1940's events in 2022 - yes or no

I was thinking something along the same lines, I can watch and hear The Victory Show going on from my back garden, while I can find it hard to imagine at the moment there would be too much appetite for the reenactments at the moment I think the question of 'in the future should we gather all this old military equipment together and show it off in a field?' is a more difficult one. On one hand you could argue that we're glorifying machines made to ease the process of killing, on the other I might argue that as the living memories of the events and the physical connection through people slowly starts to disappear, the machinery lives on as a tenable link to the past. At one point, along with the people doing the driving and the fighting, those machines were all that stood between the world being a very different place than it is today. In the right setting, there's still something quite provoking about seeing, hearing and smelling the machinery working.

I'm definitely against wartime events this year, but I have enjoyed them in the past. The discussion currently going on has certainly made me reconsider my feelings about them generally.

 

I'd guess the difference is most steam rallies aren't claiming to be 're-enacting' anything (specific arena events/displays staged by re-enactment groups at the event aside), they are putting on a show of historic vehicles, some of which are ex-military - there are traction engines, road locomotives and steam rollers that saw service working for the MOD as well, either directly for the army or requisitioned for airfield construction duties.

I do accept that out of the average rally field it will tend to be the 'military section' that are seen dressed in army combat trousers and more military orientated attire, than the owner of a fire engine wearing fire service inspired clothing - but then it's not unusual to see visitors in combat trousers either. Even then, you don't (in my experience) get anyone pretending they're in the 40's/50's/60's and there's a war on that they're a part of. The only event I've attended with military tracked vehicles ripping up the turf to bounce over cars has been Welland, and the context presented is of light hearted entertainment resulting in a flat banger, not tiananmen square re-enactment. "Monster Trucks" perform much the same spectacle at some events as well, and indeed locally to me there was an event that would regularly start the parade of steam vehicles with one running over an old push bike in scenes reminiscent of the "Iron Maiden" film.

 

Probably not quite so funny after that clip from Kyiv – whatever the facts of that incident*, it's the imagery that likely sticks with people.

Simon

*I understand that despite reports, it's unlikely to have been a Russian tank responsible for driving over a car.

 

At least at Welland, the activity is accompanied by a continuous commentary that again makes it quite clear the context is jovial towards the 'scally-wag' car driver who if they don't ammend their ways will find their vehicle coming off worse. Those 'ways' often involve the car spending the best part of five minutes or more continuously being driven straight into the side and rear of the tank at reasonable speed with increasing amounts of bumpers and body panels falling off in the process. Clearly the ultimate action if the car hasn't already conked out by trying to T-Bone a tank, is that it gets parked up with the driver exiting and removing their helmet and neck brace whilst the tank then drives over the top a couple of times. On occasions this can be followed by a Bedford self-propelled mobile pump entering to squirt a bit of water at the remains (the origins of which were civil defence for the Auxillary Fire Service, not military), but there have been occasions where a Fowler B6 road locomotive would enter to lift the remains into the air and then drive out with them swinging gently in the breeze as well.

Context is everything, and atrocities carryed out with tanks/armoured vehicles against civilians (including not stopping to give way to them) is not a new phenomenem, as I alluded to in my earlier post. The steam rally arena activities I have seen make no attempt to claim it is educational, nor that they are "re-enacting so we don't forget". It's simply people having fun with their toys, which when they are big and heavy includes squashin' stuff - the fact they are ex-military is rather incidental to what they're doing. Owners of steam rollers on occasion get asked to drive over the top of things as well, be that push bikes, oil drums ....or sometimes people - a friend at one event was tasked to drive at speed across the arena towards an escape artist who was chained inside a sack (and no, he didn't drive over him).

 

If we are going to have 'war' weekends, let's do it properly. Scrap most of the running timetable and run a single extremely long train that is absolutely rammed full of passengers. The journey should take three times longer than normal and the windows should be blacked out. Locomotives, rolling stock and P Way should only appear in a run down state. There could be a second train full of children with luggage labels displaying their names and then processed in a line in front of potential grown-up hosts. Catering outlets where open will only provide rationed sized portions. Goods trains will take priority. Anyone taking photographs of the railway will be dealt with accordingly. Stop and search will be operation and all passengers must prove their identity. You could even operate an ambulance train (as the KESR did this once) and disgorge seriously injured soldiers returning from the front. In short, to make it realistic, it should be a miserable uninviting experience that represents what really happened during WW2.

 

I've read of some heritage railway 'war' events where this type of thing would take place, and visitors could find themselves stopped and demanded to show their identification papers or be marched off around the corner!
....very much not my sort of thing, but hey-ho, I wouldn't consider attending such an event. But that's a bit besides the point, the fact they have been financially successful shows there have been plenty of people who are entertained by such stuff and will turn up for such 'theatre'.

 

I think quite a few lines are already there. Not sure ORR would accept "war contingency" as an excuse though :O

For me, merely displaying things isn't an issue. A lineup of army vehicles, with associated stuff, is interesting to see, and if a knowledgeable person dressed in a suitable period uniform/outfit is there to explain what things are, I'd call that educational. Separate from that, big machines are always fun to play with, I'm all for mucking about with tanks. I've even got time for the re-enactors who really pay attention to detail, and are respectful. Say, a group of suitably un-aged, reasonably healthy folk doing pin-perfect drill demonstrations. Obviously, actual veterans can do what they want too, they could probably still take me in a fight even if they are north of 100.

What I really hate are unshaven, unshowered, unruly mobs, who have slapped any old uniform bits together (unironed, of course), wearing senior officer ranks and para/commando berets, running round playing cowboys and indians. Or the previously mentioned "wasn't it all jolly fun?" rubbish.

Now, can anyone offer me advice on how to dress as a WW2 Conscientious Objector?

 

Here in the U.K., not something particularly badged, though you could look up WWI era prison garb if playing with generations.

Or if you wanted to put visitors off, you could always wear a striped pair of overalls with a purple triangle. Especially at an event partially set in “occupied Europe”.


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To be fair, old enough to remember post-war rationing, and having things like sweets rationed would be pretty influential on a young child. (Same age as my father, who also used to talk about the Italian POWs who worked on his parents’ farm.)


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Non Combatant Corps, basically army battledress uniform etc with NCC badges.

 

Entirely from memory, I think the Society of Friends (Quakers) had a presence at The Engine House at Highley one year on COs.

 

Having taken a bit of a break from the forum before I make actionable threats or similar, I have to say I agree. Its a very different set of folks from the ones upset about liveries and a group its easier to engage with because they're a group rather than a random set of people but its also easier to fence them off and tell them to sling their hook. It should surprise no one I'm of the belief that these events shouldn't return in peace time, originally because of my feelings about the events but the amount of toys chucked out the pram over them being suspended for a year is a truly sad state of affairs.

I suspect none of this homogenous group of howlers have read Slaughterhouse Five. Very effective anti-war writing from someone who was actually there.