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7027 Thornbury Castle

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by svrhunt, Jan 18, 2015.

  1. Flying Phil

    Flying Phil Member

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    Yes - work on the 04 has started,the motion is down, firebox cladding removed, boiler to be lifted soon I believe.
     
  2. JMJR1000

    JMJR1000 Member

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    Great news to hear the O4 hasn't been forgotten and is having work done, always found it to the be most handsome of all the heavy freights, and seemed so reliable in it's years of service in preservation too. Certainly it's nice for the GCR to have at least one of the company's original engines in operation at any rate, though if Butler Henderson was ever given any bout in operation I'd be all for that for sure.
     
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  3. Matt37401

    Matt37401 Part of the furniture

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    All for Butler Henderson to make a reapperance, don't think it made an appearance anywhere else did it?
     
  4. JMJR1000

    JMJR1000 Member

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    Not as far as I know no, it ran for a time on the GCR but that was years ago. A pity really for as far as 4-4-0s go, besides the Southern Railway's own Schools Class, the Improved Directors were considered the finest of their type (passenger 4-4-0s).
    Certainly I'd say they were the best looking/proportioned of the last examples of 4-4-0s, in my own opinion.
     
  5. JMJR1000

    JMJR1000 Member

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    Back to the topic at hand however, I do feel sorry for the WSR losing out on yet another engine to call their own, for it wasn't that long ago the railway was working on securing their own fleet of steam locomotives. Securing a long term deal for the 4F and purchasing 4110 prime examples of working towards this goal. But alas that seems to be all gone now, though understandably so seeing as the future of the very existence of the railway itself is in a fragile state right now, so that must of course be the priority.

    Can only hope when the railway has itself back on firmer footing, it can work towards that goal again, though what it would seek to secure is a hard question since acquiring a steam locomotive in good order is somewhat a rarity these days. They may have little choice to look at procuring some of the unrestored examples if it comes down to it.
     
  6. martin1656

    martin1656 Part of the furniture Friend

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    The problem though is will the railway ever have enough money to do anything but just get by year to year? how much will the ongoing need to repair the permanent way eat up each year? past mistakes I fear will extract a heavy cost on the future of the railway.
     
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  7. GWR4707

    GWR4707 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Was it an 'engine to call their own' it was owned by a member of the managing board in a personal capacity, I may have missed something but I don't recall seeing anything in his regular appearances in the media regarding the locomotive suggesting he was planning to gift it to the WSR, in fact didn't he try to flog it to the WSRA at one point?
     
  8. 60044

    60044 Member

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    I think the WSR has condemned itself to existing largely on what it already has or can hire in. I've made the point several times now, but overall trend in loco sales is for them to be bought from individuals or groups by the railway on which they are based. There have been exceptions, of course, but steam engines are railway's stock in trade and most have now appreciated the need to secure their continuity of supply by owning them - unfortunately has little such stock to call upon. As the years have gone by, more and more locos have been sold in this way and the potential sales pool dwindles ever more.
     
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  9. Monkey Magic

    Monkey Magic Well-Known Member

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    If it could be restored and was in ticket when 567 is completed that would be rather fab.

    I digress but I seem to recall the Stirling Single running on the GCR, I think I saw it on TV or in books on a couple of blue and grey mark 1s. Activities that would go down in the file marked 'stuff you can't do anymore'.
     
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  10. Flying Phil

    Flying Phil Member

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    Yes the Stirling Single did run on the GCR with two Mk1's and the 6 wheel brake van.....it went pretty briskly too!
    But back to 7027, there is a picture of it sitting outside the shed at Lbro with a nice copper capped chimney in place. The rain is giving it a shiny paint job!
     
  11. 1472

    1472 Well-Known Member

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    Not sure there is that much evidence to support that contention. Yes the NYMR have taken a few locos into their ownership but how many others are actively persuing that course? Where locos become Heritage Railway PLC owned pretty well all of the initiative exhibited by other active owning groups through share purchase, sales stands, working parties is lost. That "subsidy" can be considerable.
     
  12. std tank

    std tank Member

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    Mid Hants and the East Lancs, to name two.
     
  13. ghost

    ghost Well-Known Member

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    I believe the SVR have also acquired a couple of locos (600 and 4930, there may be more) and the DSR have bought a few (4110 and 4277).

    Keith
     
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  14. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    The Bluebell (either Trust or Plc) have acquired three locos in the last decade or so, though all three were locos that had a long prior association with the line and the change of ownership may therefore have not been so readily apparent. (178, 263, 592). Two of those three are currently operational, and for 178 at least, the change of ownership was probably the catalyst that enabled the restoration to proceed in earnest. The railway is also constructing new locomotives itself for its own use (i.e. that is being done by the railway, not a third party group).

    The Isle of Wight has also acquired six locos in the last decade or so - the three Ivatts, the Stroudley E1 and Austerities “Waggoner” and “Royal Engineer”. Apart from the mechanism by which they came into the formal ownership of the railway, I would interpret the two Ivatt tanks and the two Austerities as providing the kind of long-term sustainability of the loco fleet that @60044 talks about, in particular having relatively modern locos that can take the day-to-day pressure off the older locos so they can be used more sparingly for high days and holidays.

    That said, the point made by @1472 about the benefit (in money and Human Resources) of an independent group is also important: I don’t think there is a right or wrong answer, beyond thinking that a balance is probably desirable or, if a railway is reliant on externally owned locos, that the tie-in periods are suitably long.

    Tom
     
  15. Pete Thornhill

    Pete Thornhill Well-Known Member Staff Member Moderator

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    Three in total for the SVR, in addition to the two above they also own 45110.
     
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  16. Andy2857

    Andy2857 New Member

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    7819 is also owned by the SVR Charitable Trust. I think this is the most recent loco to transfer to SVR ownership.
     
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  17. 1472

    1472 Well-Known Member

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    If you blur the distinction between the SVR PLC & the Charitable Trust yes that makes 4 loosely SVR owned locos with 600, 45110 & 4930 (out of 26 allied to the railway). How much of a current asset these 4 are is debatable as all four are out of service with only 4930 having the prospect of working again any time soon. And its return to service is proving very costly.

    As far as I am aware the GWSR or its charity does not own a single steam loco or have any ambition to do so preferring the support of several dedicated owning organisations which again are closely allied to the railway.

    It might not have occurred to some but PLC ownership of locos is not necessarily a bed of roses compared to long term hire arrangements where the later provide some certainty of extent & timing of outgoings with the eventual overhaul risk sitting with the owner. PLCs have form in not properly providing for eventual overhauls as there are always year by year calls on cash which do not then get replaced.

    A railway cannot run without its infrastructure being in satisfactory order. It can though continue to run without a particular loco or item of rolling stock.
     
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  18. Robin

    Robin Member

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    To add to that, only 4930 and 45110 were actively bought. 600 was a loan and later gift from the Army Trust, while 7819 was bought from the owning group by the Charitable Trust in their role as 'owner of last resort'. Also the PLC has a history of selling as well as buying - 46443 and 45690 were both company locos at one time with the former having to be saved by the 46443 Fund to avoid it leaving the railway.
     
  19. daveb

    daveb Member

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    Did the PLC also, at one point, own 45690's former spare parts donor engine (45699) ?
     
  20. 1472

    1472 Well-Known Member

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    yes
     

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