Bluebell Railway General Discussion

6989 is remaining for the 2025 season

 

I am sure the Bluebell will have very good reasons for keeping that loco with them for so long, and I am certain there will be a lot of visitors who will enjoy seeing it.

But not me. I had rather hoped that 34059, 73082 and 80151 would be handling the bulk of the traffic for quite a while, making multiple future visits by me a certainty. I'll just have to keep a very close eye on the loco roster before planning any visit.

Bryan B.

 

Unfortunately as has been said, it's staying a while longer. An Atlantic and a Light Pacific both represent a significant upgrade though.

 

Yes indeed, although I thought the Atlanic is not now expected in service until some way into next year. But add 32424 to the other three locos I mentioned and I will be very happy when a selection of those are in operation.

 

Why is it unfortunate?

The Bluebell have been very fortunate to have been able to secure the use of medium-large loco for an extended period of time to cover for a shortage in the home based fleet, whilst other railways have been unable to hire in and have struggled.

Chris

 

34059 is advertised for it's return event on Saturday 15th June but so far nothing I could see on Bluebell's website? Do we know when details for this date are likely to be more formally announced?

 

I would imagine 6989 is essentially covering the gap until 32424 is ready, and the dates largely align to that thinking

 

Atlantic's launch should be next spring according to who I spoke in Atlantic House during Branchline weekend and the Atlantic News Spring 2024.I expect being kept until H and/ or Q are back as well.

 

There was also this in Atlantic News, about the other Atlantic

 

It's unfortunate because some people are unable to look past their own personal prejudices regarding locomotive types when assessing the merit of the fleets at different heritage railways. So for somebody who doesn't like Great Western locos, it doesn't matter if a Great Western loco is of the required size and power to cover a gap in the fleet, the fact that it's a Great Western means it's a bad thing that it's around.

 

I have to say that although I am a Southern man through and through, I have certainly appreciated 6989's visit. I went over to the Bluebell in June of last year purely for a run behind it, which I thoroughly enjoyed. Given that Halls and Modified Halls do not seem to have as much of a following as other GWR types, the likelihood of another one ever turning up at the Bluebell once 6989 moves on is pretty remote, so I'm happy to make the most of something a bit different while it is still Bluebell-based.

 

Like with most things, personal favourites when it comes to all things heritage railways are subjective and individual. I too prefer some designs over others and maybe even some HRs over others. The point is though, who cares what I like and don't like? Why would I want anyone else to know or care? I'm part of the single tribe that likes heritage railways and I am grateful for what we have.

 

People also need to realise there are not enough locos to go around these days, and be thankful the Bluebell has enough to operate its services. Even if those, like everywhere else for very good reasons are fewer than they were say 10 years ago.

 

That is BRPS AGM day. AIUI, the rededication is scheduled for noon at Sheffield Park.

Tom

 

More on the AGM / members day. Note that although this is billed as a "members day", there is no reason why non-members should;t visit and enjoy what is on offer; only the AGM constitutes formal BRPS Members' business. Of course, you may choose to join and thereby benefit from membership, not least significant reduction on fares (including gala fares).

Members' Day

On AGM Day, 15th June, the Railway is once again throwing open its doors for members to see what goes on behind the scenes. Departments will show what they do so members can get an idea of just what makes the Railway work. The idea of the day is to hopefully encourage members to see what is going on at their Railway and show them where they can help, either by volunteering or by other contribution.

We've made a few changes to the format from last year's very successful event, particularly to give members more time to explore the railway before attending the AGM itself. The service will begin earlier than a normal Saturday (first departures 9.20 am from Sheffield Park, 10.15 am from East Grinstead) and still have plenty of time to look around. The meeting will take place in a marquee on the top car park at Sheffield Park, commencing at 4 pm. Afterwards, there will be a social event with food and drink available. Trains will leave for East Grinstead after the AGM at 6.45 pm and later at 9.00 pm so, if you chose to arrive by rail, you can get home afterwards.

Event Details

At Sheffield Park, a highlight of the day will be the formal renaming of 34059 Sir Archibald Sinclair, planned to take place at 12.00. Throughout the day, we are expecting that all areas within the loco yard (running shed, works, Atlantic House and maintenance shed) will be open to view the progress being made on the various restorations and overhauls that are underway. Various loco owning groups will have stands and will be on hand to update you on their respective projects.

On the station, Friends of Sheffield Park and the Museum Team will have displays and representatives too. We also hope to display restored Pullman Car No 54 for viewing.

At Horsted Keynes, there will be tours of the Carriage & Wagon works, where you can see the progress being made on a number of carriages as they continue their journey back to full operational service. The SR Coach Group will have a display and be on hand to discuss their work on our Maunsell and Bulleid coaches. The wagon group will also have a display and stand to show visitors the progress they are making. On Platform 1/2 of the station, the Infrastructure teams will be mounting a display to explain the work they are undertaking there and the 1305 (Thumper) team will have a stand where they will be on hand to explain how they are bringing this unit, currently located nearby, back to working order. At the south end of Platform 2 there will be a meeting point for the S&T Department, from where you will be able to review proposals for the new Sheffield Park Signal Box, study the layout for the final East Grinstead signalling and view a display of unusual signalling features.

