If you register, you can do a lot more. And become an active part of our growing community. You'll have access to hidden forums, and enjoy the ability of replying and starting conversations.

FR & WHR & WHHR News

Discussion in 'Narrow Gauge Railways' started by AndrewT, Jul 17, 2012.

  1. 30854

    30854 Resident of Nat Pres

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2017
    Messages:
    12,072
    Likes Received:
    11,406
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Brighton&Hove
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Unquestionably true and whilst "angry" certainly doesn't describe my own position, there's a case for "slightly bemused". I'm very glad to hear there's a ringfenced pot for this iconic machine, but fully understand why that fact isn't being shouted from the rooftops.

    So far as touting for donations goes, without definite goals, there's precious little point in trumpeting any restoration fund, as many who are hell bent on seeing the loco at the head of timetabled services are unlikely to favour anything short of that goal and those who'd prefer to see it displayed in a presentable condition (where?) seem likely to wait until certain that will be it's eventual fate. Nor will too many be likely to dig too deep, without some definite statement of intentions from the board.

    AFAIK (and I'm open to correction), there are three identifiable opposing viewpoints concerning the eventual status of the restored Alco, namely, display only, or restoration for either 'heritage, high days and holidays', or restored as more of a 'second row' frontline loco. In none of those cases is there much which can be done to draw up a schedule of works, on which to base any estimates of time or cost, ahead of a complete stripdown and examination. It's about now I'll confess to being distinctly glad I'm not in Mr.Lewin's shoes!

    At the moment, the situation, without serious project funding, suggests:

    (a) do nowt, as it's safely stowed away, out of harm's way
    (b) give it a cosmetic only restoration for display purposes

    As I see it, to go further, the only sensible course for now is to form some reasonable estimate for what'd be involved in facilitating a stripdown. What happens next seems entirely dependant on what's found, with the likely options being:

    (c) throw hands up in despair, estimate cost of tarting up components for static display
    (d) throw hands up and approach the donor's representatives for permission to sell
    (e) whoop with delight that it's not as knackered as seems likely, estimate cost of repairs to either heritage or active status
    (f) whoop with horror at a condition worse than anticipated, estimate cost of repairs to either heritage or active status

    In all the above cases, as happened with Welsh Pony, the views of the membership will need to be considered, before anything much else could reasonably be expected to happen.

    That's just my own thoughts. Others may see things rather differently.
     
  2. Miff

    Miff Part of the furniture Friend

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2008
    Messages:
    2,532
    Likes Received:
    2,136
    Maybe there’s another option- send it to Statfold (I won’t bother with my coat - never needed one of those in Wales).
     
  3. Monkey Magic

    Monkey Magic Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2018
    Messages:
    3,498
    Likes Received:
    6,843
    Location:
    Here, there, everywhere
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Yeah, the suggestion cab wasn't serious. Unfortunately, the internet does not convey tongue in cheek very well. Like you, I liked working on the loco and didn't really see the complaints that others made about it. I'm happily well out from it now.
     
    andrewshimmin likes this.
  4. marshall5

    marshall5 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2010
    Messages:
    2,160
    Likes Received:
    3,194
    Location:
    i.o.m
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Mountaineer doesn't have to have the TPT "shed" of a cab as seen above. I would much prefer to see it like its sister WD1257/TPT 3-20 which has been restored to WW1 condition at Tacot les Lacs as seen here https://www.flickr.com/photos/131103326@N05/47501954301
    Granted it would be restricted to the WHR as a 'high days and holidays' loco but would that be such a bad thing?
    Thanks for posting the lovely TPT pics BTW.
    Ray.
     
