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D9016 / 55016 Gordon

Discussion in 'Diesel & Electric Traction' started by Victor, Aug 8, 2017.

  1. guycarr360

    guycarr360 Member

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    Right then, the upshot of a FB conversation with Simon Hartshorne, Ex DPS head Engineer is as follows :-

    1. Deltic Engines are no longer overhauled by the MOD, it finished when the last one was withdrawn in Dec 2016.
    2.Expertise may still exist.
    3.All parts and old engines, have been disposed of.

    Back to square one....
     
  2. toplight

    toplight Member

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    It is a shame more old Engines/parts were not obtained when they were available. I think with any preservation project. It is inevitable that old processes and knowledge that existed in the past will disappear as stuff is taken out of service, therefore, if preservationists want to keep something going they need to acquire the knowledge/skills/parts to be able to do it themselves. For example the ex Napier expert in his 80s, they should be learning as much as they can from him,

    You can't go to Rolls Royce and say will you work on my Merlin Engine, because that technology is now old hat to them and they will no longer have people with the relevant knowledge.
     
  3. Bean-counter

    Bean-counter Resident of Nat Pres

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    Thanks Guy - some updating of what powers the Hunts is obviously needed on Wikipedia! Confusingly, some do refer to the Caterpillar engines and others still say 2 x Deltics.

    I originally typed that I suspected the last 2 were having the Caterpillars fitted at the moment - looks as though I was right (the work is being done in a big shed at Plymouth previously used to build aircraft carrier modules - the Hunts look small in it!)

    Steven
     
  4. Sawdust

    Sawdust Member

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    It is of course possible that nobody was given an opportunity to acquire any redundant MOD engines or spares, if they existed.

    Sawdust.
     
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  5. ssk2400

    ssk2400 New Member

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    Have the mod units been disposed off though? From my experience in the ship repair /engineering industry if they were only stopped being used in 2016 all the parts/engines will be sat in a warehouse some were I remember clearing a warehouse in the early 2000s and finding large quatity of spares for ww2 minesweepers in excellent condition I would be interested to find out who did the conversion work to the hunt class and I would guess there will still have all the spares engines tucked away in a just in case
     
  6. The Saggin' Dragon

    The Saggin' Dragon Part of the furniture Staff Member Moderator

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    Its not that long since they stopped providing spares support for Merlin and Griffon engines.
     
  7. guycarr360

    guycarr360 Member

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    To be fair to Simon, and he is as connected with this kind of thing, if he says they are gone, that's it.

    He and his team are making steady progress on this beauty..

    http://www.thebabydelticproject.co.uk/
     
  8. guycarr360

    guycarr360 Member

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    No problem Steven, I think all owners would have been interested, and the specialist knowledge would have been golden.
     
  9. 7143

    7143 New Member

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    The engines in the Mine Counter Measures Vessels are 9 cylinder units, i.e. 3 banks of 3 cylinders. The engines used in the Class 55 Deltic diesel locomotives were a pair of 18 cylinder units, 6 banks of 3 cylinders. Unfortunately, the basic engine blocks, even if they could be found and obtained, wouldn't be of any use. The engines used in the Class 23 Baby Deltics were a single 9 cylinder version. Doesn't mean to say that parts from ex-MoD Deltic engines wouldn't be of use though.
     
  10. guycarr360

    guycarr360 Member

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    The one's Martin sourced a while ago, after the leg out of bed with 22, were the 18 cylinder version.

    I am sure they came from an old PT boat in Florida.

    Wonder if the US Navy services these still????
     
  11. Bean-counter

    Bean-counter Resident of Nat Pres

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    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napier_Deltic

    The former Ton Class Minesweepers had 2 x 18 cylinder Deltics for propulsion and 1 x 9 cylinder for electrical power, but the Hunts have 3 x 9 cylinder. Don't know what commonality of spares between the 2 versions.

    The US Navy boats had all gone by the 1980s, the Norwegian boats lasted until the mid-1990s and there is one apparently in Essex as a house boat!

    Steven
     
  12. Chris86

    Chris86 Member

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    Is it time to look at re-powering?

    Chris
     
  13. Given the amount of flak you received for the 27 proposal, I think this is a fair point.
    Or perhaps people could just accept that - like hundreds of other locomotives, aircraft and road vehicles - there eventually comes a time for most pieces of transport-related historical equipment when being preserved as a non-operational exhibit in a museum is the only option?

    Of course it is nice to see Deltics booming away under their own power, but there will come a time when the cost becomes prohibitive, spares non-existent and many of the skills have died with the specialist engineers who used them in BR days. All this talk of converting to DP2 (bearing in mind Class 50 power unit spares and expertise will also run out at some point), re-powering and desperately scrabbling around the globe for bits that may or may not work is the sound of madness.

    Let's just be grateful that, -thanks to the likes of Martin Walker, the DPS and the KOYLI group - that we have been able to enjoy operational Deltics in preservation for longer than they were in BR service.

    You can't keep everything working forever.
     
  14. Stan loco

    Stan loco New Member

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    The two deltic engines at Malta. Wonder what spec they are. Out of two Dark class motor torpedo boats if my memory is correct.
     
  15. Chris86

    Chris86 Member

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  16. guycarr360

    guycarr360 Member

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    Good find that chris, and maybe, that is the marine unit fitted to 22, that is currently u/s. I have posted it to the FB conversation.
     
  17. Chris86

    Chris86 Member

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    I just stumbled upon it when I was reading about Napier- came up in a google search?!

    Chris
     
  18. The Green Howards

    The Green Howards Part of the furniture Friend

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    The 'Procession To Plinth'.
     
  19. guycarr360

    guycarr360 Member

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    Another piece of the jigsaw, Diesel Marine International, in Newcastle, that overhauled Engine liners for MOD, has gone bust.
     
  20. Grashopper

    Grashopper New Member

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    I read about the Super Pumper years ago via some chaps I knew who were into historic and American fire appliances. I think the Deltic in the Super Pumper eventually ran out of hours so unlikely it's any good for rail use.
     

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