North Yorkshire Moors Railway General Discussion

I cant see a thread based upon the North Yorkshire Moors Railway generally on the forum, or at least one thats been updated recently so I thought that I would start one based upon thsi discussion that is ongoing on the B1 61264 thread. A lot of the discussion there has focused upon the Whitby steamings, which the B1 would be part of, but also the thread is made up of postings which are both interesting and informative.

Given other updates to the railway, such as the signal gantry being installed at Grosmont, the roof at Pickering and the lines relationship with other locomotive groups, might it not be sensible for a thread to focus generally upon the railway that people would want to contribute to. It can then meander to where-ever we deem it neccesary to talk about and fortunately for us all we can all then benefit from more discussion and the information that those knowledgeable to know the relavent facts, would then contibute for us all to discuss.

 

Last information on the aforementioned B1 thread was about Whitby. I can see that the railway would need to have some engines working for the line and that they would need to have about 3 in traffic for the Whitby service to avoid engines having to be swapped. Yet, the line should be having enough to manage surely - with 76079, 44767, 61264, plus others such as Repton, S15 then the fleet should be okay. Are not Black 5s like Eric Tracey recieving equipment and Im not sure when the clank 80135 is back.

I know some have mentioned the curves on the line into Ruswarp and Whitby being an issue, but yeah the 8F ran down with speed restrictions and I would have thought that if diesel tours can go down now following the lifting of locomotive restrictions previously then engines like 60007 should be able to as well. Is it not perhaps a decision that some locomotive groups are not wanting the wear caused by running here, rather than the fact that they cant go at all?

 

45428 was passed for Whitby running last year but 44767 requires the completion of fitting TPWs equipment and a tet run, so the season will probably start with just 76079 and 45428 available, to be joined by 75029, 44767 and 61264 as the year progresses, with Ian Riley's two black 5s helping out in the first part of the year. 80135's overhaul hasn't really started yet and 34101 will be the priority once 75029 is complete. I would imagine that 34101 will be added to the Esk Valley fleet.

There must be a balance to be struck over the operational disadvantages of a loco not being able to run into Whitby and the additional cost of the wear and tear incurred in doing so.

 

Of course, it depends on the characterics of a design of loco as to how much extra wear and tear results from running on a line with sharp curves. The Grosmont to Pickering stretch has some pretty sharp curves, although the tightest have been eased slightly where possible by using both sides fo the former double track formation (as has also occurred on the Esk Valley line.

Also to be balanced is the advantage of flexibility - the more locos that can do the Whitby job or any other turn with restrictions, the easier it is to cover the unplanned. If you have too few locos either overall or for turn with specific requirements, then each time something goes wrong with the locos you have, it is all hands to the pump to fix that loco rather than steam a replacement and deal with repairs in a more ordered and planned manner. This need for "fire-fighting" does no good at all to planned maintenance and the progression of overhauls.

I'll post a separate post for other updates.

Steven

 

View attachment 2200 View attachment 2201 Update on Pickering Roof.

The steelwork is all up and work has been progressing over this week with the woodwork on top of it. Everything on schedule for hand-back just before start of daily services, with tiling being completed after this above the wood lining.

Pictures attached from Thursday.

Hence, you can still "buy a tile" as these are not yet in place.

Half term services will use the north end of the platform and the Class 101 DMU, which is now serviceable with working heaters! This service is Pickering to Goathland (to allow 3 trips).

69023 Joem and a couple of teaks will be working Grosmont to Goathland to connect.

45428 will be running in at some point in the next couple of weeks after a valve and positon exam. It will then be rubbed down for full repaint. 45428 and 76079 (loco only) will be visiting a ground lathe before the start of daily services for tyre turning.

44767 due to arrive Tuesday. Whitby equipment then to be fitted at Grosmont.

75029 coming back together for return to service within a few weeks of the start of weekly service. Assembly of the new firebox for 34101 progressing.

Steven

 

Work is looking great on that overroof.... surely means Pickering station is in line for a few awards for Engineering and local renovation. Stanhope station won a similar award when it was returned to use but I can see Pickering sweeping all before it.

With regards locomotives, its interesting to view the fleet that the NYMR has at its disposal. Have any of these engines mentioned, like 75029 been given an overhaul this winter period, or just protracted repairs. Just wondering if any NYMR engines have been overhauled in that time as it would be very impressive if they had. Im looking forward to seeing some of the Black 5s which have had protracted overhauls, Eric and George being the two in particular. While 34101 might be out of region (and not my personal choice for an engine there) many find that its been an impressive engine for the NYMR and I think owners have an affliation rather than its ownership by the NYMR - how for away is it from being finished. How many engines does the NYMR actually own itself?

 

Can someone please put up a list of the current status of NYMR locos regarding the Whitby line.

(1) Locos that are currently passed for Whitby services
(2) Locos that could run Whitby services, but lack TPWS/AWS
(3) Locos that cannot run to Whitby (eg due to weight, wheels base, axle loading, loading gauge etc)


Benny

 

Overhauls/Winter Work

45428 has had mechanical work and a valve and piston exam after nearly 9,000 miles in - nearly 1/3 of that between 1 pair of consecutive washouts!
76079 - normal winter mnechanical work, plus fabrication of new cylinder off the loco progressing well. Plan is to fit this and replacement superheater header (currently running with header on loan from 76084) during 5 year intermediate overhaul from October.
75029 was taken out of traffic in October 2009 needing foundation ring repairs. As this involved lifting the boiler, it was decided to do a "10 year" overhaul, and when the boiler was stripped, considerable extra work was found (this was the first time the boiler had been stripped in NYMR ownership). The front ring of the boiler barrel has been renewed, a section the length of the rear ring replaced, the expected repairs to the foundation ring rivits and the lower part of the outer firebox completed, new front tubeplate and outer throatplate manufacturer (in house) and fitted. Work now coming to a conclusion, so about 18 months but still very impressive for the amount of work undertaken.

