Bluebell Motive Power

It is to be the principal service locomotive for this season so the IOWSR does have a use for it. The Bluebell are concocting a 2-6-2T from a B.R. 2MT 2-6-o. The present situation may speed this up.

PH (expressinging purely his own views!)

 

Hi Paul,

I might cheekily suggest that the IOWSR Ivatt goes against the anti-big engine policy you favour, at least for the IOWSR!

By the time the 2 train peak service comes into effect on the IOWSR there should be 5 locos available including the Ivatt.

So if the Bluebell needed the Ivatt...

Cheers,
Julian

 

Hardly "big" is it? I have been told it is very economical which is not a surprise in view of the decent sized superheater and long travel valves. Someone I know from elsewhere who has fired both Austerities and a 2mt 2-6-0 tells me the latter is far easier to fire. No railway is likely to forgo the services of a very effective and economical machine unless a deal of cash changes hands for its hire.

The answer lies in the Bluebells own hands, finish the 2-6-2T rebuild.

PH

 

Might be useful extra income for the IOWSR, plus there is a very good relationship between the Bluebell and the IOWSR.

Cheers,
Julian

 

If the 2015 finances for the IOWSR prove similar to those for 2014 (slightly more people were carried last year) there will be a decent revenue surplus. Bluebell desperate for motive power then?

PH

 

So lots of poly pattern cylinders then? I heard the C class is having a set of cylinders made from poly patterns. Is the project 27 also using the same?

 

However good the relationship, it would still have to be paid for and thereby would represent money not being spent on restoring our own locos.

Besides, I am sure the IoWSR has no doubt worked out an operational plan for loco usage on the assumption that the Ivatt forms an integral part of that plan. There's a rather more planning involved than you seem to assume, which doesn't make a long-term loan necessarily something that can be done at the drop of a hat.

Tom

 

Project 27 is going down that route - see the discussion further up thread. There are drawings on their website. As for the C class, I don't think any decisions have been made, though presumably when new cylinders are needed, that is likely to be the route to be followed. But it could be years away yet.

Tom

 

You need to read back a page or so - tom gave an update on locos and 34059 in particular


Keith

 

And assuming of course that a superior technology hasn't been developed by then. The lost foam (poly pattern) technology is good, but not perfect, and I have a feeling we're only starting to see the beginnings of a manufacturing revolution influenced, directly and indirectly, by 3d printing type principles.

 

That does raise an interesting issue about archiving. Until fairly recently, if you had a pattern (either home produced or, if you were lucky, a cast-off from the old mainline loco works), then provided you had a pattern store that could keep the patterns dry, then you had a reasonable likelihood that the pattern would last a considerable length of time, barring a disaster such as a fire. However, increasingly "patterns" will be computer files, from which the actual working pattern is produced on an as-needed basis at the time of casting. So we are all probably going to have to get up to speed with issues of digital archiving. For example, with the new P class cylinders - if we produce some new cylinders now, it is possible we won't need to make any more for 100 years. Will the digital file have the same longevity as a wooden pattern would have done?

Tom

 

Or will we just take the old one off, put it in the cyclonucleowhatsit 3D scanning box, and then refer to the original drawings to restore the worn areas to their original dimensions?

 

That doesn't necessarily allow you to get ahead of the game though - for example, you may wish to prepare new castings for a component on an in-traffic engine so that they are ready for when it next needs an overhaul. Which might preclude putting a component in the cyclonucleowhatsit...

I guess the bottom line is that, in the grand scheme of things, heritage railways are a very small part of the engineering industry, so there will be others that have to grapple with the problem of future-proofing the intellectual value inherent in drawings and patterns, of whatever format. But as an industry, we do need to keep an eye on what constitutes reasonable practice. After all, I've got a DPhil thesis spread across about half a dozen floppy disks from only twenty years ago, and to all intents and purposes it is unreadable. Whereas the paper copy is still probably good for another few centuries...

Tom

 

Why not just pop the whole loco in on a non-running day?

 

Yes it's worn but not fragile. That would imply it's about to break and I mean something going BANG! at any time. I can assure you that I wouldn't have driven it back from North London if that were the case.
The wear extends to the eccentrics, hence the poor valve events.
The cylinders are worn to the extent of having liners fitted and false faces fitted to the valve faces. We removed and replaced the cylinders with the boiler in place. That was an interesting job.
As for standards not being as high, well thanks for the casual insult but the loco was a 'quickie' repair at overhaul and was expected to run for about five years. It has done nine.
The principle risk of a worn tyre is incorrect profile leading to a derailment.
If it is below the standard the vehicle is stopped until it is rectified. No ifs or buts.
As for cylinders 323 has a NOS set and 65's were replaced very late in its life.
263, 473, 592, 178 and 847 all have liners fitted.
There is a lot of work to be done in the future.

Russ.

 

The MHR have just restored 41312. If the last 15 years have taught me anything it's that this is essentially the reserve Bluebell engine anyway, it felt like it spent years at the line during the last ticket.

 

It ran on the Bluebell as a long-term visitor for two seasons - 2005 and 2006 - plus a short-term visit for the Branchline gala in 2003.

Tom

 

Personally I hope the Bluebell manage to keep their veteran fleet on the front line. Of course they are older, and so might need more work (time and money) but then they are unique.

 

Hi Russ,

Many thanks for the further info re the C class.

I rather got the impression (conveyed to me very clearly and forcibly by some quarters who are employed at SP works, so you will appreciate I wont quote names) that particularly the debacle over Archie's firebox when initially returned to steam and the aftermath there had been changes at quite a high level and other changes.

I am grateful to Keith for reminding me of the recent online update that Tom posted which I had and had forgotten - but it rather begs the question that at the moment the only loco likely to return to steam after repairs in the workshop is the H class. Everything else, apart from perhaps the O1 (which doesnt yet appear to have entered the works) are long term projects.

I cant see anything new (apart from the H class re-joining the roster) being added to the fleet for at least 2 years.

Cheers,
Julian

 

You are forgetting 847!!