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CME - 2019

Discussion in 'What's Going On' started by alastair, Jan 11, 2019.

  1. 1020 Shireman

    1020 Shireman Well-Known Member Friend

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    Great photography and filming yesterday.

    Unfortunately you probably figured out from the lineside that Lizzie had one of those days when she refused to steam well. Bit of raw data: Yealand was sub 30. On Grayrigg; only 41 through Oxenholme; 33.8 at the Summit. 65 at Tebay. Slipped near Scout Green in a heavy shower and knocked speed back to 31. solid to 27.3 at mp37 1/4. Still, a proper train as we ran into Carlisle 6 secs early!!

    Clear run from Carlisle; max of only 40 ay Howe & Co on the 132r to Low House; on time into Appleby. Ormside, MP275 only 52; Kirkby Stephen, 32; slipped twice before Birkett 29 to 27; picked up on Mallerstang's 330r to 40; fell away badly to just under 20 at the Climbing Summit. 11 down departing Hellifield as had to wait for the Leeds to clear. Newer coal brought forward. Steamed better and got to Horrocksford on time so in front of service train. Clitheroe, 49; 49 onto Whalley Arches and the 81 1/2r. Slip before Wilpshire Tnl and a couple after; 32 to 23; just over 21 at the summit. Slack timings so back on time at Blackburn. Spirited run down to Farington Curve and arrival at Preston a little early. Coal had been brought forward at Hellifield and did burn better and raise some decent steam for Wilpshire.
     
  2. Swiss Toni

    Swiss Toni Well-Known Member

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  3. JohnRobinson

    JohnRobinson Well-Known Member

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    12/10/2019 - LMS Stanier Princess class - 6201 "Princess Elizabeth" leaving Hellifield behind on a Cumbria mountain Express heading towards Blackburn.
    DSC_17604.jpg
     
  4. LMarsh1987

    LMarsh1987 Well-Known Member

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    Thank god it was late ! 6201 Greengates 2019.jpg
     
  5. 46203

    46203 Well-Known Member

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    _DSC0891-Edit.jpg

    6201 with return CME 12.10.19.
     
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  6. LMarsh1987

    LMarsh1987 Well-Known Member

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    Even with Lizzie being slightly of the pace due to steaming issues ? The sight and sound on Shap was worth the trip alone with some great patches of light, this was followed by the return leg at Birkitt Common, which was nothing short than a roaring success, regardless of the classic draincock blow making it's usual appearance ? Wipshire Bank was a little messy as it can be with a few slips before the station. I hope you enjoy :)
     
  7. ribble

    ribble Member

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    Sun on the nose !
    Lizzie climbing Wilpshire Bank

    David Price
    Cop Lane on Flickr 15A_1322.jpg
     
  8. Oswald T Wistle

    Oswald T Wistle Well-Known Member Friend

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    Apologies if there are more than the usual number of errors but our 4 year old grandson has been visiting all manner of mayhem on us throughout the day.


    The Cumbrian Mountain Express 12 October 2019 – 6201 Princess Elizabeth hauling 10+POB

    There was a short break between the trains that run in summer and those that run in the autumn. Mrs W and I had planned a week lazing on a Greek island (Lesbos); we were due to travel with Thomas Cook on 21 Sept. Despite ATOL protection and a guarantee “to get you home” there remained a degree of uncertainty and the holiday promised to be anything but relaxing; we decided not to travel (shades of Mr Shireman when faced with a diesel). So with Thomas Cook in Dire Straits we lost our cash, “Money for Nothing” – our decision, no regrets. 36 hours later Thomas Cook entered administration. I feel very sorry for all their employees and for those whose holidays were disrupted or cancelled. We were quick off the mark and managed to book a different holiday (Rhodes) with TUI; so it was a refreshed and tanned Oswald who joined the train at Preston.

