The White rose 12th November 2011 by RTC

Any interest in this tour, it has disappeared from RTC's website, any Idea why?.

according to uksteam site its still on with 60019/4492, has been postponed a few times I believe, or am I missing something... apart from a brain...

 

Showing as cancelled on uksteam now

 

Have just received an e-mail to say that this has been cancelled.
To add to the woes of those wanting to sample steam on the ECML I am told there is still doubt over 60163's booked run Thursday 24th November and the Tynesider on Saturday 26th now has diesel haulage booked for the northbound return working.

 

Travelling on the ECML at WEEKENDS at the moment is a challenge due to diversions re engineering works, I wonder if this has caused the problem?

 

Agreed but as these works were planned months in advance, why did NR agree to the tours running in the first place?

 

I think your use of the plural "tours" could be premature at this stage.
If you really need to know the answer to your question you had better ask NR as only they will know the answer!.

 

At what point in the planning process could it be said Network Rail have "agreed" to a tour running?

I think we have been through this before but I believe the Operator will submit a bid which clearly they believe is possible. Network Rail do detailed timings nearer the event. This is when problems can start and it becomes "chicken and egg". Do you advertise a tour without final timing (clearly yes, you have to) and do NwR do detailed timings early for a tour that may gain insufficient bookings to run. A single tour running with few enough passengers could probably bankupt a promotor (and I suspect there have been instances of an operator sharing the hit to avoid this happening more often than it has), so cancellation may have to be the only option. NwR could also find they have to change previous issued timings if agreed too early due to late engineering work etc.

I don't think there is a right or easy answer but it is probably true to say a promotor has to advertise a tour before they know the timings otherwise they have little chance of selling sufficient seats for the train to run - remember, their profit comes from the sale of the last coach load of tickets.

Steven

 

Are planned Engineering Works not listed somewhere for a Tour Operator to see and take into account when drawing up the spec for a Railtour ?.

 

Sounds to me like steam is just not welcome on the ECML at any time at the moment, even if the official ban is only from Mon-Fri. Or am I being unduly pessimistic?

 

This train on 12/11 was a re-date of a train from September, postponed as result of 4492's non-availability. It was known that part of ECML is blocked on Saturday and that there were diversions were in place but what was not entirely clear was the extent the diversions or, indeed, that morning 'extras' are being run, to clear any back-log of East Coast passengers; it was these that finally meant no meaningful path was available for a steam charter.

RTC have now replaced their northbound 'Tynesider' (as there is now no purpose to return 60007 to the north-east) on 17/12 with a KX - York and return, with 4492 both ways.