North Yorkshire Moors Railway General Discussion

To operate the planned T/T they need one steam and one diesel to run to Whitby. I think Pebbles is the only one they have to fill the diesely bit.

 

With Whitby stalwart Sybilla stopped since 2024 from memory, has anything happened to get it back in traffic yet, hopefully now inside, but I imagine it isn't which is criminal if it goes the same way as the 24.

 

Another problem they have is that people help the railway during the operating season and often take time off in lieu and save this up until the winter when there is not the operational urgency. However, this affects numbers during the closedown period and reduces the numbers available to dd othe work. I've long thought that the idea of stripping all the locos down over the winter is the wrong approach, especially when they (usually) give them a P & V exam despite not having achieved a reasonable mileage. The excuse is that they don't want to do it during the season when they need them operational. However, this means that they get done far more frequently than necessary. Last year,according to Moors Line, 5428 did 5,312 miles, 44806 did 3,660 miles and 926 did 3,405 miles. Hardly excessive mileage.

 

That's a good point. Though they're not completely closed for that long, with Santas and Winter Whitby Warmers or whatever they called them. Though that should really only take up a couple of locos, allowing nearly 5 months for all other maintenance to be undertaken. But it always feels like everything is left to the last minute. Now they've got a month to go and three locos to reassemble.

 

Is there someone on the railway who has responsibility for planning which locos get which work done on them when, or is it all haphazard?

 

I would imagine that it used to be Piglet but now he's been promoted to Director of Engineering it is probably Nick Simpson, as the Mechanical Engineering Manager. I have great respect for both, but I think we should bear in mind that both started out as apprentices at Grosmont Shed and presumably absorbed the practices they grew up with, and have never experienced anything different. For those with long enough memories, when Maurice Burns (who was a professional engineer) was NELPG CME, everything was meticulously planned and plotted out - and work was generally completed at the allotted time, however tight the schedule. There is now a Project Planning Manager at Grosmont, but it remains to be seen how much difference he is making, to this outsider at least. This winter is perhaps his first chance to make a difference.

 

No but they aren't exactly "motorway driving" as a classified for a Mondeo would say. But the NYMR has a tendancy to run their locos quite. And I'm never sure if its just the line is that tough on locomotives or if they're being driven like a Nova down a country lane (to stick with a metaphor). Haven't heard about 47077 in a hot minute but with a month left till opening day, its a poor look.

 

Even if you went in with a clear plan, it sounds like it could take a while to feed through. For example, if (as it sounds) all the locos have boiler tickets aligned to fall over the closed winter maintenance period, then it is not easy to suddenly spread them out so they fall at intervals through the year - unless you choose to re-certify some at artificially short intervals to reset the point in the year that they need to be withdrawn. At the very least, moving to a situation in which all your maintenance is done in one period to one where locos are withdrawn for maintenance at intervals is likely a plan that would take several years to see through (and that is before you account for the law of sod).

It definitely feels like an odd way to run things. I guess the rationale is to ensure you have maximum availability during the peak summer months, but if you withdraw everything all at once for maintenance in the low season, you are on a bit of a tightrope between "maximum availability" and "no availability". Staging things more evenly does mean that there is never a time when you have all your fleet available at once, but there is also never a point when you have "none of your fleet available". It sounds like they are trying to go too lean on the question of "how many locos do we need to run the service?" Getting that number down is a way to cut costs, but gives you a very sharp cliff edge at the "we've cut too far" point. But if I'm right, it's not a situation that you can just easily recover from in one season; it would take several years and a fair amount of resource.

Tom

 

How many miles in total, and how many steam miles did you do last year? With how many locos?

If you are routinely giving every loco a P&V after only a few thousand miles, then that sounds very wasteful - or else someone is forgetting to fill up the lubricator each morning I think we generally reckon on about 20-25k miles, so each loco would typically have either one or two intermediate P&V exams within each boiler ticket. Obviously based on monitoring condition and what is reported on drivers' tickets etc.

Tom

 

Who is Pebbles?

 

37688

 

37688 "Great Rocks"

 

Isn't the real problem that if one trims the loco fleet too close to the 'how many locos do we need to run the service?' edge, if there is a (necessarily unexpected) failure, one is totally hosed? Many failures (e.g. boiler tube goes bad) aren't exactly overnight fixes.

Noel

 

Last year was as below:

Steam - 20,916 miles - split between a total of 14 locos, though with only five of those over 1k each. They were:
926 - 3,405
44806 - 3,660
63395 - 1,640
45428 - 5,312
80136 - 2,598

But last year had a steam ban for quite a while resulting in total diesel mileage of 26,474 miles.

The year before is probably a better comparison for the steam vs diesel comparison but it had higher overall mileage due to more running days and a more demanding timetable. That year they had total steam mileage of 44,410, again mainly five engines as below
44806 - 9,040
5428 - 12,655
2932 - 4,427
80136 - 8,510
92134 - 6,976

Diesels were 15,972

All figures taken from Moors line issues 225 and 229. Its quite an eye opener of how many trains they dropped last season through the calendar and timetable changes. From 60,382 miles in 2024 to 47,390 miles in 2025.

 

Is there any record of the mileage covered by the o8's at Pickering C+W and Newbridge PW?

 

47077 has a failed Triple Pump Motor (Water, Oil Priming, Fuel Transfer). A spare is being overhauled at an external location and will be sent to Grosmont for fitting as soon as it is ready.

 

Reading the new 2026 timetable, there seems to be few options for the standard traveller on Sundays. Unless you are travelling to Whitby and back, stop offs at other stations seem tricky.

I'll definitely be visiting of course, but careful planning needed to avoid leaving yourselves stranded for hours.

My overall view in 2026 is the railway seems focused on dining and Whitby trains. Special events and anything different (compare it to say GCR or Severn Valley) seems a low priority. But whatever pays the bills!

 

The problem is that in recent years these have not paid the bills - at least in full. It's also interesting to note that even with that lack of success, staff numbers have not declined particularly. That doesn't suggest to me a management that is capable of facing up to reality - they're more like human tortoises, retreating into their shells when things start to get difficult, reaching out only to hold out the begging bowls.

 

I'm not sure if this was there previously but I noticed today that the school holiday dates that will get the reduced ticket prices have been published (as below)

• 28 Mar to 12 Apr
• 23 May to 31 May
• 18 Jul to 6 Sep
• 24 Oct to 1 Nov

I doubt it covers all of the variations, particularly where some schools like my girls primary have gone rogue to try and give parents the chance to avoid higher travel costs, but at least they have been put them out in advance so you can plan accordingly.

I also noticed this:

'Shorter journey tickets and refreshed Membership options are on their way. From the beginning of April, we’ll be introducing a brand new Membership in place of the Travel Pass. We’re also preparing a special Membership offer for our closest neighbours, with full details coming very soon.'

I'm genuinely intrigued as to what they are doing here. I've long said they need to work better with the local community and push membership more. Hopefully this will mean they are stepping on in the right direction. Fingers crossed!

 

Hmm, maybe it's just me but it seems odd to be advertising discount tickets during school holidays. Times of the year where there are generally a good number of passengers.
Discount tickets in the shoulder months ("off peak") sound reasonable to drum up patronage.

Possibly some form of local residents pass. Has the NYMR ever had such?