North Norfolk Railway General Discussion

The Carriage & Wagon Blog has been updated:

C&W News - December

 

The GNR 6 Wheel Third is a thing of beauty (although I have always been a total sucker for clear finishes on hard-woods, which allow on to see the natural grain)! I almost wish it could go into a museum in this state, so it could reside next to other treasures.

One quick query, if I may: I see this project was rated as a "BRONZE" - I must not understand the rating system; why only "BRONZE"?

Noel

 

Latest Joint Line mentions that negotiations are ongoing to keep 4277 on the line for the 2026 season. Hope these are a success

 

Bronze/Silver/Gold refers to the severity and scale of the overhaul work being carried out, rather than the current condition of the vehicle. This means unrestored wrecks or very worn out stalwarts would be the typical recipients of Gold overhauls - which last years. Conversely, vehicles such as the teak Great Northern 129 are only in for a quick Bronze just to keep up with re-varnishing etc and maintain their good condition. 129's Gold overhaul was completed back in circa 2008. Hope this makes sense, happy to answer any questions!

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So it’s looking like the steam fleet for 2026 will be

80080
90775 (Boiler ticket expires in Autumn I believe)
1744 (hopefully)
4277 (hopefully)
Newstead
No 22

Joint Line also mentions the hoped for return of the B12 and Ring Haw in 2027.

 

And Wissington

 

Ah, thanks for enlightening me! I hadn't realized it had already been restored, so this was basically just the normal maintenance needed by something wooden outside!

Noel

 

The Carriage & Wagon Blog looks back on the year behind us:

C&W News - Review of the Year 2025

 

Will the railway be running March weekends ?

 

There will be public trains on March Sundays

 

Thank you

 

When is the J15 / Y14 expected to return, does that imply 2028 if not next year?

 

The Y14 will not be started until the N2 is returned to traffic later this year. This is to avoid having too many engines in pieces at once.

As for when it will be finished, my personal opinion is not to listen hard to anything anyone says . There's quite a lot going on with the B12 and Ring Haw so the Y14 will probably need to get a considerable way into the overhaul before an accurate return date can be seriously suggested.

I think once the N2 is finished it will logically be the B12 and Ring Haw on the horizon when it comes to expecting what's next.

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Was under the impression that it was ‘hoped’ to have the B12 and Ring Haw back in service for 2027. I think most people understand that with steam locomotives to expect the unexpected during overhauls.

I’m hoping for the return of 76084, but realise that could be a very long way off. Black Prince even more so…

 

Has there ever been any discussions in the past about returning the T26 to steam? It seems like a locomotive that would suit the NNR, not only from a prototypical standpoint but also from a small and relatively cheap to run point of view. I know it's part of the national collection, and at Bressingham. I just wondered if this has ever been considered. What with it being one of the very few GER locomotives in existence.

 

Not sure about the E4, but heard rumours there had been enquiries about restoring the J17, that were met with a firm no. Would the E4 be strong enough for the NNR’s regular 5 coaches and a van trains? Think the E4 is only a class 1 or 2 power wise. (Think the J17 is class 4?)

 

I dont know for certain, but if Ring Haw is powerful enough then I would think the E4 would be. Back in the day when the B12 was in Germany the first time, and the J15 was sat unrestored Ring Haw was the saviour of the line, along with the odd austerity saddle tank or industrial locomotive such as Harlaxton. And they coped just fine. Looking at the technical specs the E4/T26 is a 2-4-0 version of the J15/Y14. Same cylinder size, similar stroke, bigger driving wheels at ~5ft rather than ~4ft.

 

Didn't they limit the Y14/J15 to 4 coaches plus van after the last overhaul, recgnising that, although she could do 5+ it meant working her destructively hard? The figures on Wikipedia suggest the E4 has slightly less tractive effort than the J15, which presumably coupled with the bigger wheels would mean shifting the load up Kelling bank would be more difficult (hands up I don't know how tractive effort is calculated and those bigger wheels may be the cause of the difference in tractive effort or may be an additional handicap). All that said I'd love love love to see her in steam, even more than the 2 GER 0-6-0s. If not at the NNR then at the MNR which is flatter, preferable with BTK295 behind her (ok tht would need to be on the NNR then)

 

With loading I guess it comes down to what is possible vs what is practical vs what is sensible. I haven't been to the NNR in some time, despite living not that far away real life has intervened and taken me away from steam enthusiasm for the last few years. So Im not sure whether she has been limited in some way. I do seem to remember when the Y14 came back last time there was talk that the valve in the steam chest was machined down as close as could be to tollerance and next time would require a new casting. Which would be this next coming overhaul. I would've thought that in terms of overall cost a small engine working hard would be more efficient than running a 9F or the WD 2-10-0. Even if a few more bits need replacing at overhaul. I haven't looked at locomotive prices lately but a boiler overhaul on a 9F must be close to the purchase price of a whole J94 for example.
I wouldn't see the NNR as a particularly destructive line to run a locomotive on, even with Kelling Heath bank. And with speeds on almost all preserved lines topping out at 25mph (am I right in thinking parts of the GCR allow 40mph?) is it really that taxing?
The MNR is significantly longer, especially once they get to North Elmham / County School. But compared to somewhere like the NYMR with Grosmont bank, the NNR seems like a breeze.

I look forward to the upcoming posts telling me why I am wrong.

 

Those larger driving wheels are prime in the matter. All else being equal, the bigger the wheels the less tractive effort and the less load that can be dragged around. Going from 4 foot to 5 foot is a 20% reduction. Simplistically, if the J15 can manage 5 coaches then the E4 can manage 4 coaches. The advantage the E4 has is that it can go faster but that’s not much benefit on a 25mph limited line.