Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by Sidmouth, Jan 27, 2014.
92 Squadron RAF's colours are red and yellow so I ought to like it.
'Tool O' The North'?
It sounds like you've been watching Thomas the tank engine too much!! The owner is entitled to paint his locomotive in any livery he wants too, I have often wondered if the two Fairburn's painted in the Lakeside and Haverthwaite Railway's liveries many years ago came under much criticism from enthusiasts?
On that note (Slightly off-topic), was there a ban on preserved locos operating in BR colours for a while?
Don't normally bother with livery debates. However, I feel that a 9F being painted lined BR green is a bit wrong. Evening Star was painted green because it was the last main line steam loco built in Britain. For another 9F to be painted similar is, I feel, out of order.
I believe that most sales (but not all) had a clause in the contract to say that there should be no markings that could imply BR was still the owner so emblems and liveries had to change, hence most ex BR purchases had non-BR liveries at first.
I thought it was some folk wanting "anything but BR", tbh - which is why we had the Furness Railway Black 5 & the LNWR & Caley Fairburns...
Still, it could have been worse - suppose the wallpapered Black 5 idea had caught on...
I believe that is why Stepney got a very quick paint job - the BR emblem painted out, and renumbered from 32655 to 55, but otherwise in lined black. A bit later Bluebell got her "corporate" livery and most other early Bluebell locos got pre-grouping or pre-nationalisation liveries very quickly.
I think there was probably a relaxation on the "no BR liveries" rule after around 1968, when mainstream steam on BR was either gone or almost gone.
I think it lasted quite a bit longer than 1968. AFAIK, all the locos purchased at the end of steam received non-BR liveries when repainted. The Fairburn tanks, Black 5's and 61306 all lost their BR livery, those at Carnforth generally receiving pre-grouping ones. Several didn't get repainted straight away so managed to retain BR livery by default. 46443, 43106 and 45110 on the Valley spring to mind
44806 / 44932 went BR green… did that count as a no BR livery ?
this one not only escaped repaint. but ran on BR in BR livery in preservation too..
What about 75027? (Genuine question - a bit before my time, but I can't recall seeing any photo in a livery other than lined green)
34023 and 35028 can be added to the list.
The pictures of it in Michael Welch book " The Bluebell Railway Five Decades of Achievement taken on the 12th April 1969 ( it arrived on the 22/1/69) and the 19th September 1971 show it in lined green.
Didn't 34023 go into SR livery?
As I said, though, the 'no BR identification' clause didn't apply to every sale. I think it depended on where the loco was bought from. You would have to turn up copies of every sale contract to get a definitive answer.
She was certainly in SR livery when she entered service on the Bluebell in about 1976. Was she ever steamed between leaving BR service in 1967 and then? I don't know.
In BR livery for a while at Longmoor IIRC.
Just an observation but on the livery debate the GCR do not own the 8F, it was painted red by the owners before it got there. The 9F ditto. It was put into none standard livery before it got there!!
I gather that, once the double arrow logo was entrenched, BR stopped worrying about private use of earlier 'branding.' The double arrow was protected well into the 70s though: the first Hymek at the WSR quickly lost hers in favour of a stylised D&EG logo, and a condition of the BR allowing Thompsons to loan D5032 to the NYMR was that the logo and TOPS number be painted out.
There are pictures of the E4 in Bluebell ownership in BR black but with the 32 painted out to leave just 473 on the bunker. Can't recall if the BR emblem was painted out also.
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