Whitby/Esk Valley Status

TPWS fitted and within 7 year boiler ticket: 45428, 76079
TPWS fitted and nearing the end of overhaul: 75029
TPWS fitted but out of 7 year boiler ticket (i.e. not eligible to run on Network Rail); 825
TPWS fitting about to commence: 44767
Undergoing overhaul, expected completion 2011, to be fitted with TPWS: 61264
Awaiting overhaul, TPWS fitted: 30926
TPWS fitted but not to run to Whitby due to line curvature: 60007

With the other locos, they don't have TPWS, so are ineligible. I don't think anything is actually barred by axle-limit or loading gauge, but a number of locos would be ill-advised to be used in terms of wear and tear due to wheelbase and line curvature. Hence, unlikely to be viable to fit TPWS but that is the owners decision. With locos such as the S160, there is also the question as to just how difficult mainline registration would prove to be as first of type.

Steven

 

I know that with the demands of the NYMR is was neccesary to be 'speedy' with the overhaul on 75029 but it is a massive achievement for Grosmont MPD to get this loco out in 18 months. While I know its not quite there yet, if they get this out in time for the busy season, they should be very proud of what they've accomplished. To do a full overhaul in under 2 years on any locomotive these days is fantastic, but a Class 4 thats done the miles pulling the loads that 75029 has. Thats truly a magnificent achievement. And this is all with the extra ordinary amount of repairs needed to other engines last season. Well done!

 

It has been very remiss of me not to mention that mechanical work has also been undertaken on 75029, alongside winter work on the running locos, running repairs during the season and progress on the frames of 34101.

As you say, a pretty major achievement.

Steven

 

Re: 61264

What the side play like in 2-8-0's for sharp bends ?, 92220 has been to Whitby before but of course the flangless axle is a big help to 9F's, i'd be suprised if a small wheeled 2-8-0 was any worse for sharp bends than a six coupled loco with wheels of 6'0/6'2 diameter, sounds simply like it's type approval preventing the S160's use and something like an 8F/38XX could get away with it.

 

Re: 61264

I've a feeling, and I'm sure someone will spring to correct me if I'm wrong, that it is the concern about wear on the tender wheels of 60007 that stops it running to Whitby, rather than the loco wheels. I don't know how much side play there is on them but I'd have thought they're unlikely to have less than an 8-coupled loco.

 

A couple of other locos not were mentioned by Steven in his review - 80135 has been used on the EVL in the past but is awaiting overhaul and will require TPWS fitting, as it wasn't needed at the time it was running. Also, the owners of 92214 have said that they are interested in running on the EVL when the loco emerges from its 10 year overhaul, which is due to start in a couple of years time. There is also, of course, 62005 which is nominally based on the NYMR and does return for short periods when it is not required for West Highland trains

 

Re: 61264

The curves on the line between Ruswarp and Whitby are quite vicious, probably sharper than on any ex BR heritage line. Don't forget that the Whitby & Pickering Railway was a very early line and originally laid for horse drawn traffic where curvature was less important that gradient. I'm not sure of their actual radius but although the line speed is 25/30 mph the NYMR have a self-imposed 20 mph limit around the worst ones. You really feel the rail joints on the loco, even though Network Rail claim that they are OK. 60007 has been down the line a couple of times but the perceived opinion is 'not again' unless it runs dead slow.

 

Would the 9F be able to run on the Esk Valley I thought Network Rail imposed a ban on all locomotives with a Flangeless wheel...??

 

There is a general ban on flangeless wheels on Network Rail due to the conflict with raised checkrails. However, at the moment there are no such checkrails on the Esk Valley line (and unlikely to be) and the locos owners are hopeful that they will get as derogation to allow the locos use on the line.

 

Steve is that the same as running to Battersby as well? Would love to have the 9F on the extended service!

 

As far as I know.

 

Thanks for doing this.

We've also got our own forum elsewhere: http://nymrunofficialforum.createforumhosting.com/

 

Update from Nick Beilby, Project Manager:



1. Reinstatement of Overall Roof

The roof is schedules for substantial completion by March 26th, this is of course to enable the NYMR to commence the summer timetable. This timescale will be achieved although after this date there will be works ongoing, mainly slating and ancillary works. There has been delay to the erection of steelwork due to the incorrect paint system being applied. This has been rectified and the paintwork now meets the specification. The resultant loss of time has by and large been recovered and currently an access scaffolding is being provided which will enable works to continue and also provide safe access for our customers and staff over the half term holiday.



2. Picnic Area

The Picnic Area is currently having foundations laid for the former Church Fenton columns and the paving works should take place over the next 2-3 weeks and this will give the principle Contractor storage area for the roof slates, that is once they have been “signed” by Bryan Draper and his team. Following this the Picnic Area should be available for normal use by Easter and I am hopeful that prior to that I will have the wrought iron columns erected.

There are still plenty of Slates which can have your name on them - you can still sponsor slates after they are up but they won't carry your name!

Steven