7027 Thornbury Castle

Thornbury castle should have been an ideal project. A well known express type appealing to enthusiasts, but it has been the victim of a succession of wealthy one man owners.

A project like this is way too much for any individual to handle or be responsible for. There is simply too much complex difficult work with literally thousands of parts to make or overhaul, so no individual can ever hope to cope with that work load especially when it is a hobby being indulged in their spare time.

It needs a group with a large number of skilled people each working on separate components and helping each other. It is the only way projects like this can ever get done. They are group activities, just as they were when being worked on at a railway works.

You would think the GWS would be an ideal organisation to take it forward and safeguard its future like they have with Pendennis castle. Perhaps the GWS members themselves can force/demand a re think. ?

 

Until/if JJP and the 4709 group reach a deal to take the loco back then sadly these questions can't be answered. However, once the loco is in the right hands I have no doubt that most of them can be answered.

It should be noted that a lot of those questions would have been/still could be asked of the 4709 group as it would appear they felt as though they couldn't scrape the money together for their own boiler.

I don't think it's fair to say that people's passion around this issue is "hot air". This hasn't happened before (loco under restoration being sold off for parts) so it's going to cause a lot of chatter.

I'm sure all those questions can be answered once there is a bit more of a green light, as it were.

 

Somehow, I don’t think those owners have done that large a proportion of the work on their locos. And the history of 7027 demonstrates that ownership is no guide to success - whether personal, corporate or society.


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I've had similar thoughts. The GWS could see the outrage about the dismantling of 7027 as an opportunity. Offer to keep it in storage for, say 6 months, to allow fundraising efforts to be undertaken for its restoration. If someone can organise a fund of £500k within that time period, GWS will take on its restoration as a castle. (I know £500k is not enough to restore the loco, but it's enough to show willing and fund a good start while other money is raised.) After 6 months, no £500k and the loco meets the gas axe and any money donated is refunded. Nobody can complain, they've had their chance and GWS smells of roses. Who said pigs can't fly?

 

Including the boiler?

 

With Pendennis just at the start of a 10 year boiler ticket any suggestion of another Castle being put forward for restoration is very wide of the mark. All new builds have been separately financed (via restricted funds) with GWS memberships used to maintain the operational fleet and conserve the Didcot site. £500k has recently been spent on the Water Tower project. It's the 4709 group of donors who can determine what happens next.

 

Have you ever had 43106?

 

And if it hadn't been a "victim" of those owners it would presumably have gone for scrap decades ago...

 

I disagree, it's the GWS Board who need to determine what happens next. Having a fat wallet doesn't give someone the right to make major decisions outside of the proper channels. The Charity Commission may have something to say about that!

 

I think you are both right. The people providing the funding need people to lead the project and wield the spanners etc. If it is to be done under the GWS umbrella then obviously that Board need to have a major say in what happens (and how it happens).

 

Indeed, but once again, who are they, bar the Chair (also hon vice pres of GWS) and the Chief Engineer they are entirely nameless and thus appear to pretty much do as they please, neither they nor the GWS have yet stated where they suddenly found the cash to make this purchase from nor anything bar statements that can be dismantled as basically nonsense in about 30 seconds.

In so so many ways, I suspect that 7027 is probably beyond saving now as JJP has noted that neither the previous or present owners appear to have any interest in changing course, which places the ball rather firmly in the GWS's court to placate their membership and justify the scrapping of a Castle. Also be interesting to know where 7027 is now and exactly who is going to strip her, will any of the normal engineering bases want to be associated with this excrement show, hearing stories over the weekend that GWS not particularly popular as a Client with many contractors.

 

I don’t think this is doing those at the top of the GWS any favours at all, any credit in the bank with those of us who the GWS will be appealing to in the future has disappeared in the last week or so.

 

You'd be surprised. From what I've heard and without dropping anyone in the proverbial... A certain engineering base believes this will blow over and those that care should just let go. Business is business, eh?

 

They’re probably right, todays news being tomorrow’s chip wrapping and all that.

None of which should make GWS relax - this is highlighting major weaknesses in their structure which may well bite them in future.


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It depends, speaking to my old man last night, GWS member since the 70's and all he knew about this was what SR printed, so if the GWS can keep SR onside could all be fine.

 

Until it really isn’t.


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It certainly is, I've been and marvelled at it more than once, but it's this more recent craze for making lookalikes of things where they haven't got a genuine example that defeats me. By all means build new ones and if they have spare parts of the correct type use them in the build but don't adapt them to use the wrong parts and justify it by saying most people (me included) probably won't notice the difference. They've even sacrificed a genuine 2-8-0T, when there isn't one in their collection, on this particular altar.
As a young man it was always impressed on me that if a job was worth doing, it was worth doing properly and a 47xx (and/or a Star) made using the wrong bits will never be a proper job.

 

Or it might have become the darling of a preservation group, and been a star performer on the main line and heritage railways for the past 35 years. The preservation scene was finding its feet in 1972- I was in nappies at the time, so couldn't do a thing- but there's a lot of locos came out of Barry since '72 that have been restored

 

I would advocate for a Buy and own a Castle fund.
Get 1000 people to put £500 in now, then £10 a week ongoing, to buy a 1/1000th share in 7027. You get a responsibility, you get a vote, and Thornbury gets to be a locomotive again. Yes, my chequebook is ready