4965 Thread

Not as easy as it first appears, far from a given Kinlet will be availible, then you have to take into account gauging, vac/air brake, max speeds, water range etc, and soon a large list can become considerably smaller.

 

Looks like 5029 and 6024 are the best GW locos in terms of route/operator availabilty and power output.

 

who,s been kidding you, what ever happened to 5043!

 

5043 is only Vacum Brake. Only West Coast operate Vacum Brake Locos
5043 will probably only operate Vintage Train Trips.
Hence the previous comment

 

Thanks for clearing that one up Paul42.

5029 and 6024 are dual braked, which means that both WCR and DBS will use them, they are both permitted to run at 75mph and they are both very powerful locos hence my previous comment. 5043 is a great machine but unfortunately will probably only ever do VT tours and will never visit preserved lines.

 

I would hardly say that a king has the best route availability.......
In terms of power output it has been shown on the shakespeare express that 5029 doesn't do as well as any of the halls on the climb out of stratford or accelerate as quick off hatton junction along the mainline. It does however have the advantage on its top permitted speed.....
There is also nothing unfortunate about the fact that 5043 will only ever run VT railtours, Tyseley has invested an awful lot of time and money in the rebuild of this loco and if anybody is going to make money out of operating it, it is going to be VT to put back into the tys collection! Why have a middle man taking his cut????
And 5043 can go just as many places with WCR as it can with DB without the hassle of fitting an airbrake system that doesn't work any better, if as well as the existing braking system...... Not to mention spoiling the appearence of a fine loco!

 

Well, 6024 can go wherever a Castle can go and thats as good as you are going to get with a GWR express passenger locomotive.

5029 has bigger wheels so can't accelerate as quick as a Hall.

I agree with that... I could have worded my statment better. Although what I was getting at is will we ever see 5043 at Penzance or will it always be around the midlands?

There is nothing wrong with the air brake system we use on 5029, and as for the air compressor there is no where else to put it! From our point of view it's very handy to have the compressor on the side of the loco as it is easy to get at for maintenance.

 

easy maintenance mate, do you not need to remove it to get the outside left valve out........

 

So not the same 5029 that sat down at Ludlow with air brake problems casuing hours of widespread delay on the Network last November??

 

Well, put it this way... The air pump doesn't work very well when boiler pressure is below 120psi! I'm sure you can see where i'm getting at. The air brakes have never failed on 5029 and believe me, there is nothing wrong with the air brake system on the engine. Enough said.

 

No, we don't need to remove it, just a few pipes. Nothing major.

 

[/QUOTE]Well, 6024 can go wherever a Castle can go and thats as good as you are going to get with a GWR express passenger locomotive.

5029 has bigger wheels so can't accelerate as quick as a Hall.[/QUOTE]

Correct, but you said 5029 was best for power output, acceleration times are just as important as top speeds in terms of keeping out of the way on the modern railway...
Not quite sure how you arrived at this statement...... Given that there is another castle about that has put up performances far beyond the capabilities of 5029 and thats not knocking the engine, but it is what it is, a single chimney low superheat castle... which in good hands are still a very capable engine.



[/QUOTE]I agree with that... I could have worded my statment better. Although what I was getting at is will we ever see 5043 at Penzance or will it always be around the midlands?[/QUOTE]

Who know's, but it hasn't exactly been confined to the midlands so far... it's been to london a couple of times, carlisle, llandudno, york, newport, to mention a few. Guess we'll have to wait and see what is on the cards for gw 175.


[/QUOTE]There is nothing wrong with the air brake system we use on 5029, and as for the air compressor there is no where else to put it! From our point of view it's very handy to have the compressor on the side of the loco as it is easy to get at for maintenance.[/QUOTE]

I never said there was anything wrong with 5029's air brake system, just merely said why bother? The only thing 5029 can do that 5043 cant is pull the royal train and the vsoe and whens it likely to do that???
As for the position of the pump, if it had a proper airbrake system like 6233 or 60163 with air brake cyls it would free up a lot of space to hide the pump......

 

And what about trains that aren't operated by WCRC? Some tour operators still use DBS and they won't operate vacuum stock or locos.

Can you please explain your comment on the air brakes....?

 

True, but theres few now that dont use both depending on the loco....

Air brake cyls are far smaller than vac cyls/ vac reservoirs, remove them and see how much space is available.. 6233 and 60163 are completely air brake, but have a vac ejector so they can pull vac trains just like a dual brake diesel.

 

Ah I see what you mean. Yes, removal of the Vac Cylinder would make a lot of room.
5029 is technically only vacuum braked, but has the ability to haul air braked trains. It's all very confusing!

 

I think its worth bearing in mind that in many ways a double chimney 4 row super heater castle (5043) is something of a different beast (and about 20 years more developed) from a low supeheat one (5029) - although they are both castles which is the main thing!

On a related issue Iam sure I read somewhere (thus getting my disclaimer in early that this may be rubbish!!) that it had been suggested that 5029 is something of a flier in that she will sustain long periods of high speed running but didn't seem to have the pulling/climbing power of 5051 which would climb anything given careful handling.

Not sure if this is true or not - have spoken to people from Swindon who have suggested that you could change every component on a castle and it wouldn't change its characteristics - it was a good one or it wasn't - although the exception was apparently 7018 who was a complete pig until they fitted the superheater and double chimney and then become one of if not the best!!

 

Interesting comments about Air Braking, while 5029's air pump on the running plate is ghastly from an asthetic point of view, is it not a handy place for it from a access/maintenence point ?, all the hidden away pumps on other loco's must be difficult to get at when "out on the road".

 

Easy answer to that is yes!

Although a lot of people do say that it looks hidious, many people have also said that they like the idea of it being where it is, in terms of maintenance and access. We like it where it is too... it's hard enough climbing around inside a 'Castle' as it is!

 

i take it from your comment their,s not much room inside a castle.