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Bulleid Pacifics - Past or Present

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by 34007, May 13, 2008.

  1. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    Not sure if we are at cross purposes. The tender sides had a carriage profile, but the loco obviously didn't, for the reasons you say. That straight away would make washing with carriage washing plant problematic, as seems to be alluded to in the comment from @Monkey Magic above that when it was tried at Clapham Junction, "apparently they were not cleaned right to the top of the sides". Probably not surprising since the carriage washing brushes wouldn't have reached if the sides of the loco were sloped in!

    My hunch is that the locos being designed to use carriage washing plant is probably a fallacy. Rather, I suspect that they were designed to be easy to wash with portable, hand-held jet washers - which were in use for loco cleaning by the early 1940s - but coupled with the carriage profile of the tender, that has become confused to become what I suspect is an urban myth that they were designed to go through carriage washing plants.

    Incidentally - the jet washers were apparently referred to as "Jennies". They comprised a small paraffin engine and pump on a trolley, that directed a jet of steam and dilute acid through a hose and nozzle to where it was required. Apparently they could clean in ten minutes what took ten hours to do by hand. From the photos I've seen, they would be eminently well adapted to cleaning the sides of a Bulleid pacific.

    Tom
     
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  2. MellishR

    MellishR Well-Known Member Friend

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    Which of Tom's reasons do you say doesn't support his argument?
     
  3. Spamcan81

    Spamcan81 Resident of Nat Pres

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    It was the profile of the tender not the loco that matched the profile of the carriages.
     
  4. Flying Phil

    Flying Phil Member

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    I think we are all actually in agreement - In theory they could have gone through a type of carriage washer - but never did. They were easier and faster to clean with power hoses and long handled brushes than conventional boiler cladding. They looked sleek and modern which the SR management liked, and one of the reasons why they had appointed OVS was to modernise the steam fleet. It was a convenient justification during war time conditions.
     
  5. Steve

    Steve Part of the furniture Friend

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    No. 3. I got the impression that Tom was suggesting that the fact that the loco was not built to carriage profile was a point to support his argument. Perhaps I was wrong, having reread the post.
     
  6. Monkey Magic

    Monkey Magic Well-Known Member

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    I wonder if it is one of those things that got lost in the repeating. For example someone saying ‘they could go through a carriage washer looking like that’ being understood as ‘they go through carriage washers’, or alternatively someone seeing something putting two and two together and making five. The carriage washing plant is a way out of Clapham and really only when you go past it on the train do you see what is going through - someone sees an ecs hauled by unrebuilt as they go past and concludes the whole train including engine has been through the washer.

    There are many stories where truth and fiction get mixed up ie circumstances of Dougal Drummond’s death, etc etc
     
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  7. misspentyouth62

    misspentyouth62 New Member

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    Visible on southern approach to Crewe is a single Bulleid boiler/s-box - does anyone know if this belongs to 35027 or 35022?
     
  8. Bulleid Pacific

    Bulleid Pacific Member

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    Think it's probably from 35027.
     
  9. misspentyouth62

    misspentyouth62 New Member

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    Thank you - I'd assumed this to be the more likely of the two. I will be interested to see whether there will be access to view restoration projects at Crewe during the open day planned.
     
  10. Richard Roper

    Richard Roper Member

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    Silly question time - What are the circular structures found on the main steam pipes on Air-Smoothed Bulleids? Something I've always wondered. Visible in the photo attached, above the outside cylinder (Photo from SLL Website)

    Richard.
     

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  11. Steve

    Steve Part of the furniture Friend

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    Expansion bellows. They are intended to take out the relative rigidity and cater for relative movement of the steam pipes.
     
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  12. Richard Roper

    Richard Roper Member

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    Many Thanks for your answer Steve, much appreciated!

    Richard.
     
  13. Flying Phil

    Flying Phil Member

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    Just as an update:- I have been told that there is no work being done on 35025 Brocklebank Line - and no one interested in restoring or buying it at present. Such a shame after the progress that had been made, before it had to leave Lbro.
     
  14. ghost

    ghost Well-Known Member

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    BIB - not quite true.

    From memory and open to correction:
    Greg Wilson from the CVR tried to buy 35025 (twice) and was rebuffed by the chairman of the 35025 group who said the price offered was too low. The chairman apparently did not consult with the other members/shareholders and must therefore now see himself as the owner. I would think that a lot of the work done at the GCR would now have to be redone due to her time outdoors at Sellindge. If the chairman/group had any sense they would sell her at a competitive price to someone like Mr Wilson who would get her operational again. I suspect the price being asked is delusional and based on the suspected value of a fully operational MN.

    I think there may have been another attempt to buy 35025, but I can't remember the details.

    I don't think any work has been done to her since she left Loughborough in 2007.

    Keith
     
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  15. martin1656

    martin1656 Part of the furniture Friend

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    many attempts have been made to persuade the owners to sell their chairman though lives under the illusion that he can rescue it, unless he has now resigned him self to the fact that he can't, but at the same time he's adopted an over my dead body attitude every time the question was raised
     
  16. Flying Phil

    Flying Phil Member

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    I knew there had been offers to buy in the past, hence my use of "at present"... But, as it looks as though 35011 GSN, may be on the move from Sellinge, the situation re Brocklebank may also be changing??
     
  17. martin1656

    martin1656 Part of the furniture Friend

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    very unlikely most likily outcome there will be that the loco will only be moved if the site was sold it would take something as drastic as that IMHO in other words reality would have to focus minds,
     
  18. Flying Phil

    Flying Phil Member

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    There is an article about "Brocklebank Line" in the latest issue of Steam Railway magazine, so perhaps the publicity will also serve to "focus minds!"
     
  19. martin1656

    martin1656 Part of the furniture Friend

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    Sorry but, I can not see anything other an notice of eviction making who ever actually owns 35025 seriously doing anything about the loco's future, the problem is that in our hobby you get dreamers, people who even though its clear that the restoration has stalled, wont accept it, and say, I will get a new group of people to restore it, but nothing more happens, the chairman, who I only met once came across as a Walter Mitty type, full of dreams, but short on the reality of his situation, he seemed to think people would come out of nowhere, and of course there is the question of funding, doing nothing cost you nothing, I believe the kitty was bare following the move to Selinge . now on top there will be storage costs, it may well be that the land owner may now almost be able to say he owns it, in leu of fees, if these have not been paid, 35011 is right to move their engine to a site, hopefully on an active preserved railway where their profile can only increase, and its worthwhile to note the owner, gifted the loco to the group, I honestly can not see the chairman of 35025 doing a similar thing, its what the engine needs, but I suspect the chairman has a different view on this, possibly self interest .
     
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  20. marshall5

    marshall5 Member

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    The shame is that 35025 is a much better candidate for restoration than either 35010 or 35011.
    Ray.
     
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