V2 4771 Green Arrow to return?

Get that streamlined duchess on the ecml they always said that might of done it on the right side of the country

 

I agree that there is absolutely no chance of seeing Mallard run close to 100mph in the future. But as a restoration candidate for more modest mainline and heritage line running, I can see a considerable opportunity in having the loco operational in 2038 - if the vision is there.

Tom

 

I’m sure if you paid the NRM a couple of million quid they would consider it. The WCML is more appropriate for a Duchess

 

Well it had a pretty good go in its last ticket did it not..

 

And when the Americans take the record Mallard becomes the ex World Record Holder. Not so precious and valuable then.

 

That's a big assumption.

 

No one will care about a new speed record, any more than they’d care about a formula 1 car made of Bakelite. It’s an arms race no one is competing in, a curiosity and little more. Mallard is an emblem of much more than a number.

Simon

 

Assumption? No, that is the aim and intention. And the progress towards the outcome continues apace. You can hope that the established railway history narrative remains intact. It won’t. Records are not established on a basis of being unchallengeable. They are supposed to inspire a challenge and if anyone sits on a record imagining that no challenge will come then disappointment will eventually rear its head.

 

Without wishing to divert another bl**dy thread into records, my namesake's record* didn't save it from the cutter's torch

As for the T-1, have the Yanks even got a bit of track suitable for those speeds? Americans really hate not being first, don't they?

On a personal note, I'm very fond of 4771/60800, having seen it operational in both those guises but maybe it's better off on display.

*125mph down Stoke Bank, whilst regularly exceeding 110mph elsewhere.

 

And the reality is that Mallard’s status will remain pretty unchallenged because of the gulf between 1938 and today. In just the same way that other previous record holders status remains unchallenged, despite subsequent advances - Bluebird being a prime example.

 

You said “when”.

That is an assumption that; the loco will be finished, work as designed, that a suitable length of track exists and is made available and that the loco actually reaches its designed top speed. That’s a lot of assumptions.

Aim and intention doesn’t mean that it will happen.

I made no comment on the ambition or that the record should not be challenged.

 

Even if the T1 successfully broke the record, for 99.9% of the world it will all be a bit "meh". A bit like the efforts people spend with old Grumman Bearcats and Sea Furies, going to Reno to try and become the fastest ever piston-engined aeroplane. For anyone in that niche area, it's interesting and undoubtedly requires great engineering and significant pilot skill. But for the general public - what's the point? You've proven there is another few percent to be squeezed out of yesterday's technology under very bespoke conditions, while for $100 you can catch any old jet airliner and travel faster, in more comfort, with hundreds of other people.

What Mallard achieved in 1938 was really significant to the general public, because it showed the limits of capabilities of what was the current technology. You could catch an A4 out of Kings Cross any day and know that one of its sisters had run a two miles at minute. But anyone breaking the record now with a technology that hasn't been in everyday use for over 60 years - what does it demonstrate when there are electric trains going twice as fast carrying hundreds of passengers in everyday service elsewhere around the world?

Tom

 

Are you serious? This is the same country that is pretty much the derailment capital of the world, a place where the average MOP has little or no concept of the stopping distance of a train when crossing the tracks ….
Never mind the loco, they’d have to relay and upgrade miles of track and probably fence it in too. Insurance companies would run a mile.

 

Speed records are out of fashion.
The fact that the current Land Speed Record, held by Thrust SSC, hasn’t been broken since 1997 suggests two things:
1. If somebody was interested in funding a serious challenge the record is there for the taking given the technological advances in the last 28 years.
2. But nobody has been interested in funding a serious challenge in the last 28 years.

Similarly, railway operators and locomotive builders have never been particularly interested in chasing top-speed records, only taking them when there was an easy opportunity to do so - like Mallard’s braking trials.

Imagine if BR, in the 50s, ‘d been more committed to the Duke Gloucester design or even something better and given the opportunity to prove something.

Pointless to do it now.

 

Surely it’s the American psyche of not wanting to come second that’s driving this. They just can’t accept that sometimes others beat them to it, go faster, higher or longer than them. Reminds me the visit to the science museum many years ago. There was a guy in a 10 gallon hat taking his son round the aviation section and there was a display on the jet engine. Said American in his Texan drawl told his son not to believe everything he read in museums as “we Americans were the first people to build a jet engine and fly it”.

 

Similarly, many British retain post-imperial delusions. Americans are on the same journey and will soon arrive.

"My name is Ozymandias, king of kings:
Look on my works, ye Mighty, and despair!"

 

Of course it is.

"Nobody remembers who came second."

 

Regarding the "attempt" this is the correct answer, the only places that can support high speed running are Washington to Boston, and imagine the disruption is something did go wrong, and the coverage.

To raise funds it is a fanciful notion, i am sure our friends over the pond would love it to happen, but really dont expect it to happen.

If they get to 100mph, that would suffice, have already read that hammer blow, is sufficent to prevent it from being attempted.

Regarding the stories that a T1 has done it before, no real proof is available, its all heresay...

 

Regarding the T1 group’s ambitions to set a new record (or, according to them, just a properly documented repeat one) - and does this need another thread? …

Seems a good point about no suitable and available track of high enough quality being available in the US. And too expensive to build a new line for the purpose - there might be suitable empty deserts and salt-lakes available, but the record venue presumably would need to be nearly dead-flat and straight for 50 miles or so. However, the group might be thinking of hiring time on some existing high speed track elsewhere. Oh wait, they don’t like France - or Europe. China??

Oh, wait, we forgot about HS2; whose builders will in 10 years or so be desperate to get some publicity during the testing and proving phase before the damn thing opens. Apply now for your T1-hauled tickets on the record breaker to Birmingham. Remember, you read it on here first!