    I last travelled north over Shap behind Lizzie on 31 July 2010 (CME) and was looking forward to the trip on what was forecast to be a dry day. Les Ross arrived and we left Preston in bright sunshine but soon encountered a heavy shower as we headed north, arriving in Carnforth D&UGL 3L. Les Ross came off and Lizzie and support were attached, I was seated at the front of the 5th coach. I started my GPS recorder and it chose this moment play up; it took a few restarts (and a Basil Fawlty-like thrashing with a birch twig) before it settled. In the meantime we had departed (½E) with Peter Kirk driving, Frank Chippendale firing and Steve Chipperfield as TI (northbound only). The start appeared steady and Yealand Bank was topped before my GPS data began (4.6 miles into the journey).

    Speed continued to build to a max of 60.4 across Beela Viaduct (MP13); less than ½ mile of 1/173r later we passed Milnthorpe at 58.6 (1¾L) and it had begun to rain. Speed continued to fall quickly; Hincaster Jn (MP15½) and we were down to 50.9, speed then fell below 50 before rallying very slightly where the gradient eases (1/193/392r). The climb continues at 1/111r before it eases (1/178r) through Oxenholme (41.2 & 1½L); this is at least 10mph slower than I would expect from a big engine +11. Lizzie could make no impression on the climb and we were down to 32.2 at Lambrigg (3½L). As the gradient tightened to 1/106r speed fell to a min of 31.1 but improved to 33.1 at Grayrigg summit (4¼L). The sound and the cinders through the open toplight indicated that Lizzie had been working; the results however, were disappointing. Was it railhead conditions, steaming, or something else? Could 6201 gain some oomph for an almighty assault on Shap . . . ?

    The views of the Lune gorge bathed in autumn sunshine were magnificent; Lizzie’s recovery was not. We laboured; 55 at Lowgill and reached a max of 65.9 at MP31½ (the foot of the 1/75r). Only ¾ of a mile beyond, as we crossed the Lune, we were down to 62.8. Another ¼ of a mile and under the M6 at a shade over 60, a further ¾ of a mile and across Birbeck Viaduct at 56.2 and down to 50.2 as we passed under the Greenholme road. By Scout Green we were down to 32.3, 28.6 as we crossed the road to Shap Wells, where there was a brief shower, and only 27.1 at MP37¼. We passed the summit board at 30.7 (6¼L) with a minimum on the climb of 26.9. The time from Carnforth to the summit board was 48m 21s. Not a “good day at the office” and inferior to what we have come to expect from a well handled Jubilee.

    With the help of gravity we quickly gathered pace down the hill; brakes were frequently applied and I noted nothing higher than 76. Half of the deficit had been reduced as we swept through Penrith at 69.8 (3L), our run continued apace until we stopped in platform 3 at Carlisle a handful of seconds early. The uphill work had been disappointing but we arrived RT – so who am I to argue!? I walked to the front where Lizzie now had the audacity to blow off. I understand that there had been some limited slipping but that the main problem had been poor steaming.

    Off to a very crowded Woodrow (Beer Festival) but I managed to find a table and had fish and chips (I do miss teriyaki noodles and chicken). I had just enough time for a couple of brief errands in the centre before returning to the station early to ensure that my GPS would behave – it did. The stock had remained in platform 3 and shortly afterwards 6201 and support backed on. 6201 had to set the train back around a coach length to clear the signals at the south end of the platform. It was time to return to my seat (now at the back of the 8th coach) in readiness for the departure; Peter Kirk was driving and Martyn Soames firing – would the “big man” be able to persuade Lizzie to steam?

