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GWR 813 Failure

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by nick813, Apr 26, 2022.

  1. nick813

    nick813 Well-Known Member Loco Owner

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    Unfortunately the failure of 813 on Saturday is more serious than a 'broken spring'. The casting which is part of the rear spring housing under the coal bunker has failed. This will require the casting to be removed, a new pattern made, the new casting made then machined and refitted. This will take a considerable time and a large amount of money to rectify. The South Devon Railway 150 celebration will be missed as well as several months steaming's at a The Embsay and Bolton Abbey Railway. This is a major set back for the Fund.
     
  2. Robin

    Robin Well-Known Member Friend

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    Sorry to hear that Nick, especially coming on top of the recent tube failure. I assume you'll let us know of any fund-raising appeals in due course.
     
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  3. 30854

    30854 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Oh the manifold joys of operating ancient and unique machinery!

    Whilst the old loco is up on crutches, can the opportunity be taken to make (at least provision for) patterns for the rest of the castings which form spring housings?
     
  4. D1039

    D1039 Part of the furniture

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    Having no inside info at all, I'd also mention that Bridgnorth Loco Works is out of bounds until August for roof and crane works, including I think the wheeldrop and jacks. Speculation, but that might complicate the investigation and plans for repair.
     
  5. Jimc

    Jimc Part of the furniture

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    I guess it all depends on the economics. In an ideal world I suppose every time a part got taken off you'd get it laser scanned so that you'd have an electronic copy on file, but unless you can get your scanning done at zero cost and minimal time delay its all extra money for an eventuality that may never arise. Also to consider is how much time you actually save by having the electronic files.
     
  6. Southernman99

    Southernman99 Member Friend

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    It is likely the work will be done later in the year. After the failure on Saturday. It was limped back at 5mph from Hampton Loade, driven straight into the back road of the shed and left. I would imagine the staff would have a look at it this week but having been there when it happened and looking at the casting. It all depends on how the casting is placed, whether it might need a boiler lift or whether it can all be done without. Either way it was a serious brown trouser moment when it happened and to see a 1 1/2" casting cracked and lifted by roughly 2" was eye opening. On initial inspection, there were concerns with how the spring is attached to the frames and where any damage has occured in that area, along with the cab floor. Luckily.... we have amazing patter makers at Bridgnorth and will hopefully be jumping on it.
     
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  7. Pete Thornhill

    Pete Thornhill Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Administrator Moderator Friend

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    It’s definitely a huge shame and easy to see why it’s a brown trouser moment.

    Hopefully repair times and costs can be minimised, 813 has not been the luckiest engine in preservation (in the early days at least), but definitely a gem.
     
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  8. acorb

    acorb Well-Known Member

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    Really sorry to hear this, the loco is a firm favourite of mine and is such a plucky performer - plus of significant historical interest too.
    I was on its run prior to the tube failure at last year's autumn gala, the run up to the tunnel was volcanic! Such a shame this has happened so quickly afterwards.
    I am sure the SVR engineers will get it fixed, but the timing with the planned closure of Bridgnorth MPD and at the start of summer hire agreements is terrible timing. I am sure any appeal would be well supported.
     
  9. Davo

    Davo Well-Known Member

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    I was just looking on the Hudswell Clarke website for the spring housing design but couldn't find no written description or drawing sketch of the spring is it a coil shaped piece of bar or rectangular long steel bar in what shape the spring is designed is it also behind the rear wheel set under the running frame, under the axle boxes? I was just taking interest cos I couldn't find a design blueprint diagram to look at the tank engines vital stats (structure).
     
  10. Jimc

    Jimc Part of the furniture

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    Hudswell Clarke Website? Where is that, not obvious to me with a web search.
     
  11. Davo

    Davo Well-Known Member

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    Hudswell clarke preserved British steam loco,s and on wikipedia is the Web site: I looked it up at, BUT I HAVE NEVER SEEN UNDER THE THE RUNNING FRAMES OF A HUDWSELL CLARKE WHEELSETS TANK LOCO. WHEN IVE SEEN SOME OF THEM IN LIVE STEAM. THATS THE ONLY REASON IM ASKING IF A STEEL ROLLING MILL THAT COULD BE FOUND ARE WILLING TO FORGE THE SPRING I DIDENT KNOW WHAT ONE IS SHAPED LIKE A SPRING ON A 0.6.0 H.C. TANK ENGINE. Its only why I ask about 813 is cos I'm a volunteer at kirklees light railway and just interested in the mechanical design of this type of tank loco. to see if anyone local knows how one is built no more said from me about it.
     
  12. alexl102

    alexl102 New Member

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    Gutted... Was looking forward to seeing her home in Yorkshire.
     
  13. nick813

    nick813 Well-Known Member Loco Owner

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    Hello,
    Three photographs of the fractured spring casting:
    casting in situ.
    protruding from the cab floor


    many thanks for the photos to
    Martin White Head of Engineering ,Severn Valley Railway, Engineering Services. 813 spring retaining casting failure1024_2.jpg 813 spring retaining casting failure1024_1.jpg
     
  14. Paul Grant

    Paul Grant Member

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    Jeez, that is quite impressive. Is the housing to be replaced right the way along the cab?
     
  15. acorb

    acorb Well-Known Member

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    I am not sure a 'like' is really appropriate for this post, but thanks for sharing. I hope the skilled engineers can affect an appropriate repair in due course..
     
  16. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    That's not a five minute job to repair. We've got another Hudswell with a similar arrangement of transverse spring at Middleton and definitely not the best of designs, even changing the spring is a nightmare. It's hard to tell from the photos whether there was an existing flaw but that stretcher is going to be subject to bending which is not the best thing to do with a lump of cast iron. Are you going to go for a fabricated replacement, which is what I'd be inclined to do?
     
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2022
  17. 3855

    3855 Member

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    Illingworth has a similar arrangement for rear springing
     
  18. Dunfanaghy Road

    Dunfanaghy Road Member

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    Probably a standard HC arrangement. I remember it on the ex-Slough engine that was at the Watercress once upon a time.
    Pat
     
  19. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    That’s the loco I was referring to, now at Middleton (and the subject of a recently started overhaul. ). The Ship Canal tanks don’t have this arrangement, though, with coil springs on the rear ‘boxes.
     
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  20. nick813

    nick813 Well-Known Member Loco Owner

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    GWR 813 at MPD Bridgnorth SVR. The locomotive has had the bunker, cab and cab roof removed. The broken casting has ben sent of for 3D scanning.
    Photo: Many Thanks to Evan Bradshaw. 283358189_2915607925400342_5663106693334966941_n.jpg
     
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