North Yorkshire Moors Railway General Discussion

Lack of trains and lack of facilities won't help. Miss your train and can be a two or three hour wait for the next one. Is it promoted that much these days? Dalby Forest a few miles away offers much more for people who want to walk around a forest, either doing fun touristy things or more secluded walks. There's no information about tickets on the website either - I assume if you're starting from Pickering you'll need a two-stop ticket as you're travelling beyond Levisham. That's £24.95 return for an adult. A whole day parking at Dalby Forest is 15 quid and you don't need to wee in a bush.

 

Get the trains right, and that deals with a lot of the issues. But that comes back to being able to market the railway effectively across the range of attractions

 

A very significant share of the people who are buying seats on heritage lines are 'ordinary people' (i.e. 'not us'). What do they think? I'm not sure, but I have to think that, for an ordinary person, steam trains are a big part of the picture of the UK at the start of the Industrial Revolution - when the UK had more of an impact on the rest of the world than almost any other time. That gives a steam train an extra little push, in terms of 'what shall we do today'.

Noel

 

This conversation about steam vs diesel has reminded me of two things (not particularly linked or related to each other):

On that NYMR TV programme a fair while back, one of the episodes (or it might even be in the intro) has a section of Pickering booking office. The passenger first asked what time the next train to Whitby was, and then the second question was whether it was steam hauled. The fact that was included tells me it's probably a regular question.

At my line yesterday a couple arrived in the booking office. They were unsure whether to travel or just have a look around. One of the first questions was whether steam or diesel was running today. When my colleague told them steam, if I recall they either did or were very close to purchasing travel tickets. The traction was clearly one of their main priorities visiting the railway.

A third thought - when passengers, often but not always families, arrive at a heritage railway, many will head straight to take a photo with the steam engine at the front of the train.

 

Steam sells. It's a vital USP of the NYMR.
I've seen people turn away when they find out it's not Steam haulage.
The present timetable is littered with Ds and ds, how does that look?

The diesels themselves are class 37s and a 47, two in BR blue and one a late sectorisation freight livery. These types are seen about in use on the mainline regularly. If they were in heritage liveries of the 60s it may be more in keeping with the general feel of stepping into the past.
I feel the management are not on top of things.
The lack of an afternoon trip from Pickering due to closing off the Pullman limits flexibility for those wanting a shorter visit. This week I saw a 37 haul the 1235 from Whitby and the onward journey from Grosmont was a 47. No steam for those ticket holders.

A chance to run a shortened railway 'like the old days' and use plenty of steam was squandered in March to May. The failure to repair the loop at Goathland came back to bite them hard. Whoever planned the Thomas event in the Spring Bank week should be shown the door.
I can only conclude it needs better, more pro-active, experienced RAILWAY management.

 

37's and 47's may still be on use on the mainline but unless you are in "charter country" I suspect very few ever see one.
60's livery I suspect would not appeal to a lot of diesel fans, so if you also want to tap that market the two do not sit together that well.
Steam is likely to be more attractive but with rising heat generally likely to be making less of an appearance in a national park area. It will be very interesting to see if 2253 is regarded by the public as a steam loco, i.e. powered by coal or something "fake"

 

Not being funny but is it? I feel like steam has been on a knife edge since whenever they first set fire to a National Park. Steam on preserved railways has been the default expectation since the start but isn't always practical. But how you explain that to the public is how to win hearts and minds.

 

The NYMR is on a knife edge with regard to motive power at the moment. I'm told that 37688 has failed and it looks like 44806 is, apparently, the sole 'Whitby' loco and will have to shuttle back and forth between Grosmont and Whitby. That seemingly leaves just 37264 and 47077. Not sure what is up with 37688 but hope it's a quick repair as 44806 will be due a washout imminently. 92134 is under repair due to a leaking rivet in the smokebox that has required the smokebox effectivelty stripping out to access it. Not sure whats up with 45428 but I've seen a comment elsewhere as 'awaiting spares.' 2253 can't enter service soon enough but there's virtually no one passed to crew it.
I really feel for those doing their absolute best to keep the trains running in the present circumstances.

 

What would happen if 44806 were to fail in section on the Esk Valley? Quickly overhaul and return 76079? All joking aside that would be very bad, and would probably need a rescue loco from the likes of WCR? I suppose in most cases a failed loco would be able to limp on to the next station.

 

https://www.nymr.co.uk/media/lzrdapch/loco-11072026.pdf

31466 comes out to play today. As reported 44806 on Whitby 'shuttles' and 37264 and 47077 on Pickering runs.

 

That roster shows 37688 as being out on internal services, as well. If it has failed, is it just something to do with the equipment required for EVL service, not sure why 31466 has also been pressed into service. That makes four diesel’s and one steam. I wonder if there is an error on the roster and the services shown as being hauled by 37688 should in actual fact be 31466?

 

And 37688 doing a round trip. 4 diesels, 1 steam.

 

TPWS fault? Not sure about your last point - the roster is showing 37688 and 31466 working consecutive departures from Pickering in the afternoon. Odd that 47077 is only rostered for first and last trips.

 

The diagrams show 37688 as being out but the list of locos doesn’t. There’s an error somewhere. Mind you, it’s not unusual with the daily running sheet, which is often a cut and paste job.

 

Looking at it, the working allocated to 37688 could be covered by 47077, so that's probably where the mistake has been made.

 

Interesting responses to my post about diesel not being the same turn off that it was. It seems to have sparked some debate. My observation though was rooted in watching the daily ticket sales of a railway and access to 20 years of detailed records. The lack of steam is not as big a disincentive as it was.

There is no question though that customer experience must be well managed, communicated well and priced appropriately regardless of what the haulage is. I lack enough data to form a proper view about the ailments of the Moors, but i am suspicious that the comms may not be right, solely from the number of missteps I have witnessed as a passive observer. I think the inconsistency of pricing recently is not ideal either. Many holiday year on year in the same place. A holiday line that varies the price structure so often risks alienating potential customers over time.