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Bluebell Railway General Discussion

Discussion in 'Heritage Railways & Centres in the UK' started by Jamessquared, Feb 16, 2013.

  1. Cuckoo Line

    Cuckoo Line Member

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    Interesting to see how Bluebell are drawing families along. They look like things you can do at least once a year without boring people and if people like it I,m sure they will keep coming. I guess the challenge will be to make surecall ages are catered for in some way.
     
  2. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    There was an interesting comment on that in the most recent of the Chairman's weekly emails:

    "The two days of this event [Bluey and Bingo, held on the Sunday and Monday of the Coronation Bank Holiday weekend - TJ] were a real success, generating more than double what we would normally take in fares on these two days of a bank holiday weekend. Catering and shop takings were also up. Considering the economics, the cost of putting on the event was less than £4k and yet we generated more than £15k additional revenue, whilst not running any additional trains - just the normal weekend service of five departures."
    Tom
     
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  3. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    Meanwhile, for the enthusiast and member:

    20-21 May: Road Meets Rail

    3 June: BRPS Members' Day and AGM (n.b. 2pm at Horsted Keynes. If you arrive at the Burgess Hill Academy at 7pm, you'll likely be lonely!) See page 3 of the most recent edition of The Bluebell Times for details.

    10-11 June: Bluebell on Parade. From the timetable (downloadable from that page), it looks like this will be the first opportunity for revenue-earning trips behind the new Class 73. It looks like it does a morning full line trip to East Grinstead, then spends the day doing East Grinstead - Kingscote shuttles, and returns full line in the late afternoon. Other locos in traffic are 72, 65, 6989 and 80151 - almost a century of Southern loco designs (with a Western interloper ...) "Skippy" and the 09 will be available for footplate visits (09) and footplate rides on Skippy

    Carriages:
    SET A- PRE-GROUPING SET WITH 65
    SET B- MK1 SET WITH E6040
    SET C- SHUTTLE PUSH-PULL SERVICE (OBSERVATION COACH+72+GN SALOON)
    SET D- 1923 TO 1948 GROUPING SET WITH 6989
    SET E- 1948-1968 BR MK1 SET WITH 80151+

    Tom
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2023
  4. Mark Thompson

    Mark Thompson Well-Known Member

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    Something which caught my eye was the comment about having something "interesting" in mind for 1464 when it is withdrawn for overhaul. Always assuming that doesn't mean selling it :), I wonder what that could be? After all, there's only so much one could do to a Bulleid open 3rd, surely?
     
  5. RichardSalmon

    RichardSalmon New Member

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    You can't sell something you don't own... (or at any rate, it is 25% owned by the Bluebell Trust).
     
  6. RichardSalmon

    RichardSalmon New Member

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    Below are a few of the engines you’ll see working around Horsted Keynes station at our Road meets Rail event this coming weekend, Saturday 20 and Sunday 21 May. The Event Guide is also now available as a PDF.

    Wood sawing, road building, thrashing… deliveries by steam wagon and pantechnicon… loads being lowered into wagons by steam crane… the sights of a bygone age being brought back to life at The Bluebell Railway!

    [​IMG]
     
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  7. Cuckoo Line

    Cuckoo Line Member

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    Hopefully some innovative way to fund and do its restoration ?
     
  8. NGChrisW

    NGChrisW New Member

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    Conversion to a Tavern car complete with half timbers and "brickpaper" ? - I'll get my coat......
     
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  9. CH 19

    CH 19 Well-Known Member Friend

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    :p:p
     
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  10. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    I heard a suggestion, but since it appears that whatever the plan is, it still needs finalising (as per the chairman's weekly update) I won't speculate, except to draw attention to the C&W update in the latest Bluebell News.

