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6201, her new lease of life.

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by Sidmouth, Feb 7, 2017.

  1. martin1656

    martin1656 Nat Pres stalwart Friend

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    The point i was trying to make, not very well i will admit was that it cost's a lot of money to overhaul a steam loco and whilst the owning society might have stumped up some towards it, it's clearly not yet the full amount needed, and no one does anything for free, how does west coast protect its investment in the loco, whilst protecting its own business, west coast might not own the loco, but they will control it, but then, what happens if the arrangement does not work out? and lissie does not earn back that money, thats why surely to protect your interests, you need to have some shareholding in the loco, so that enables you to absorb any short fall and regroup your investment over a longer time span, I actually think some share ownership deal with west coast having a share in the engine might protect its future better than having to go cap in hand to verious groups over the years, as has been the way in the past.
     
  2. Miff

    Miff Part of the furniture Friend

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    Since both parties are private companies (PELS is not a charity) they're entitled to make any deals they deem appropriate, with any associated financial risk.
     
  3. osprey

    osprey Resident of Nat Pres

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    Indeed, and furthermore the statement "West Coast control it", where does that information come from?
     
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  4. martin1656

    martin1656 Nat Pres stalwart Friend

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    so who is the TOC? Thats what i mean about control, anyway I shan't post about 6201 any further, as i'm fed up with people, ( the same ones i must add) seemingly on a personal vendetta every time i post anything. mods please take note,
     
  5. ghost

    ghost Part of the furniture

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    If you post statements that can't be backed up by facts, then don't be surprised if people pull you up.
    Do you think Ian Riley has part ownership of 5212 just because he leases it from the KWVR?
     
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  6. Gav106

    Gav106 Well-Known Member

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    https://6201.co.uk/index.php/2024/0...dSBNSDDXa5yBsEtab2gp_sWciqtMPmmCuMVRSov67_Udk

    An update on the loco. Calling for funds. It looks like this overhaul is going to cost a lot of money, and that seems in line with what both Tyseley and PRCLT told them years ago before its last time in service, so good to see that they are now going to address these issues. It will be interesting to know how much of this overhaul will be paid for via the society, as they have been quite unsuccessful in recent fundraising endeavours, or if there is likely to be any deal done by/with westcoast.
     
  7. GWR4707

    GWR4707 Nat Pres stalwart

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    The PDF linked to in the piece suggests c.£176k for the overhaul.
     
  8. LMS2968

    LMS2968 Part of the furniture

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    £176k isn't an overhaul but a fairly minor repair. Overhaul costs start at £1/2M and rise rapidly.
     
  9. GWR4707

    GWR4707 Nat Pres stalwart

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    Who knows, only quoting what they have said in their piece, the fact that its such a precise figure suggests that its based upon something rather than just plucked out of the sky?

    As an aside I think that's the 8F's cab next to her which would suggest that she is under overhaul again,, which is good news.
     
  10. Gladiator 5076

    Gladiator 5076 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Not sure what £176,00! as quoted in that pdf actually means.
    As others have said way to cheap for an overhaul should it be £1,760,000?
     
  11. Johnb

    Johnb Nat Pres stalwart

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    It may mean the rest of the money is there or they have an overhaul and use arrangement with West Coast. Whatever the situation WC badly need another engine capable of working air braked trains. A great shame that Bahamas wasn’t equipped at its last overhaul
     
  12. class8mikado

    class8mikado Part of the furniture

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    At the point where there is no rolling stock, and therefore no work for Vac. Braked locos then things will change...
     
  13. torgormaig

    torgormaig Part of the furniture Friend

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    You say that John but I'm not sure that the Heritage Lottery funding would have sanctioned the fitting of an air brakeing capability to the loco.

    To my mind we are meant to be about the preservation not modernisation of our steam heritage. I vividely remember the contrast between the main line operational A4s (60007,60009 and 60019) and the non operational ones (60008, 60010 and 60022) when they were all together in York a decade ago. We are all used to the modern paraphernalia that clutters the cabs of current main line locos but it was really refreshing to see what the relatively clutter free cabs were like on the locos that do not currently operate. Much better to do without air brakeing if you possibly can.

    You watch - someone will be suggesting that we should try fitting ERTMS to steam locos next:eek:. So much for heritage:(.

    Peter
     
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  14. Matt37401

    Matt37401 Nat Pres stalwart

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    I thought that was happening with a certain Black 5?
     
  15. GWR4707

    GWR4707 Nat Pres stalwart

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    The funding bit on their website suggests that they have raised c.£15k to date, a tie up with WCR makes sense for all parties as you say.

    On the wider issue, one would assume that by now there have been discussions between the Bahamas group (And one would assume also NELPG who also rely on WCR for all work) and WCR as to what the future holds going forward?
     
  16. Paul42

    Paul42 Part of the furniture

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    Apparently it is not.
    Network Rail were after a Black 5 for it to be fitted to and both 44932 ( which if lineside rumours are correct, is now owned by John Bunch ) or 45231 have been mentioned as possible candidates.
     
  17. 5944

    5944 Resident of Nat Pres

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    45231 is now out of ticket I believe and heading for a seaside holiday.
     
  18. Johnb

    Johnb Nat Pres stalwart

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    I think they would have been OK if it was done in the same way as ClanLine and others, the loco and tender still have the same braking system as in BR days, what has been added is an air pump and a combined brake valve for working air braked trains. It’s all reversible. The locos that have been vandalised are Scotsman and the Duchess that have been converted to air braking.
     
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  19. William Fletcher

    William Fletcher Member

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    Vandalised is a bit of a strong word wodlnt you say? Adapted, possiblty ;)
     
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  20. acorb

    acorb Part of the furniture

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    Well unfortunately it's that attitude that will bring an end to mainline steam. If you want to see steam working on the mainline then we must accept it remains a working asset that must adapt to the the environment in which it is being put to work. That occurred to all locomotives from year of manufacture to the end of BR steam - what we have now is a continuation of that time. If you want a loco to remain circa 1968 we have Heritage Railways and museums, but locomotives registered to run on the mainline must adapt to the 21st century and FIT IN. To me that entails air braking, all the safety mod cons and in time ERTMS. This maximises the stock they can pull, keeps locos compliant and retains access to the core routes as the railway changes and modernises.
    If people aren't willing to accept that then we might as well throw in the towel now.
     

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