Current and Proposed New-Builds

An absolute blind alley in the UK. If they were such a success in the RoTW, let them build one.

What could you with it, anyway? Can't see one in front of a row of Mk. 1s. Most likely end up doing brake van rides.

 

One of the hosts of Well Theres Your Problem described Crampton's as the ultimate libertarian (in the modern usage of the word) locomotive because they had a woeful haulage capacity limiting it to being little more than if a private car was a steam locomotive. Which gives me a merch idea.

 

I don't think the idea is to put twelve MkIs behind it and aim it at Shap. They were used in this country: the LNWR was only one of the railways which invested. But how many of the earliest types which have been newly built are capable of working commercially? There's a sodding great broad gauge 4-2-2 at Didcot and I think the Crampton is probably more useable than that.

 

This has the feel of an accountant's reply about it - someone who knows the price of everything..... etc. If railway preservation was conducted on that basis we'd have far less to interest us. Perhaps a great side effect would be some resored or even newly built 4W coaching stock!

 

It still requires some work on the frames/horns IIRC, which is much better carried out under cover (especially with the current weather conditions!).

 

That'll be why I intend to make a monthly donation to the GNRS/Quainton Road to restore the recently-acquired D245 coach then.

Most heritage lines are pretty homogenous anyway as unless a cottage industry sets up to build rolling chassis upon which to place all those grounded ex-GER coach bodies in East Anglia then, it'll still be Mk.1s for the future.

 

https://www.oldbookillustrations.com/illustrations/crampton-locomotive/

Suggests "A Crampton locomotive could haul 12 to 16 carriages, weighing up to 100 to 130 tons at a speed of 37 mph (60 km/h). When running on its own, it could reach 75 mph (120 km/h)."

More than just a brakevan if correct.

 

Mr Crampton's original premise, large driving wheels and low centre of gravity for high speed, was valid, but pretty well limited you to a single driving axle. Received wisdom is that singles got a new lease of life when sanders came along, but by that time presumably Cramptons had already gone out of fashion. The Stirling singles demonstrated that you can fit in really big driving wheels in front of the firebox, provided you don't need a huge boiler; and with leading bogies they presumably ran smoothly enough at high speed.

While I would love to see, and ride behind, a new-build Crampton, main line operation would seem utterly impractical, and restriction to 25 mph on heritage railways would defeat the original premise.

 

I just want to see the look on rail acceptance bloke's face when the proposal for a mainline Crampton is put to him...

 

There is a Crampton in the Cite du Train in Mulhouse:



The photo is from 1967 at Gare de l’Est. It is displayed here without its tender.

https://www.50ans-citedutrain.com/en/focus/crampton/

It was Crampton's adoption of wide steam passages, generous bearing surfaces, and large heating surfaces rather than the position of the driving axle that ensured the high-speed qualities of his locomotives.

Fire Queen of the Padarn Railway, now at the Vale of Rheidol, is a Crampton.

 

A Webb three cylinder compound 0-8-0 would be better for heritage duty and sound different

 

I think that the aim with creating locomotives such as a Crampton, is to fill the very large gap of examples of engines from the 1850 to 1900 era, there are very few to demonstrate the development of engine design for this period.

Cheerz,

Alan

 

Plenty of locos are not doing what they were originally premised to do: the replica "Locomotion" is hauling thousands of passengers a year along a demonstration line at Beamish, it isn't hauling 80 tons of coal in chaldrons down to a wharf on the River Tees.

It is also probably worth thinking about what "high speed" meant in the context of the 1840s. Somewhat higher than heritage line speed, certainly, but perhaps not a huge amount higher. It would probably have been unusual for such locos to have got much above 40 - 50 mph and yet still be considered "high speed".

From an educational point of view though, seeing such a loco might be as instructive as riding behind it. Certainly locos of that era were much more accessible in terms of seeing the cab, the controls, and how parts moved, so there would definitely be a value to watching it go past on a demonstration line as much as riding behind it.

There are other early locos and loco replicas that are viable - things like the Beamish replicas through to Furness Railway No. 20 - so I am not sure why a Crampton replica is being derided because it is unable to pull 12 coaches at mainline speed. Not all new builds have to fit that niche.

Tom

 

Not just that, but simply the awareness of how much the technology developed. Furness 20 is in some ways no different from many later locomotives, but when you see it in the flesh, you realise quite what a difference there is through the generations.

 

I was at Beamish in June and was told that Locomotion had been removed by its owners.
Ray.

 

I think Jeremy Clarkson would certainly approve "Look at the size of those rims! And that phat exhaust- now THAT is what you call a sports train"

 

Well, any of their early replicas then!

Isn't the replica Locomotion being lined up for some runs on sections of the original S&DR in September of this year? I wonder if the removal is just about renovating it and adapting it for that role? I seem to recall reading about it going off somewhere for trials of its sustained coal and water usage so that those trips could be planned in more detail with regard what was viable.

Tom

 

It does belong to an era of steam evolution where the most basic elements that carry on in mainstream thinking start to coalesce but the thought of building bigger hadn't quite been hit upon yet. A sort of Neanderthal/ Homo Sapien crossover age. S&D 1275 was still a decade away.

 

I wonder if some of the bjections to the Crampton are coming from those who don't remember them in BR green or black livery, and therefore have no interest in taking photographs of them? The average Barclay/Peckett (other models are available!) 0-4-0ST isn't much good for trundling up and down at low-sh speed hauling a light load, but they do still find their uses.

 

Just imagine ...



Give me that over a Gresley P2 any day!

Tom