Strategic Reserve

yep its amazing how the strategic reserve stories continue to circulate despite all the evidence to the contrary.

 

hello again
no way is this a wind up i have related this to many people over the years and no one can disprove it
so if you can please discuss it dont just brush it aside , what evidence have you that no steam loco reserve doesnt exist
as far as infracstucture goes remember this was the sixties when oil supplies were in doubt but we had plenty of coal

 

So has anyone got any answers regarding any remaining steam reserve locos in _Europe_, or how this batch we saw on Youtube came to be in such good condition they could be towed on the mainline?

Or is the film some kind of fake?

 

I found the video intersting because of the different attitudes compared with the UK. I didn't expect, nor want, it to rekindle the UK strategic reserve debate!
I don't think its a fake. The tracks weren't connected to the network and a piggy-back turnout had to be built. There's no indication of how long elapsed between the locos being dragged out and being hauled behind the passenger train. They could have been jacked up, bearings checked and oiled before movement. Whilst I'm certain haulage behind a passenger train would have ever happened, many early Barry locos were dragged on rail to their intended destinations after a bit of TLC. Which begs theq uestion: which was the last Barry loco to leave by rail?

 

I'm sorry but it is a wind up.

Oil supplies were not in doubt in the 1960s

Any strategic reserve would have had to number in the hundreds to be of any use and yet research has been carried out on the disposal of BR locos which actually shows remarkably small gaps in the records of locos disposed off.

The UK was quick (far quicker than much of mainland Europe) to dispose of the infrastructure needed to maintain and supply steam locomotives.

There is absolutely no photographic or other firm evidence of a strategic reserve in the past 40 years

There is no evidence of any disposal of the reserve in the past 40 years.

Need I go?

 

I don't have the exact details to hand, so the following will be slightly incorrect:

When Sweden disposed of their steam locos they kept a large amount back for a strategic reserve. I think this was in the 1950's but could have gone into the 1960's. Each loco was given a full overhaul and a protective "coating" before being placed into store, the idea being that they could be pulled out and made operational at short notice. They then started to dispose of these from the 1970's onwards. This is how locos on the NVR lmanaged to be operational within months of arriving in the UK, i.e. B class 101 (SJ 1697) arrived in the late summer of 1979 and was operational by mid December 1979.

 

Having a bit of experience in putting military vehicles into long term storage.
If time and attention to detail is taken. Then I found that a machine put into a plastic bag could be taken out 10 years later batteries refitted, check on oils etc and it would start first time. 10years could quite easily extend a lot longer. The only problem would be the constant checking of the bags for damage and maintaining the dehumidifiers.

Apply the same principle to a steam engine ( It was earlier stated a protective coating was applied) and you have the swedish example.

 

5029 & 3822 left in May 76, I believe those were the last ones to leave by rail, but don't hold me on it!

 

So whats the story with the 3 in the video? Why were they kept in store until last year when others were scrapped in the 70's??

Even though the stories of a strategic reserve are probably just myths, I find them very intriguing. Imagine stumbling accross a big overgrown shed in the middle of knowhere and breaking into find rows of dusty engines, untouched and unseen for years. Completely forgotton about. The thought of it gives me the shivers!! I'd also be claiming finders keepers!! \/

 

So whats the story with the 3 in the video? Why were they kept in store until last year when others were scrapped in the 70's??
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Sorry, I don't have the answer to that one.

 

Yep! All those class 37s, 56s, 58s and 60s currently stored by EWS.

I read the Soviets (as opposed to the Russians) allegedly kept 200 steam locos in a military depot near Murmansk. Hmmm; that far North and not in use; wouldn't the boilers freeze up in Winter?

Nearly 30 years ago Issue 4 of Steam Railway featured a two page article on the Strategic Reserve. The article stated that the story began with the rapid run down of steam when some locos featured onWithdrawn lists, but have never featured on Scrapped lists. However, these were only a few 8fs and 9fs, nowhere near enough for a reserve. Despite declaring a Strat Res of steam being improbable, the four authors of the article had the Official Secrets Act waved at them one evening (I know this as I worked on the AVR at the time with two of them) and that issue of Steam Railway was held up at the printers for two weeks for some inexplicable reason.

 

i guess they would have done , but again , wouldnt they have done in Scotland ?

Tiny warming fire over a course of a couple days , and off ya go i would have thought ?

 

its no good waving the Official Secrets Act at anyone unless they actually have signed up for it on entering Government Service.Speculating about a reserve is not a breach of the OSA

 

There is the possible excuse of Bureaucratic Incompetence ( i.e. officialdom forgot about it )

In 1983 I was with a party of 3 friends who were looking to photograph the East German 86.1001 ( a Dresden Museumslok ) which had been reported at work in the Karl Mark Stadt / Chemnitz area around the Erzgebirge Region. We had been told that, according to the diagrams, it would be at Schettau on a particular day but on arrival we found that a diesel locomotive was working the train. Once it had gone we asked about 861001 and were told that due to the high temperatures steam had been banned from working due to the fire risk in the densley wooded area.

We then asked the daft question "Wot - no steam at all ?" only to be directed to the station goods shed wherein lay a steam loco; further investigation and provision of the padlock key revealed the presence of a 2-4-0 no 24004 which belonged to Dresden Musuem. When the DB had bought sister engine 24009 from DR some years previously the high price charged was explained because 24009 was thought to be the last known example of the class in existence - yet here was another pristine example. When questionned further the Schettau station-master said that the engine had been shunted into the goods shed some 6 years previously, the doors padlocked and the keys handed to the station staff for safe keeping.

It appeared that Dresden Museum staff had been looking for this loco for some time as it appeared on their asset list but the documentation did not state where on the DR system it was actually located.

Perhaps the same problem arose with the Swedish locos and the store had simply been overlooked / ignored when the reserve was decommissioned.

 

I suspect that the MOD certainly HAD, or maybe still has some steam locos. main reason being that nuclear weapons screw up all kinds of electrical equipment; steam could have been guaranteed to work. Problem would have been the lack of infrastructure.

If there ever has been a UK Strategic Reserve, it will have been made up of unused UK military locos, ie Austerity 060, 280, 2 10 0 types. There is no sense in mothballing a loco that has been hammered into the ground by BR, such as the references to GWR types above.

 

MoD's last steam locos were given in the last 2 years to SVR, IoWR and NRM.

UK Strategic Reserve myth was comprehensively de-bunked in the Steam For Scrap books, check them out. Morbidly fascinating.

 

I suspect that the MOD certainly HAD, or maybe still has some steam locos. main reason being that nuclear weapons screw up all kinds of electrical equipment; steam could have been guaranteed to work. Problem would have been the lack of infrastructure.

If there ever has been a UK Strategic Reserve, it will have been made up of unused UK military locos, ie Austerity 060, 280, 2 10 0 types. There is no sense in mothballing a loco that has been hammered into the ground by BR, such as the references to GWR types above.

hello regards lack of infrascruture it would be quite easy to create coaling and water point any where necceasary and dont forget we run mainline steam every week of the year

 

sorry i dont care what anyone says - after visiting fenny compton and seeing some of the stuff stored there outside (apt , third rail liverpool underground stock etc ) let alone whats under ground plus the the knowing winks and nods we got when mentioning steam theres got to be something in it i would rather go by my own instincts then whats in any book

 

As you're convinced this strategic reserve exists, I'll gladly arrange you a guided tour. Just send me £10 and I'll forward the details.