    That said, in part:

    "There has been a shift in policy away from attempting to maintain two operational sets of BR Mk 1s, and instead follow the society's stated long-term aim of operating a set of each of Mk 1s, Bulleids and Maunsells. This has resulted in another couple of Mark 1s being offered for disposal. [...] The sub-committee have also proposed three further carriages for disposal, for consideration by the society and Plc boards."
    I would read into that a rosier future for Maunsell and Bulleid carriages.

    It would be interesting to know the strategy of what the long-term Bulleid fleet might look like. Currently there are:

    2526 (Semi-open Saloon 3rd Brake - Operational)
    5768 (Corridor Composite - Operational)
    1464 (Open 3rd - Operational, soon to be withdrawn)
    1482 (Open 3rd - Operational)
    1481 (Open 3rd)
    2515 Semi open Saloon 3rd brake
    4279 Semi open Saloon 3rd brake
    4227 Semi open Saloon 3rd brake with Coupe
    1456 (Open 3rd - On long-term loan to the Mid Hants)

    So you have no fewer than four Semi Open Saloon brake 3rds; three open thirds (ignoring the ninth vehicle on loan to the MHR) and a Corridor Composite.

    First class seating is immediately at a premium (and makes 5768 very important).

    Beyond that, the obvious missing vehicle is one with wheelchair capability - would one of the four brake vehicles be suitable for a conversion there? A four coach set with 2526 + 5768 + one of the open 3rds + a wheelchair-converted brake would look like a good "core" set to me, with in the long run the other open 3rds available as strengthening vehicles to 5/6 coaches when warranted. 4 Bulleids is within the load limit of the O1 / H class (in fact that was the second service set last weekend behind the O1); the C class, Dukedog and E4 would be allowed 5.

    (Also worth noting that AIUI, the operationally-favoured vehicles for SteamLights - and I think Santa - were side-corridor compartment vehicles where the compartments could be sold individually. Whereas mid-week, coach parties seem to prefer open vehicles).

    Tom
     
  11. Nick C

    Nick C Well-Known Member

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    The Semi-open brake at the Mid-Hants was being used as a wheelchair accessible vehicle (it's out of service at the moment), the two compartments had been stripped out when it was in departmental service and havn't been reinstated, so instead form a smaller open saloon with loose seating. If you keep it looking standard from the outside you've alos got the option of running the traditional SR 3-set as well then, which'd look great for photos!
     
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  12. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    From the BRPS website:

    Society AGM
    Horsted Keynes Station, Saturday 3rd June 2023 commencing at 2pm


    The BRPS AGM documents are in the post but are published here as a backup and for the benefit of members, especially those overseas. Please note the Accounts booklet only contains the Society accounts as the Plc and abridged Trust accounts for 2022 were not finalised at the date we went to press. This version of the Society accounts includes, for comparative purposes only, the 2021 numbers for the former unincorporated Society.

    Any member wishing to vote by proxy must do so by NOON on 31st May 2023. Scanned and signed proxy voting forms may be emailed to the address shown on the form and must include your membership number for validation purposes.

    Gavin Bennett
    Secretary

    The PDF Downloads are available from the BRPS Members’ Information page.​
     
  13. RichardSalmon

    RichardSalmon New Member

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    Tim Preston has produced an options document for creating a wheelchair-accessible Bulleid carriage for the Rolling Stock Sub-Committee, and it's being updated further.
    The dis-advantage of using a double-doors of the brake is that, to make the corridor wide enough for wheelchairs to get past the (already small) guard's compartment would make the compartment too small to be practical. It also requires the removal of the key feature of a Bulleid brake - the mix of compartments and open saloon. The un-restored 4227 is unique in having a coupe-compartment (the Watercress Line's one would have had one, but has been sacrificed for the wheelchair access). A better option for a brake conversion is considered to be adding an additional half door somewhere, allowing ramped access to the saloon. However, we currently prefer the option of using one of the three identical Opens - and it appears you could fit a half door in at the toilet end, without needing to alter the toilet compartments.
    But no decision has yet been taken - the highest priority on the Bulleids is to finish the 3/4 completed intermediate overhaul and re-trim of 1482, and then as Paul Churchman has indicated, hopefully to do something overhaul-wise with 1464 (which has been in service since 1986, with just a light intermediate overhaul undertaken in the intervening period).

