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ETL [ACLG] To dispose of fleet

Discussion in 'Diesel & Electric Traction' started by markb846, Jan 27, 2013.

  1. Peter Hall

    Peter Hall Guest

    Would anyone like to confirm/squash the rumour doing the rounds about 84001. This being that it is to leave the custodianship of the ACLG for a different custodian who can offer undercover accommodation not many miles from its birth place. Certainly its current deteriorating appearance while wintering outside at Barrow Hill has been raising concerns with enthusiasts and presumably the National Railway Museum. If true, then one less burden for the ACLG/ETL.
     
  2. markb846

    markb846 New Member

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    Just had a look there is nothing on the ACLG web site.
     
  3. vanbasher

    vanbasher New Member

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    Markb: There is an update on the ACLG forum but as my membership has expired I cannot access it. I have been trying to find out anything I can regarding the future primarily of the main line fleet and there is an update I cannot read. If anyone who's a member could please read the post and update me on the state of play I would greatly appreciate it. I would renew my membership to the group but with the mainline fleet looking so uncertain I have decided against it until I can find out for sure. Cheers all

    VANBASHER.... THE CLASS 87 BASHER HAVING TO LOOK TO EASTERN EUROPE FOR ACTION!
     
  4. markb846

    markb846 New Member

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    The only thing I saw regarding the 87 was it was used to heat the stock of Saturday 09/03 CME . Nothing on the news front, last time I went past WN 86's still there No sign of 86101 at Ilford a week ago last Thursday. As always if I hear anything I will post it here.
     
  5. vanbasher

    vanbasher New Member

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    86101 and 87002 are still at Carlisle atm Mark the ice breaking contract they had post Xmas and into this year as far as I'm aware ended sometime back in Febuary. In the mean time both have heated the stock of the Cumbrian (with the exception of day 1 the 2/2/2013) when neither were used and the stock sat in the platform loco less. Rumour has it when the pair are eventually moved back south 101 will go to Ilford to swop with 86702 which is on a MK3 heating and shunting excercise their.

    Cheers all VANBASHER.... THE CLASS 87 BASHER SEARCHING FOR HIS TRACTION!
     
  6. class8mikado

    class8mikado Part of the furniture

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    Think its important that theres a desire to save these Locos, though one wonders how long it might be/ if there will ever be a preserved line with overheads for these to run on when mainline isnt an option...
     
  7. markb846

    markb846 New Member

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    I have go the latest up date from the ACLG. This is available to download from the members area on their web site. The document is 6 pages long, and mainly talks about the financial options for continuing mainline operations. In addition to the cost of the GSM-R equipment. There are changes in the pipeline to allow higher fault currents on the OHL equipment needing the main Air Blast Circuit breaker to be replaced with a new Vacuum Circuit Breaker design. The main locomotive plans are likely to be 86213 either exported or scrapped. 86401/424 scrapped 86101 static preservation 87002 exported. The custardy of 84001 has returned to the NRM, as the official loan agreement ended in 2008. Work has also stopped on 89001. Sorry the news is not better, but it seems only the prototype electric locos have a secure future at Barrow Hill.
     
  8. ADB968008

    ADB968008 Guest

    Why scrap 86213/401/424, when there's a whole bunch more in storage..., send it to storage I understand, scrapping is either malicious, inciteful or desperation.
    Is the ACLG massively in debt ?
     
  9. Neil_Scott

    Neil_Scott Part of the furniture

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    The same thought occurs to me. There must be some other alternative than just to scrap 3 86s, however the diesel and electric side of preservation seem quite happy to send stuff to the scrapman when it suits them.
     
  10. ADB968008

    ADB968008 Guest

    Maybe one of the group is starting university and needs to cash out for his tuition fees ? :)
    True enough, it kind of smacks of immaturity, or too much money.

    I keep thinking of various 37/4's etc bought because of passion, but later scrapped for reality of getting a better one later, which begs the question.. why buy it in the first place ?
    (I wonder if the 1st preserved class 58 will ever run, before one of it's operational class mates comes available for sale..?.. and if it didn't is that really time and money wasted ?)

    Imagine if in the 60's 20 odd Black 5s were preserved and one by one they were sent to scrap because x or y was worn out... once it's gone.. it's gone...
    Some steam examples I could think of would be 44806, 46233, 61264 etc and there poor fireboxes on entry to preservation in the 60's etc etc.., maybe 60103 could have been scrapped because a better condition A1 was found instead ?
    maybe modern preservationists just have it too easy... for now.
     