At all our stations, staff will be happy to answer questions and, subject to operational requirements, show you how things work in their particular part of the Railway. It is also hoped that guided visits to some of the signal boxes will be possible, subject to permission of the signalman.

Don't forget that a lot of the individual project and owning group will have sales stands as part of their displays so please do support them where you can.

We hope that even more of you will join us on our Society AGM day this year to enjoy everything the Bluebell has to offer. Do take the opportunity to join in a conversation with Society management about how to take the Railway forward for the future and hopefully find ways in which you can help the Railway on that journey.

On behalf of the Chairman, Roy Watts, we look forward to seeing you.

Keith Leppard, Trustee
​

The formal papers for the AGM (including the candidate statements for Trustee elections, agenda and 2023 combined accounts booklet) are linked from here: https://www.bluebell-railway.co.uk/bluebell/soc/notices/brps_agm_2024.html

Tom

 

The Atlantic is a high-days and holidays loco, rather than something that's going to be flogged. It's also likely to be considered a larger medium sized engine, rather than something that could replace the Hall on our heavy trains.
The Accounts show that our coal bill was approaching half a million last year, (474k) up from £366k the year before, as coal costs continue to rocket (it was just £163k in 2018 and £211k in 2019). Under those circumstances I understand it's planned to avoid using Sir Archie more than necessary due to the cost of warming the boiler up each morning it's used.

 

Yes, it was about 8-9 years ago that the main donor was asked and agreed to the money being spent on Car 54 instead of Carina.
The published strategy three years ago did not require Carina, but was to use Aquila as a second Kitchen Car on a 5-car Pullman Train. We were told at that time we'd not sell Carina, because it was part of the ambition to develop a second Pullman train based on Churchill/Eisenhower connections, to attract Americans. Somehow the idea that we could spend another £3 million to create a second Pullman train to be marketed on that basis, in addition to our Golden Arrow train, was thought feasible at board level, but thankfully that board has been dispensed with before they bankrupted the railway!
With the BG now planned to provide the kitchen at what will be a fraction of the cost, we only need four Pullmans, and the current plans are, for the first time since we started growing the Pullman fleet beyond just Fingall, that it will be sustainable in terms of long-term maintenance, thanks to being able to take a Pullman out of service for overhaul whilst still maintaining 100 covers (once Car 36 is done). But doing Car 36 will cost a few hundred thousand (but probably less than half Carina, would cost, for twice the number of seats).

Pullmans are relatively plentiful in preservation, but few railways can afford the huge costs of overhaul. KESR has two in service, Aries parked in the too hard pile, it appears, and Lidia and Isle of Thanet also moved there recently. KWVR have only one of their two in service. The NYMR Pullman train is impressive, but is mainly MetCam Mk.1 Pullmans.

So it's worth remembering that Bluebell is essentially the top Pullman heritage dining operation in the UK after the Belmond (ex VSOE) and Brighton Belle (and they've spent well over a million per Car and still currently have nothing to show for it).

Carina has been kicking about various railways, looking for someone with very deep pockets, ever since it was stripped out in the 1980s and left without an interior once dropped from VSOE's plans. It really is a basket case in terms of restoration as an operational Pullman, and the 1951 Pullmans were not a patch on the 1920s ones interior decor-wise (which is why VSOE dropped Carina and they later also sold Aquila).

So yes, if anyone know of someone with the space for a Pullman to provide a home office or Glamping accommodation, Carina could be an opportunity for them, at essentially scrap value. We'd definitely much prefer to sell it rather than scrapping it! But it has to go.

 

Excellent news 6889 is a fine locomotive, hope to have many runs with it along side 34059.

 

You can combine those figures with the annual steam mileage and you get the increase in per mile coal cost, which was £18.39 in 2023 - up from £14.08 in 2022 and as low as £4.83 in 2018. (I think coal must have been particularly cheap that year). That is a crude "total coal bill / total steam mileage". Obviously the coal cost is both what is used on the road and for warming up fires etc - it also includes a (probably trivial) amount burnt in station fireplaces, brake vans, platform braziers etc. I suspect that the recent pattern of not running every day in a week, while it must reduce total costs, is probably less efficient on a measure of coal cost per mile, which I suspect is responsible for some of the increase.

What is perhaps more surprising between 2022 and 2023 is that despite the very sharp rise in coal cost, the coal bill as a percentage of turnover is actually slightly down - 9.0% of turnover in 2022; 8.5% in 2023. That is still a big increase since 2018 (when the coal bill was 4.3% of turnover) but it shows the extent to which the sharp rise in coal last year was largely offset by a better gross trading performance.

Tom

 

What exactly does "more than necessary" mean? Keeping it for Giants of Steam and the Santa Specials? I understand that it's probably a more expensive loco to run than the rest of the Bluebell fleet but what was the point of putting it through a long and presumably expensive overhaul if it's not going to be regularly steamed?