    Monkey Magic likes this.
  5. Monkey Magic

    Monkey Magic Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2018
    Messages:
    3,498
    Likes Received:
    6,843
    Location:
    Here, there, everywhere
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
  6. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2006
    Messages:
    11,136
    Likes Received:
    8,549
    Occupation:
    Gentleman of leisure, nowadays
    Location:
    Near Leeds
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Small locos generally don't make as much noise as large ones and, in my experience, Salter valves aren't that noisy. I know of several locos where the valves are in the cab - Hudswell Clarke and Manning Wardle were fond of doing this on smaller locos - and there are plenty of quarry Hunslets out there that no one seems to complain about. Besides, it's an incentive to not blow off and, as it's a Salter valve, you can always hold it down if it annoys you. ;)
     
  7. Meiriongwril

    Meiriongwril Member

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2007
    Messages:
    722
    Likes Received:
    528
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Cymru
    Couple of points about the two new-build FfR/WHR locos. In particular their websites.
    The Mountaineer folk really need to proof-read and correct their posts, e.g.: https://www.1863mountaineerloco.co.uk/ I know people will say that weird misplaced punctuation and mis-spellings are unimportant, but it sure gives a bad impression. I gather they use Facebook more often than the website, but the donation button is on the website - I couldn't see anything similar on Facebook.
    The Gowrie team also use Facebook a lot, but the problem with their website is incompleteness. You click on news - under construction; you click on how to donate - under construction! Surely to goodness at least the donation page should be fixed!
    I support both projects, but wish they looked a little more professional! (And before anyone says why don't I do the corrections/updating, I'm too busy with other groups!)
     
  8. 30854

    30854 Resident of Nat Pres

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2017
    Messages:
    12,072
    Likes Received:
    11,406
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Brighton&Hove
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Can't disagree with any of that. It seems what's needed, for many places, is someone well versed in website design and social media with a passing interest in railways, an allergy to machine oil (and quite probably daylight) who feels the need to let their skills be seen by potential employers or customers. I'm certain they're out there and heritage websites ought to be a great place to cut their teeth and get seen.

    Maybe we're either not looking under the right rocks, or just not seriously looking for solutions in the first place. Us oldsters have had over 20 years to get to grips with the potential of t'interweb thingy and as t'ain't going away any time soon, time is we stopped umming and aahing. If an online presence is needed .... SORT IT OUT! As always, there are three ways of getting things done: (1) Do it yourself (2) Pay someone else to do it (3) Forbid your children to do it. Here endeth the diatribe.

    Right ...... coffee time! :)
     
  9. ghost

    ghost Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    May 29, 2006
    Messages:
    3,428
    Likes Received:
    3,788
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    N.Ireland
    As someone who has done a little website design/updating etc., one of the biggest problems is getting new content.

    It's all very well having a flashy website, but if the last news article is from 2018, it's not going to grab the reader's attention or even elicit a donation (unless it's a reference website of course).
    It needs someone to work a camera and provide some notes of what is happening, alongside someone to format and upload the content. Of course in some cases, such as the NNR C&W reports and @Breva's GWSR reports, this can be one and the same person.

    Keith
     
    andrewshimmin, mdewell, 30854 and 3 others like this.
  10. goldfish

    goldfish Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2009
    Messages:
    13,395
    Likes Received:
    9,754
    It looks as though the Mountaineer site is managed old-skool style by someone with an HTML editor and a bit of FTP (or similar) so it's probably not an easy thing to collaborate on (that's not criticism, just reflecting the difficulty involved in managing web content).

    It's really easy to criticise websites, but most of the people running these sites are train enthusiasts first and website managers thirty third or less. It's why easy to use social media channels like Facebook or Instagram can be such a boon for organisations without professional digital support, particularly in a hobby as photographer-friendly as trains – a photo and a few words uploaded to Facebook or Ig is likely vastly simpler than creating a news story, attaching a photo, incorporating relevant links, and then uploading the whole shebang to the intertubes. Potentially more valuable as a mini-update to folks who demand to know what's going on every time a bolt is tightened on their preferred loco.

    Simon
     
    LesterBrown, ghost, 30854 and 3 others like this.
  11. clam1952

    clam1952 New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2012
    Messages:
    142
    Likes Received:
    52
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Crewe Cheshire
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    The problem with Facebook etc is many people will not go anywhere near them and the garbage they spew out, not realising that there are sensibly used pages. I use FB but have all the annoyances blocked which you can do.
     
    Robkitchuk likes this.
  12. LittleRedTrain

    LittleRedTrain New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2015
    Messages:
    196
    Likes Received:
    214
    Location:
    Oxfordshire
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    I'll second that.
    In the past, I created and maintained websites for a few voluntary organisations (including railway related ones) as well as other charities. I didn't charge for my services, but would usually be given free membership as a 'thank you'.

