Midland Compound

Can anyone recommend the best book to get on the Midland Compounds not just pics but the developments ie rebuilds etc.eace:

 

The main options are Nock and Tee, although I cannot comment on their respective qualities. Might be worth having a lookout for works on the main designers too (Johnson, Deeley, Fowler etc.)

 

Wild Swan have just brought out a book on Midland Compounds, lots of technical details.

 

The "Nock" book (David & Charles 1964) runs to some 160 pages, the "Tee" book, if we are talking about the RCTS publication of 1962, only runs to 24 pages.

 

Thank you chaps will check them out 15d as it was had a few compounds I love em have just purchased a pic of one that was at this shed and it appears to have brakes on the bogie wheels would have thought this a bit iffy so would like to know more about it as my books dont mention it at all

 

Hi,

Im sure you will find some info on the brake issue, a few locos over the years have tried this.

If I remember rightly were the crabs fitted with these? I think the main issue as you might expect!

Although I ould imagine it was like the bogie boosters fitted to some locos in that it was an added mainteance feature that just wasn't necceasry in every day service and as with other features on the compund locos, it was another feature that the crews didnt understand.

I believe the locos oly went into compound mode when you opened the regulator into 2nd valve so if you had a heavy train the setting with the biggest power was full pilot valve. A lot of the drivers couldnt understand this and went into 2nd vlave (as you normally would) but this only slowed the loco down as it was trying to compound when it either was just moving or not fast enough etc.

Cheers,

Smiler

 

IIRC bogie brakes were believed to be the "dog's danglies" - the theory was good, but in practice problems were found which outweighed any possible benefits, so they were removed. I'm not home at present to check, but I'm certain this is mentioned in several books on Midland locomotives.

 

I bow to you knowledge .what great site this is found many answers to my questions thanks folks

 

Just on a historical note, I believe that Tee in the RCTS publication correctly cites that 40907 was the last active compound in ordinary service. ( apart from the preserved 1000) I have seen other compounds credited with being the "last active" in other articles. 40907 worked a Sunday Sheffield-Derby local on 21st August 1960, but never returned to its home shed of Millhouses. It then made its way to Doncaster for scrapping.

40936 and 41168 were still on the books, but stored at Monument Lane shed. I recall eventually seeing 41168 at Derby works or shed sometime later, and externally at least looking in reasonable order. There was a rumour that this engine was considered as a preservation project, but alas nothing came of it.

 

Bogie and pony truck brakes were fitted to the Compounds and others, including the Crabs, as stated. Apart from maintenance issues, there was concern that the brakes stiffened up the bogie / truck's swing characteristics which could lead to derailment. Stanier had concerns in this area and ordered their removal from any loco still fitted.

Again as stated, Compounds had a complicated (but apparently fully efficient) regulator which gave simple working to the two outside low pressure cylinders only on small openings, the centre high pressure cylinder then receiving live steam to both ends. With pressure either side of the piston, this cylinder was in equilibrium so produced no work. As the regulator was opened further, live steam to the low pressure cylinders was reduced and, at full regulator, eliminated, so the engine gradually went into compound operation. On Webb and Hughes compounds, this function was controlled by the reverser: the engine worked simple at long cut-offs and compound as the wheel was wound back.

It was this mode of operation which eventually proved to be the Midland Compounds' undoing. The early LMS intended to use the Midland traffic pattern of frequent, light express trains, and so built Compounds in large numbers. But it didn't suit the Western Division train pattern, which soon had to revert to much heavier but less frequent services. Good as the Compounds undoubtedly were, they simply wasn't big enough to handle this type of load and once the Royal Scots arrived, they began to be 'cascaded' on to secondary duties, with frequent start-stops. These meant running for much of the time on only partial regulator, so the economies of compounding were lost while the higher maintenace costs of a much more complicated piece of machinery remained.

 

I recall listening to 40907 starting away from my local station on the Midland in early 1960. Starting in simple working you could hear a sharp "four beats to the revolution" exhaust, but a couple of hundred yards on the driver put the engine into compound working and the change to a much quieter six beats was quite noticeable.

During the summer of 1959, 40907 would work south on a local, usually to Derby, and then return to Sheffield piloting a Jubilee or Black 5 on a northbound express. The impression I got standing on my local station, which was on a 1-100 bank, was that the train engine was doing the work, and poor old 40907 was just "along for the ride", almost being pushed along! This piloting of Midland expresses tended to cease when "Royal Scot" class engines were drafted to the Midland, when ousted from the West Coast main line.

 

Wondering why a Midland compound would have six chuffs per revolution, as the HP cylinder does not exhaust up the chimney?

 

Agreed! What I was trying to illustrate was that you could hear the change from simple to compound by a softer note at the chimney. Got carried away with the numbers.

 

Two further books with extensive coverage of the compounds are..

An Illustrated Review of Midland Locomotives Vol Two by Essery and Jenkinson...............Wild Swan Publications in 1988

and

Midland Railway Locomotives Vol Four by Summerson...............................Irwell Press in 2005

Both recommended for a wealth of detail on the subject.

Cheers

 

Great thanks 45581 saw B&O many times wish it was still around