    We left 1L and picked our way out of the station, as we passed Petterill Bridge there was an inbound HST waiting on the Tyne Valley line. Soon we were climbing the 1/132r and under the M6 at 28.2 but another ½ mile beyond, in the wooded cutting, Lizzie slipped – we only lost around 1 mph but it was clearly felt 8 coaches back. We continued to climb and passed through Cumwhinton at 31.4. On the short level (¾ mile) speed increased then we were on to the next 3 miles of 1/132r, we soon passed Howe & Co SB at 40.3 (2¼L); speed settled at 37 but looking at the GPS data there were several short losses of 1-2 mph (slips?), speed continued at 37ish to the summit. We were 3L as we dropped down past Low House Xng at 48.2, with a max of 56.7 south of Drybeck Viaduct, there follows a mile of 1/132r to Armathwaite (52.4 & 2¾L). We dropped down again to cross Armathwaite Viaduct at 59.5 before climbing for 2¼ miles (mainly at 1/220r) up through the 3 tunnels; into Armathwaite at 56.9 and out of Baron Wood No1 at 53 and holding this speed to the summit. We swept down the dip towards Lazonby before climbing and through the station at 45.5 (2L), then down to cross Long Meg Viaduct at 52.3 before the climb up through Little Salkeld (46.7) and on to Langwathby (41.7 & 3½L). We were 3L as we passed Culgaith SB at 55.6, down to 2L at Kirkby Thore SB (53.8) and 1L at Long Marton (58.4). We stopped at Appleby RT – all that could be asked from a loco that appeared still to be short of steam. Carlisle to Appleby had taken 44m 54s.

    A disappointing day got worse when the ice cream ladies failed to show up; there was some improvement when “West Brom Tom” passed the wine gums round – many thanks, sugar is always welcome. The loco had stopped short of the water column but after a few minutes it was decided to draw forward, presumably for a top up. As a result of this faffing about we left 7¼L, would Lizzie fare any better?

    A short stretch of 1/440r is followed by a mile of 1/176f towards Ormside Viaduct; we reached a max of 53.6 as we left the viaduct and started 3½ miles of 1/100r; we passed Ormside at 51.0 (4¾L). Half way along and into Helm Tunnel at 43 and out at 40, the gradient was biting. We reached the summit at Griseburn Viaduct at 35.3 where the gradient eases (1/166/200/L) for 3 miles. We passed Crosby Garrett at 41.3 (6¼L) and reached a max of 47.4 just before Smardale Viaduct where 5 miles of almost unrelenting 1/100r commences. We were down to 31.3 at Kirby Stephen but thanks to a short easing of the gradient we passed the SB at 32.2 (8¼L) and reached 34.7 just beyond. We slogged on, under 32 into Birkett Tunnel and out at 30. The gradient eases to 1/330r for just under a mile around Mallerstang (36.8 & 9L) and speed very briefly touched 40 (max) before Sycamore Tree Farm (reaching a max earlier in the climb than is usual is not a good omen). We had 3¼ miles to the summit; it did not bode well. Speed had dropped to 25.1 at Angerholme, 22.6 across Ais Gill Viaduct and 21 as we passed under the road bridge and reached a min of 19.2 around MP260. As the weight of the train came off the gradient I (rear of 8th coach) passed the summit board at 25.7 but 12L. Appleby (start) to Ais Gill SB had taken 31m 40s and from passing MP277¾ to the SB, 30m 38s.

    The running down the hill was restrained with 55.7 across Dandry Mire and through Garsdale at 51.3 (12¼L). We slowed early for the PSR at Dent (13½L) and gained only a few mph before slowing for the TSR before Dent Head then ran slowly towards Blea Moor Tunnel. Out of the tunnel and we were 16¾L as we passed Blea Moor SB – not looking good for meeting our time at Horrocksford Jn. Once across the viaduct we were 15¼L as we passed through Ribblehead. Speed built quickly down the hill; by Helwith Bridge (58.5) we were 14¼L and by Settle Jn (62.3) only 9L and by Long Preston (40.5) this had been reduced to 6¾L. However the usual slow approach into Hellifield UGL saw us stop 8½L – we were in with a chance. Ribblehead to Settle Jn SB (12.57 miles) had taken 12m 48s.

    With watering complete we had to wait to cross to the Blackburn line whilst the delayed (by us) Carlisle to Leeds service used the platform line. We left at 16:52:35 (13½L) and were timed at Horrocksford Jn at 17:07; Hellifield to Horrocksford Jn is 13.2 miles so we wouldn’t make RT but could we arrive in time to keep our path in front of the 17.23 Clitheroe departure to Rochdale? Peter made good progress but we slowed approaching Horrocksford and I feared the worst and then we accelerated through the Jn (7L) – thanks to the signalman the unit was still waiting by the SB waiting to cross over – we were still on our path.