  11. richards

    richards Part of the furniture

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    ... or panicking people into buying them?

    Richard
     
  12. markb846

    markb846 New Member

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    While I do not approve of what the ACLG a are planning I do understand their reasons. Like diesels electric traction fairs poorly when stood around cold. The transformer silicon oil readily absorbs water when it goes cold. Corrosion forms on electrical contactors and relays, and cable insulation starts to break down. No while it is true none of this is impossible to repair it is skilled work, and you need access to schematic drawings for fault finding and repairs. It maybe the case the ACLG have made a bit of a mistake by concentrating too heavily on commercial operations, which needed contract maintenance to sustain the operation, at the expense of growing the skilled volunteer pool. There is also the question of storage and insurance costs incurred by having to keep locomotives at an electrified depot. 86424 was only ever a source of spares and never had a long term future. 86213 is said to be in poor condition, as it was an early casualty withdrawn because of its condition rather than not required. The loco is technically similar to 86259. The saddest case is 86401, which has had repairs undertaken but deteriorated through lack of use.
     
  13. Neil_Scott

    Neil_Scott Part of the furniture

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    Hardy an excuse to scrap all of them just because it'll take a bit of work to make them work again. I really question whether some of the people involved are actually preservationists or whether they wanted to play at running a rolling stock hire company. A future as a static exhibit in a museum or exhibition would be a better result than simply scrapping them.
     
  14. Anthony Coulls

    Anthony Coulls Well-Known Member

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    The Group have ceded the loan of 84 001, but its future remains under discussion with various parties. News when there's something to report.
     
  15. goldfish

    goldfish Resident of Nat Pres

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    Good job there's masses of spare, secure undercover storage space for heritage vehicles going begging, isn't it?

    Simon
     
  16. Neil_Scott

    Neil_Scott Part of the furniture

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    You'd rather see them scrapped then sit outside a bit longer?
     
  17. TheLairdofNetherMoor

    TheLairdofNetherMoor New Member

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    I would, if it means the ACLG are able to maintain their other locos in a reasonable state for a while longer. My understanding was that the mainline operations were intended to provide the income necessary to look after the other locos in their fleet. It appears not to have worked out that way, so it may be time to move on before they bankrupt themselves and lose everything, possibly to the scrap man.

    There are far too many locos preserved as it is and I think it's inevitable many of the currently 'preserved' locos will end up in the scrapyard. As time goes on, this will also occur with more and more of our steam locos, as well as the diesel and electrics. There simply isn't the mass enthusiasm for railways amongst the younger generations that'll be necessary to maintain the current number of lines / locos. My expectation is that all we'll be left with in another couple of generations are the commercially viable operations that don't rely too heavily on volunteer labour.
     
  18. ADB968008

    ADB968008 Guest

    They said the same about canals when railways came in the 1860's...I'm sure the Egyptians said the same about camels too but both are still with us, though admittedly I'm sure the Neanderthals would disagree when humans came around, but sometimes I think they too are still among us... They just adapted.
    Freightliner has a fleet of 86's, Bulgaria has a fleet of 87's so they can't be that uneconomical.
    its very easy to predict the end of the world, but it only needs imagination to stop it from happening.

    never did see much marketing in getting these locos any work.
     
  19. TheLairdofNetherMoor

    TheLairdofNetherMoor New Member

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    I'm hardly predicting the end of the world, just the likely demise of *some* of the lines / locos that are currently with us now. It really shouldn't come as any surprise that it'll happen. In the case of railway preservation, there simply aren't the numbers coming into it, let alone sufficient with the 'imagination' to sustain what has already been built up. The volunteer pool for existing projects will be further diluted as some of the newcomers will inevitably have interests in preserving the more modern traction types of their era.
     
  20. ADB968008

    ADB968008 Guest

    Really... What's to say the post 1968 generation won't grow up yearning to preserve the steam of their childhood, or the diesels of their teenage years... The only memories being those of preserved lines and shun Modern electrics ?
    afterall, no one born after 1968 will have ever seen a BR Green Lord Nelson, or Leander, or A Princess in anything other than Red, or
    Theres plenty of preserved steam in memory that hasn't been seen running in a long time.. 21c123, 34105, 7808, 7819, 41708, 5900, 75069, 80064... Those memories don't fade.
     

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