7027

Any news on Thornbury Castle anyone?

 

Read somewhere, it's mechanical lubricator is now on 5029.

I wouldn't hold out much hope for this running anytime soon in it's current ownership.

 

Also I suppose because a relatively high number of castles are running or have been running. It's a shame. I remember seeing it sat next to 5043 and 5080 in the 80s and thinking it looked best out of the 3!

 

Personally I'd like to see her converted into a Star...we have enough Castles restored IMHO, and it's the only way we'll ever see a working Star short of a complete new build. However, given Mr. Waterman's recorded views on loco conversions I doubt it will happen!

 

I always got the impression Mr. Waterman bought 7027 to make sure she wasnt scrapped! A star would an interesting project I could Didcot doing something like that espically with the experinces they will learn overhauling the other castle

 

She came to my "home shed" at Reading during 1963 & was often on station pilot duties. In October 1963 I was fortunately lucky to have a short footplate ride on her whilst performing these duties, a big adventure for a then 14 year old!
It was withdrawn from Reading shed in December 1963.
Obviously I have a special affection for this loco & would like to see it working again.

 

Isn't a Castle a bit lavish for a station pilot ?, short of panniers were they ?

 

Hmm, so did this mean a Castle could be seen regularly running tender first on a train (well even if it was shunting an ecs ?)
Tend not to see too many pictures of big engines bearing their behinds back in their youth.

 

I think you will find that tender first working was far more common than photographic records suggest. Then, as now, photographers seem to be reluctant to photograph locos "the wrong way round". As an example I would point you to the old S&D 7Fs. Much of their lives were spent hauling North Somerset coal traffic to Bath which involved running tender first in one direction or the other. Although very frequently photographed on such duties tender first shots are decidedly rare. I'm not suggesting that tender first running was as common as it is today on heritage railways but it was far more common than surviving photographic evidence would indicate.

Anyway back to the subject.......

Peter James

 

7027 does need a white knight. Probably a miracle. When waterman purchased it there was a tacit agreement that Tyseley would part share for 5043 but in effect this meant 5043 has all the stuff that matters as there was one less set of motion than locks at Barry. A closer look will show you that much of the outside motion on the earl is actually 7027 "stamped". That being said waterman bought a tender tank for it that is at Crewe he clearly had the intention to restore her. Trouble is that with nunnery, the earl and soon clun and pendenmis running is there a need and if someone decides to fix up another one there is much less to do on 5080 or 51. You'd think its a 1-2m job to fix.

 

Does Pete Waterman have any interest in his collection of steam engines? Do any that he owns outright actually operate anymore? His commitment appears to have dissipated in the last few years.

 

This is not entirely correct and requires some enlightenment.

We sold the loco to Pete "as seen" so what he saw was what he bought. The "tacit agreement" as you call it was that we were going to restore 5043, and that when that was complete, we would make available any remaining Castle parts deemed to be surplus to requirements for Pete to purchase. That is not the same as parts sharing. With regard to "much of the outside motion" this solely extends to the coupling rods which were originally used in the overhaul and operation of 5080 back in 1987. We do have a set of the earlier pattern of Castle coupling rods and when we set about repairing 5043 these were fitted to 5080 to release the newer and somewhat larger later type rods to be used on 5043. The connecting rods on 5043 were apparently originally fitted to 5000 Launceston Castle and according to the stampings were later transferred to 5011 Tintagel Castle, otherwise the rest of the outside motion and slidebars are 5043's own.

With regard to 7027's role as the Reading station pilot you have to remember that dieselisation was tearing ahead on the WR and the management were determined to diesel haul all principal trains. The D1000's were still being delivered. They were not always reliable and were by no means guaranteed to make journey's end without assistance and in fact there had been a long tradition before the advent of diesels, of having pilot engines available which were capable of taking over any failures at short notice. It used to exist in the rather outdated belief of service to the travelling public. By the time that this task fell to 7027 it was entirely possible to find Castles and even Halls undertaking these duties, particularly in the steam heating season when regular failure of the diesels' steam heating boliers required the addition of a steam loco which was capable of running at express speeds, "inside" to keep the passengers warm. It did of course, make absolute sense to get the odd bit of shunting done by the engine and crew in between main line demands. Should it disappear off to Bristol or Padd then another would have been summoned from 81D.

Not long after the demise of steam on the Western I experienced a similar situation on a Padd to Bristol train when the 1000 began displaying signs of being unwell soon after leaving Padd and ended up being replaced by the Reading pilot, which by then was a "Warship". In the intervening 4 years since 7027 had been doing the same job, the deluge of Brush type 4's on to the Western region had ensured that a number of displaced "Warships" were now available for pilot duties and within another 4 or 5 years were being depatched to the con yard at Swindon. As an aside I think that enough time has passed to form a view that in real terms the warships were barely equal to a Castle and in reality if the Castles had been retained for another 3 or 4 years, many of the hydraulics would have been unnecessary and considerable savings would have been achieved by the eventual supply of further Brush 4's instead. Instead loads of BR's cash was squanderedsolely to apparently assuage Stanley Raymond's vanity in wanting to be the first dieselised region.

Regards
Bob

 

Back in the 60's I was working at Whitnash which is just south of Leamington, by then passenger workings were all westerns and steam was a rarity.
I heard a steam engine obviously working very hard then a Stanier 8F burst from behind the houses dragging a failed western plus it's train and really going for it on the climb to Fosse Road, the 8 was probably commandeered off the train to the cement works at Long Itchington.
Leamington shed 84D was by then closed.
It would be nice to see 7027 restored as it is unique, the only castle with a 3 row superheater.
One for Bob in your opinion do you think it would be much improvement on a standard castle?

Cheers Dave