    Through Clitheroe (5½L); the Carlisle-Chirk freight that we were planned to follow had been cancelled so hopefully we had a clear road. Peter soon had Lizzie into her stride and up to 50 before easing to sight the distant at Barrow, then away again and 49.2 as I approached Whalley station with the front of the train now on the arches and the 1/82r of Wilpshire Bank. 8 coaches back and Lizzie was thundering, was this what we had been waiting for? A mile into the climb and passing behind Billington at 38, another mile and crossing over the A59 at 35 and straight away through Langho station (35.1 & 1¼L), another mile and 33.3, into Wilpshire Tunnel at 31 but out at 25. Despite extensive tree clearance the loco slipped around the site of the old Wilpshire station and we lost some speed before passing through Ramsgreave & Wilpshire at 21.5 & 1E. The 4.5 miles from Whalley had taken 8m 02s – very impressive given the slip and 6201’s performances during the day.

    We had a clear run across Daisyfield Jn and through Blackburn (RT), by Cherry Tree we were up to 54 (¾E), Pleasington (59.7 & 1¼E), we reached a max of 68.7 beyond Hoghton with 66.3 as we passed under the M61. By Bamber Bridge we were 4¼E and at Lostock Hall 5¼E; we paid the penalty for running early as we were held for 3 mins waiting to join the WCML at Farington Curve Jn. Once away we crossed straight over to stop in platform 5 at Preston (¾E). As always there was time for a walk to the front to admire the loco. I understand that steaming was a problem all day and that after Hellifield the front firebox damper had been closed and this had improved matters but by no means cured them. The climb of Wilpshire, short and steep, had been started with a full boiler and the crew had given it a go – and a good go it was!

    My thanks to all involved before and on the day, to the firemen for struggling with an unresponsive loco and to Peter Kirk for getting the best out of her with RT arrivals. Today Lizzie was a grumpy old lady but was persuaded to give a performance at the end. Home before 7pm to a lady who is neither old nor grumpy – crawl, crawl . . .
     
  9. sgthompson

    sgthompson Part of the furniture

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    Footage from a chap called Peter Nash over from Australia.
     
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  10. DOH46229

    DOH46229 New Member

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  11. 61994

    61994 Member

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  12. Bodorganboy

    Bodorganboy Member

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    46203 Princess Margaret Rose CME 15th September 1995 at same location as 6201 on Saturday
     
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  13. iancawthorne

    iancawthorne Part of the furniture

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  14. 46203

    46203 Well-Known Member

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    No surprises there then.:)
     
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  15. Oswald T Wistle

    Oswald T Wistle Well-Known Member Friend

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    I have just been taking another look at the splendid selection of photos and vids - thanks; mean and moody in the morning and autumnal sunshine in the afternoon. However, one thing is missing from all of them; it is present on Bodorganboy's footage of Maggie Rose - steam at the safety valves. In modern preservation almost all images show a wisp or feather at the valves; a testament to the skill of the fireman and the quality of the coal. On Saturday Lizzie struggled as the graphs on Ian Cawthorne's excellent website show (and is confirmed by the images). A better illustration of 6201's performance can be seen on Ian's website by comparing the southbound Dalesman (30/04/19) with 46203 - after recovering from running at caution because of a report of children on the line at Crosby Garrett the speed graphs are very similar.

    signed

    Boris Johnson (spinster)
     
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  16. Linesider

    Linesider Member

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    Some footage from Shap and the climb to Ais Gill last Saturday:

     
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  17. RalphW

    RalphW Part of the furniture Staff Member Administrator Friend

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    A slightly understated 'some footage etc' then you give us that.... What can we say except stunning.
     
  18. Big Al

    Big Al Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Moderator

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    With scenery like that, sometimes you don't need the 'up close and personal' approach to shooting steam. Brilliant.
     
  19. Waterbuck

    Waterbuck Member

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    Utterley Awesome, thank you for sharing this masterpiece.
     
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  20. Shep Woolley

    Shep Woolley Part of the furniture

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    You really have surpassed yourself with this masterpiece David lad, well done
     
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2019
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