Discussion in 'Diesel & Electric Traction' started by Victor, Feb 24, 2019.
How would one of these behave in an incident like Great Heck?
Suggest you have a look at eight pages on WNXX.
Thank you. We eagerly await the RAIB report. Factors contributing to causing the collision are of some interest, but the most concerning aspect is why some coaches derailed, rather than the Azuma just pushing the HST a bit further along the track. If that can happen at a closing speed of only 9 mph it seems almost inevitable at any higher speed. And we know only too well what can happen after that.
But is it conceivable that multiple parties have not had that conversation, probably within 24 hours of the event occurring? I agree, we await the report, but the authorities have obviously concluded they are ftr, otherwise they would not be running.
Here's the initial report pending the outcome of the investigation
Had my first Azuma trip last week.
Was in 1st class.
I’m not impressed at all. Where to begin...
The seats are now much bigger and the whole cabin is very much less facilitative of general discussion and dialogue among people. It’s almost feels compartmentalised now.
There is a very annoying steel strut right by your leg. I kicked it at least twice.
The back of the seat no longer tilts, just the base. Fixed back position so the relaxation is lessened.
The first class cabin is way more cramped. It makes the HST look enormous in 1st.
There are a LOT fewer WCs, so the waiting and queing situation we see on other DMUs is now present here.
Under the wires they are far noisier than HST. Lord knows what it’s going to be like north of Edinburgh when the oil burners kick in, I dread to think.
The ride is shocking. Absolutely disgraceful. The seating feels hard because the ride is appalling. Something is deeply wrong with the yaw or roll settings because it oscillates laterally as though you are out at sea. It borderline made me feel sick. It also does not take the bumps nearly as well as a Mk3.
The seat booking system is a wrong. My carriage was 80% Red lights and 40% occupied.
The bar is gone and 1st class service has suffered accordingly. Far less regular refreshments at seat although the hot food was good and arrived very promptly so that was a bonus. The trollys are smaller too. Like half the size of the old trollys. I presume this is the reason the service frequency is now reduced too.
They are clearly quicker off the mark than the HST or the 90s but Iv seen the HSTs put in some very sharp departures of late out of Newcastle and Stonehaven in particular. Perhaps some of the drivers are having a good time before they are demoted to these awful Azumas.
I sincerely hope Standard class has been upgraded from the HST experience, because 1st class has lost its justification for the premium price. Which is really a shame because the HST first class is really very very good in my experience of it. Which is pretty regular. I’m going to have a much harder time in future justifying the 1st class fare.
The saddest thing of all is the loss of congeniality and general banter to be honest. I don’t think I’ve ever had a HST trip where I havnt had or been party to conversations with staff or other passengers, especially at the bar and especially in 1st on the last train up here towards the end of the week. More than a few times Iv been the beneficiary of truly outstanding customer service from the staff and had very engaging conversations with total strangers. This all seems to have been lost with the Azuma. The staff are now behind frosted glass at the back, distant and somewhat unapproachable as opposed to the bar we all know and love and where no request seems to be too small.
I don’t know. I’m pretty let down, the HST is just so incredibly good and this just can’t seem to fill it’s shoes. Technically or in the human aspect. Perhaps a few more trips il feel different. I do hope my initial impression is blunted and tempered.
EDIT: Consulting the web, it appears I am far from alone in my assessment.
Had a day trip to Edinburgh with friends yesterday.
To Edinburgh on a 91 set, was comfortable, made up time, and exemplary.
The return on a Azuma, whilst quick off the mark, the ride was nowhere near as good, and highlighted the seats that after 1 hour 40, were becoming a pain in the ****.
The ride was also slightly disconcerting over 110mph (had a iPhone GPS with me), with the coaches seemingly lurching front to back, as well as up and down, in unison.
Would not like to have to take a one on a 4-5 hour journey after this experience.
Took a trip to Leeds back in December. Should have been HST out and Azuma back but the inward working of the HST was terminated at Doncaster so got Azuma both ways. Travelled 1st class in each direction. Hot food was good but as observed by W Williams, the drinks trolley appears much less often than before. In fact it only appeared once on each leg of my trip. Seats are inferior to both Mk.3 and Mk.4 IMO so heaven knows what standard class is like if the seats have undergone a similar downgrade. The interior layout seems to be be more cramped than the sets the Azumas are replacing. Didn't find the ride too bad but there were sums jolts and bangs on occasions. OK so they're quicker off the mark when on the juice but so what? They are not as comfortable as their predecessors and a shorter journey time will not compensate for that. One can only hope for a seating upgrade in due course but I doubt that will be any time soon.
Now them, today a full LNER Azuma set was seen (by me) in Huddersfield Now Huddersfield is the fiefdom of TP Express and Northern so what I ask is an Azuma set doing there?
Prior to starting the Kings Cross service they are running Doncaster to Huddersfield on route learning MTW I believe. Running up to Marsden to reverse.....Marsden 12.10 to 12.19 and later 15.51 to 16.10.
Are they the same family as the GWR ones? I had an opportunity to perform a scientific test on them last week. Travelled down to my in-laws out west, on a journey that used to take me four beer cans on an HST. In the 80x this time, I only just finished three...
Seat comfort was fine, no noticeable noise issues. (no seat service of any sort because covid).
So maybe they are fixeable.
But the lurching thing is interesting - on the 1.5 cans journey to my parents on SWT lines, the "new" Siemens trains are good in every way, save that they move all over the place as they go along. Spillage is a concern. I assume the reduction in ride stability is a pay-back for something else - being easier on the track?
Identical in all meaningful respects (bodyshell, running gear, seats) to the GWR and First Group (Hull Trains/Edinburgh Open Access) units. The only differences are paint and (on some units) whether they are electro-diesel or all electric.
They were my commute, and I'm not a fan of them for comfort.
That makes sense, I saw it from a distance (not on the station) at 12:55.
I'm reviving this thread because I can't find another one referring to the Neville Hill collision.
On a different thread
That showed a test conducted by BR of a 38? mph collision. One comment on the result was "Not a single wheel derailed". The collision at Neville Hill was a lot slower than that. The RAIB report https://www.gov.uk/government/news/report-132020-collision-and-derailment-at-neville-hill explains what was wrong with the Azuma design. Anyone know what has been done since then to put them right?
Edit: moved my words outside the quotation.
And in answer to the question from @4707, recent Modern Railways suggest nothing as yet.
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