. I was on the footplate last Saturday night and the green lamp from the guard was a bit ambiguous at times, more like white with a green tinge. I did a bit of research and it appears that there is a translucent green paint that is compatible with the Perspex filters. Others have applied a coat to darken the green with good results. It is from Tamiya (code 81525 I think) and is a water based acrylic resin so will not damage the filter, in theory.

    I think I have identified the best replacement LED bulb however the excellent folk at Maplins appear not to carry it as standard stock. I'll try to get hold of one and if it works, I'll post the details here.

    As for the battery, a good boy scout always carries a spare.
     
  4. 32110

    32110 Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2006
    Messages:
    554
    Likes Received:
    496
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired from full time paid work
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    I have fitted a 3 watt Cree led. As you say the green is a bit washed out. On suggestions from others I used 2 coats of docfafts Artiste Aniseed Green transparent glass paint that I got from The Range.
     
  5. Snifter

    Snifter Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2014
    Messages:
    1,332
    Likes Received:
    3,485
    Gender:
    Male
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Glass paint can contain solvents which may damage the plastic so beware. I understand that if the filter gets damaged then it's easier to find a new lamp than a filter.
     
  6. 32110

    32110 Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2006
    Messages:
    554
    Likes Received:
    496
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired from full time paid work
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    The paint I referred to in my post above is a water based glass paint so I don't think it will damage the plastic filter.
     
  7. burgerbern

    burgerbern New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2018
    Messages:
    22
    Likes Received:
    4
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Norwich
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    I have used that docrafts water based paint as well and it works well, i converted all 3 of my bardics by converting from the dry cell battery to a 3"D" cell holder with rechargeable NIMH batteries and tried a LED lamp in the one i painted the green filter with the docrafts paint, it works well
     
  8. Grashopper

    Grashopper New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2011
    Messages:
    267
    Likes Received:
    86
    Occupation:
    Assistant FLeet engineer Southern Railway
    Location:
    Surrey
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    One of our drivers did an LED upgrade and went the whole hog and installed a rechargeable Lithium Ion battery. He hasn't charged it in 6 months and its still good, plus a whole lot lighter too. Bardic has a nice little recharge socket on it.
     
  9. John Baritone

    John Baritone New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2018
    Messages:
    140
    Likes Received:
    133
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Buxton
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    I upgraded my Bardics to LED lamps. The LEDs were made by Nicelite, and supplied by BikeCo. Nicelite have the following note on their website:

    "BARDIC SIGNAL LANTERNS work well with the white NL322 on clear and filters. Some Bardic green filters are rather weak and can be made denser with stained glass paint to avoid being "washed out" by the high brightness and whiteness of NL322. The alternative NL312 are used to preserve filter colour density on several preservation heritage railways and railroads."

    On mine, sure enough, I found the red and yellow aspects were fine, but the green was really washed out, as Snifter notes - more like white with a tinge of green. So I got some water based glass paint from a company called Curtis Ward (they do art supplies). The paint in question was made by Docrafts, and it's Aniseed Green Transparent Glass Paint. Being water-based, it didn't harm the filter at all, and is very translucent, so it didn't dim the output, either.

    Two coats did the trick, so the green light is now clearly green! (links below)

    http://www.reflectalite.com/LEDpage.html

    http://www.bikeco.co.uk/index.php?mod=productDetail&itemid=454

    https://www.curtisward.com/aquaglass.html

    HTH

    PS - I've been running my Bardic (with LED) on an Ever Ready AD.28 battery now for three years, and it's still going strong.
     
  10. marty

    marty New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2018
    Messages:
    25
    Likes Received:
    57
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    The Sunny East.
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Washed out colours with LEDs are mainly due to the temperature (colour) of the light changing. Incandescant bulbs give a yellow tinged light (that we percieve as white) so the green looks ok. With led, the colour is white, not yellow so green filter appears washed out as it was never designed for this temperature of light. Green colourwash sounds a good idea.

    The effect is best illustrated by looking at led and conventional filament headlamps at night. The latter appear visibly more yellow when compared side by side. But we percieve them both as white when seen individually.
     
    John Baritone likes this.
  11. The Green Howards

    The Green Howards Part of the furniture Friend

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2016
    Messages:
    10,001
    Likes Received:
    4,830
    Occupation:
    Layabout
    Location:
    Lurking
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    You're getting your definition of 'white' confused with colour temperature. A 'white' light is one where all the wavelengths of the visible spectrum are at equal intensity, but variations give it a 'tint'.

    I assume the LED version of a Bardic uses suitable LEDs for red/white/green/yellow.

    A tungsten bulb typically has a colour temperature of about 3000K. So-called "white" LEDs are usually a blue LED with a phosphor coating that is excited by the blue light and is used to correct the colour temperature to something more acceptable; that's why we have a choice of colour temperatures for domestic lighting. Small torch bulbs tend to be much more blue in their rendering; even lights intended for use in film and television may say they're 3000K but a spectral analysis will show a peak in the blue.
     
  12. marty

    marty New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2018
    Messages:
    25
    Likes Received:
    57
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    The Sunny East.
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Think we may be using different definitions of what is white. Our cognitive processes percieve LEDs as white just as we do incandescent bulbs or flourescents, best illustrated in the old days of slide photography where by strip lights gave a green hue and domestic lighting an orange colour cast. but we both see them as "white". That is what I meant. Our perceptual mechanisms "correct" the colour temperature discepancy and we "see" them all as white. LEDs weren't around then so don't know what cast they would give...
     
  13. I. Cooper

    I. Cooper Member

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2011
    Messages:
    485
    Likes Received:
    412
    Location:
    Salop
    Exactly the same with digital cameras if you turn off auto colour balance and take control of the colour yourself. LEDs can vary wildly. Some are fairly neutral, others give yellowish casts, some magenta/purplish casts, some are greenish. General LEDs really are the work of the devil when it comes to photography unless they're specifically intended for photographic applications.
     
  14. John Baritone

    John Baritone New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2018
    Messages:
    140
    Likes Received:
    133
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Buxton
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Colour temperature - right! Thanks, Marty - that explains a point which puzzled me; why did the LEDs seem to affect the green so noticeably, yet only make the red and yellow brighter, but without significantly affecting the colour?

    Cheers!
     
  15. The Green Howards

    The Green Howards Part of the furniture Friend

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2016
    Messages:
    10,001
    Likes Received:
    4,830
    Occupation:
    Layabout
    Location:
    Lurking
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Some of my work takes me into the film and television industry. As a result I am very sensitive to variations of colour temperature and can easily tell a 'daylight' LED from a warm white, similarly when a TV camera isn't producing a "white" when it should be.
     

Share This Page