    Over a period of time we undoubtedly need to move towards having decent wheelchair access to every carriage set - at present we can do it for the 4-wheelers, for Mk.1 and Bulleid sets using the two converted Mk.1s, and from later this year, once Car 54 is completed, in the Pullman set. The two Mk.1s probably cover the requirement for accommodating large pre-booked parties, so other carriages just need provision for maybe 2-3 wheelchairs at once,although this is something where we need to confirm requirements with the operational and commercial departments.
    Richard
     
  14. Paul42

    Paul42 Part of the furniture

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  15. gwilialan

    gwilialan Well-Known Member

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    Just got all my AGM notification paperwork through the post and I note that with regard to voting the Bluebell has fallen into the same trap as many other railways had. This has been done to death on several other threads on here and the outcome has always been the same so I'll just point out the problem.
    Where a position is vacant and only one person stands the current board/committee cannot just say that person is elected unopposed. You need to acknowledge that the voting members have just as much right to reject a nominee as they have to approve him/her, so for every vote for a candidate the members must be given a choice to vote for or against the candidate. Failing to do this is a clear case of removing the members right to chose.
    Anyone who has shares in a company will see on their AGM forms that wherever a person is standing for re-election unopposed the shareholders still have a choice to vote for or against that re-election, it doesn't matter who it is, that's the only way the members/shareholders get a free and unfettered choice.
    And yes, if the members/shareholders do reject the proposed single candidate then the board has its work cut out to find a suitable alternative to co-opt until the next AGM. Co-opting the rejected candidate is not considered to be a good idea... (but there again, if this was West Somerset...:eek:)
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2023
  16. MellishR

    MellishR Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    Surely this depends on the constitution / articles of association / whatever of the body concerned. I am a trustee of a Charitable Incorporated Organisation which took over the functions, assets, liabilities and membership of a previous unincorporated association. In both cases members would be invited to vote (in advance of an AGM) only if there were more candidates than places. AFAIK that has never happened.
     
  17. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    FWIW, for the Trustee elections there are more candidates than vacancies (6 candidates for 5 vacancies). The Vice Chairman, Membership Trustee and Finance Trustee are elected unopposed this time.

    Tom
     
  18. gwilialan

    gwilialan Well-Known Member

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    The one thing that organisations seem to forget is that the members/shareholders etc should have a choice and that choice should include the ability to reject as well as to approve. Take an example where the least popular member, with the numeric skills of a warthog, stood unopposed for a financial directors position. Working on your system that member must be appointed as no one has the opportunity to vote to say "...no, we don't want him." OK, that's a bit extreme but, if you take the Bluebell example I have no clear choice, I can only vote 'for' candidates. I can use numbers one through whatever to identify those I support, make no mark against those I don't care about either way but have no ability whatsoever to actually oppose the election of any individual (i.e. to vote 'against' a candidate)

    I'll go no further and post no more about this as it's taken up pages and pages on other threads. All I'll ask is that organisations look at their voting systems and ask themselves the question "Does our system actually give the voters the clear ability to say 'yes' or 'no' to whatever or whoever or can they only say 'yes' by voting or 'maybe' by not placing a vote?" It's up to the organisations to decide.
     
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  19. johnofwessex

    johnofwessex Resident of Nat Pres

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    All Green Party internal elections have RON as an option, reopen nominations.
     
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  20. 35B

    35B Nat Pres stalwart

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    You’re asking to be able to blackball someone. The Bluebell election gave the ability to choose between 6 candidates and use preferences to favour some, and blanks to vote against others.

    By contrast, in other elections, I’ve had the option to vote for/against/abstain on each individual candidate. I tend to prefer the vote to be for the candidates as a group, as it focuses the mind on the board as a whole, not favourite individuals.


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