    As I wasn't able to attend all events/meetings, I was constantly having to chase people for new content and photos.
    It was very hard to persuade people that after any event, they needed to send me a couple of paragraphs and some photos as a matter of course, just to keep the membership and general public in the loop.

    I would then get the same people who failed to send me content, complaining that the website wasn't being kept to date!

    These days I favour the idea of creating a website using a CMS like WordPress, and then providing key members/contributors with training on how to add their own updates with a WYSIWYG editor.
    Admittedly, depending on the quality of contributions, you may still need someone who can act as editor/proof reader.

    There are also still a lot of people who think: 'I put it on Facebook, why does it also need to go on our website?'
    There are a few railways where I can't find out which loco they plan to run on a given day without going to their Facebook page.

    EDIT: The above posters made similar points while I was writing this.
     
    mdewell and 30854 like this.
  13. 30854

    30854 Resident of Nat Pres

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2017
    Messages:
    12,072
    Likes Received:
    11,406
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Brighton&Hove
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Just to clarify, my earlier post [#2167] wasn't intended as criticism of any particular website, merely offering one possible route to keeping abreast of the undoubted advantages which come with today's IT. That others have pointed to potential pitfalls is equally valid, but certainly not a reason to avoid the matter completely.

    I'll hold my hands up and say everything this side of Visual C++ is a mystery to me .... and to those who haven't a scwbi what that is, if it helps, compare an original L&B Manning Wardle with Duke of Gloucester
     
    pete2hogs, andrewshimmin and ghost like this.
  14. Hirn

    Hirn Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2015
    Messages:
    400
    Likes Received:
    261
    Gender:
    Male
    Not what they are supposed to do, indeed the pop chamber is meant to ensure they don't.
     
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2020
  15. Paulthehitch

    Paulthehitch Member

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2020
    Messages:
    932
    Likes Received:
    985
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Hayling Island
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Perhaps not but this was observed by me once when aboard the W.H.R. observation car.
     
  16. RLinkinS

    RLinkinS Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2008
    Messages:
    773
    Likes Received:
    808
    Gender:
    Male
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    If you consider the physics of the valve there will always be some steam passing the seat before pop valves fully open. As the force created by the pressure on the disc balances the force exerted by the spring the seating force is zero. Steam then starts to flow out at a low rate. This rate is insufficient to exert enough force on the part of the valve that causes it to fully open. The steam flow has to increase a little more before the valve "pops" open. You have to watch closely to see this happening and there is probably not time to put on an injector to reduce boiler pressure.

    I made pop valves for my 5" gauge loco and you can see them feathering.

    On power station boilers one of the safety valves usually had an electric lift assistance device to stop them feathering/simmering. This would open the valve fully just below the set lift pressure. At the pressure these boilers operated at simmering would cause the steam to damage the seats.

    Sent from my SM-A105FN using Tapatalk
     
  17. CymruGarratt

    CymruGarratt New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2008
    Messages:
    68
    Likes Received:
    13
    On the s.g. Austerity I'm involved with, the valves don't feather as such, but you know when they're about to go off as there's a tell-tale whistling noise
     
    RLinkinS likes this.
  18. 45669

    45669 Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2006
    Messages:
    2,679
    Likes Received:
    954
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Farnborough
    Evening All,

    As I can't go out to film and photograph trains at the moment, I've been passing the time digitalising some of my old video tapes. And today I started doing some old FR ones. The first part of the first one is now on YouTube and this features the EARL OF MERIONETH, MOUNTAINEER and a blue LINDA in 1991.

    If anyone fancies having a look, this is where you'll find it:



    Hope it's of interest.
     
    ragl, Bob Millard, clam1952 and 5 others like this.
  19. andrewshimmin

    andrewshimmin Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2011
    Messages:
    1,741
    Likes Received:
    2,101
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Marvellous, really enjoyed that. Thank you.

    Sent from my Pixel 3a using Tapatalk
     
  20. 45669

    45669 Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2006
    Messages:
    2,679
    Likes Received:
    954
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Farnborough
    Glad you liked it. There'll be further instalments in the fulness of time, so watch this space...
     
    andrewshimmin likes this.

Share This Page