Electrification of the Settle and Carlisle

The arguments against wind turbines are many and the economic ones are certainly not silly.

 

northern steam,i suspect that it is nexus that prevents steam on the n/c to s/land bit of the metro.i have yet to see any reason for this,if you have one please tell us,thank you.

 

I highly doubt the S&C will be electrified in my lifetime, chiefly because NR and Virgin only remember it's there when the WCML is stuffed up, electrifying most of the network is a good idea over time, but the S&C is pretty far down the list compared to some others, which will take plenty of years themselves, think the gaps in the wires in the Bristol - York route will be a high priority once the GWML and MML are completed.

Really we should have a network like the Swiss where 95% of the network is electrified, save the odd minor branch or freight facility.

 

Difference being that the Swiss can call upon a huge amount of hydroelectric power. Energising the UK would be whole different kettle of fish.

 

True electricity supply needs sorting out, but widespread use of Diesel can't go for too many more decades, for both enviromental and cost/supply grounds.

 

True the UK has a mixed power source provision but that is also a strength. As for actual power delivery that is what the national grid is for

 

The OHLE is only 1500v DC, but it is very flimsy compared to 25KV kit, or even the old Woodhead 1500V overhead. The insulators aren't built to withstand the heat from a steam locomotive's exhaust, even in 'light steam', I understand.

 

Back to the original post - if OHLE is going through Sydney Gardens in Bath within a UNESCO World Heritage site, there is zero chance of getting it stopped on the S&C on purely aesthetic grounds!

 

Of course someone could always apply for UNESCO status for the entire S&C..
It was planned for the GWML... until they realised that it could affect the ability to get electrification installed.. then they changed their minds really quickly and got on with electrification asap before it was too late to be able to stop it.

 

Actually some are.....offshore wind is very expensive and IMHO probably a technological dead end that wave and tidal may well replace, but onshore wind compares reasonably.... see below.

The problem with renewables is not cost per se, but dispatch-ability. That is to say the predictability of being able to forward plan when the power will be available. It is one of the reasons why the Met Office has bought its new computer - to predict when the wind will blow. Sooner or later we will need to adopt some different patterns of power usage and homes and vehicles with batteries (energy storage) are likely to become the norm. Essentially we need a way to store large amounts of energy when it is available, for when it is needed. That will be a mix of distributed storage (batteries in home and transport) and perhaps large scale energy storage.....technology to be worked out from lots of options. Tidal and wave don't have this dispatch problem to the same extent as wind. They are technologies in infancy at present, but likely to be more important in the future.

UK energy costs for different generation technologies in pounds per megawatt hour (2010)
TechnologyCost range (£/MWh)
Tidal power155 – 390
Solar farms125 – 180
Onshore wind80 – 110
Offshore wind150 – 210
New nuclear80 – 105 (92.50 guaranteed from 2023)
Natural gas turbines with CO2 capture60 – 130
Natural gas turbine, no CO2 capture55 – 110
Coal with CO2 capture100 – 155
Biomass
60 – 120

 

I live close to the line, and use it regularly, and would gladly welcome electrification! Get a grip guys, this is not a heritage railway but a living breathing part of the national network!

 

I'm not sure any country has successfully achieved that... closest was probably the Swiss.. not many Diesels there. Even the Dutch has a sizeable diesel fleet but got rid of steam as soon as they could post war in the early 1950s, last one was 3737 in 1958, it's unlikely that the WD 2-10-0 preserved in their museum has ever had it's boiler lifted, since it arrived in Europe in 1945... (It spent 2-3 years in storage and was withdrawn by 1952 - and people think we in the UK wasted steam !!!).

 

Can we assume that you're supporting the (mis)guided BRT2 Corbs on the grounds it's updating the transport system in Bristol....

 

Not sure about updating there.... Maybe sidedating.... or undating perhaps?

At least I'm not protesting on aesthetic grounds alone although that said, there's going to be a stop just outside my living room window, so not sure if I should be pleased for the convenience factor or annoyed that I can't stand at the window in my pants without an audience of 70 people going past every few minutes!

 

Japan?

 

Electrification, with the inherent gauge enhancement, would be wonderful boost for the really long term future of this route. The attitude of some, that good photographs are more important than upgrading the national rail system, is beyond belief.

 

The S&C had better take their place in the queue, we need the Scarborough-Leeds-Manchester-Liverpool job doing as a matter of urgency, yes, before HS2 (and I'm a big supporter of HS2)

 

Cant agree more. The coast to coast spine is a high priority. The S&C does come someway down the list, and may never be economic, but it should be on the list for sometime in the future