If you register, you can do a lot more. And become an active part of our growing community. You'll have access to hidden forums, and enjoy the ability of replying and starting conversations.

West Somerset Railway General Discussion

Discussion in 'Heritage Railways & Centres in the UK' started by gwr4090, Nov 15, 2007.

  1. Flying Phil

    Flying Phil Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2018
    Messages:
    2,696
    Likes Received:
    5,500
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Leicestershire
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    It must have been a wrench for him to leave the WSR, but it is a fantastic opportunity for him to be in at the start of the L & B's next major advancement.
     
    32110 and granmaree like this.
  2. Sidmouth

    Sidmouth Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2005
    Messages:
    9,634
    Likes Received:
    8,302
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Alderan !
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    One day whilst out on one line I was surprised to see the then GM as guard . A little while later the ops manager was signalman . Speaking with them the impression I got was management are encouraged to volunteer as well to help broaden their understanding of the day to day operation of the railway and also to encourage their visability to other volunteers
     
    jnc, Vulcan Works, 35B and 1 other person like this.
  3. Downline

    Downline New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2020
    Messages:
    137
    Likes Received:
    288
    Location:
    Somerset
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    You can't lead a business hiding behind your big fence in a town an hours drive away from the railway.

    But you can lead a business, occasionally hiding behind your big fence in a town an hours drive away from the railway, if you are regularly showing your face around the railway, getting involved with all the different departments along the line, engaging with your workforce and customers.
     
    S.A.C. Martin likes this.
  4. richards

    richards Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2008
    Messages:
    4,634
    Likes Received:
    1,921
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    London
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    It's typical of this thread that you accuse someone of being a troll simply because they dare to bring a different opinion or comment on the effectiveness of the "discussion". Your black/white thinking doesn't really give much room for anyone with alternative or middle-ground views. TTFN
     
    Mike West likes this.
  5. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    May 30, 2009
    Messages:
    21,063
    Likes Received:
    20,773
    Location:
    1016
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    When an organisation sees someone in their midst who is special and offers so much, what usually happens is that the organisation finds a way of retaining them and allowing them to develop further. Of course, people also move to other jobs for other reasons even when they have enjoyed where they were and despite incentives to remain.

    As it's been raised, what's the story here as this must be a very useful 'touchstone' for knowing how much the current management is in touch with its staff and what the organisation needs.
     
  6. Monkey Magic

    Monkey Magic Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2018
    Messages:
    3,498
    Likes Received:
    6,845
    Location:
    Here, there, everywhere
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    And posting for the umpteenth time about how people shouldn't be discussing the WSR is in no way a reflection of your own zealotry to control what people say. Nice little passive aggressive dig to slip in there.

    When a football team is doing badly or being mismanaged do you go on the discussion sites and tell them that they shouldn't talk about the manager or the board or the players? Or when there are political issues that people shouldn't talk about politics because it achieves nothing? No don't discuss climate change because it achieves nothing?

    No one forces you to read the thread, if it upsets your cosy deferential pipe and slippers worldview then don't click on the link to the discussion.

    It is a discussion forum, people talk about things. When things are going badly people have more to say. I am surprised you haven't yet worked that out.

    I couldn't agree more. Just to give an example - I was chatting to a friend of mine who works in an IT dept, not one of the sexy depts but one without which the organisation can't function. They contrasted how previous CEOs had walked around, popped in and chatted to them. This was then followed by a CEO who never visited, tried to impose ideas, wasn't interested in staff, so morale plummeted, people left etc organisation, the CEO left after causing untold damage. The new CEO restarted walking around and meeting people, lo and behold, morale improves, people are listened to and performance improves. Are there still blunders, of course there are but by listening informally and being open they are being picked up earlier before they become major issues.

    Worse though than the invisible CEO are those visits that are more like inspections than finding out what is going on. No one learns anything from those and they are just lip-service to engagement.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2021
    ghost likes this.
  7. Sidmouth

    Sidmouth Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2005
    Messages:
    9,634
    Likes Received:
    8,302
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Alderan !
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    an opinion bereft of substance despite polite requests to expand on your proposition and elaborate on what the alternative story is

    ergo since you offer nothing then in all truth your arguments become disruptive which is of course the point of a troll
     
  8. The Dainton Banker

    The Dainton Banker Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2014
    Messages:
    1,720
    Likes Received:
    3,186
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Over the hills and far away
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    There you go again! What is this different opinion you want discussed ? You've been asked three times and refuse to answer. I say "Troll".

    @Sidmouth put it better than me but I was typing at the time.
     
  9. 61624

    61624 Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2006
    Messages:
    5,294
    Likes Received:
    3,596
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Its termed mbwa - management by walking about - and works brilliantly for good managers that are prepared to listen. If they start with an unhappy organisation it might be a tough ask till things improve but if they do people should become less disenchanted. I do question, though, whether, on the evidence available to the outsider, the current chairman/acting CEO at Minehead has the personality to be successful at mbwa!
     
    Matt37401, 35B and Monkey Magic like this.
  10. martin1656

    martin1656 Nat Pres stalwart Friend

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2014
    Messages:
    17,609
    Likes Received:
    11,222
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    St Leonards
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Its a shame that , on the face of it, the WSR, is losing someone who would have be an ideal candidate for the GM role, good managers are worth their weight in gold, makes you wonder, had he, and not the present chair have been in charge, would the railway be in a better place?
     
    Dennis John Brooks likes this.
  11. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2008
    Messages:
    26,099
    Likes Received:
    57,414
    Location:
    LBSC 215
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Be careful not to confuse managers and directors, Martin - they are not the same role (and arguably suit different personality types).

    Not confined to the WSR - I think a weakness in some small organisations (and heritage railways are, in many senses, small organisations) is that directors end up being managers, i.e. get heavily involved in the day-to-day rather than concentrating on the strategic. Often for very good reasons, but it isn't ideal.

    Tom
     
    Paul42, jnc, Sunnieboy and 2 others like this.
  12. Pete Thornhill

    Pete Thornhill Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Administrator Moderator Friend

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2008
    Messages:
    7,498
    Likes Received:
    5,455
    Exactly, it’s clear @richards has a different opinion, I’m lost as to what it is as despite asking we haven’t heard what it is. With this absence it does come across as having no foundation other than to counter the debate with no actual counter argument.
     
    35B likes this.
  13. Bayard

    Bayard Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2015
    Messages:
    1,826
    Likes Received:
    3,871
    Gender:
    Male
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    May I suggest that next time you reply to one of my comments, you read more than two or three words of it first? I didn't accuse you of being a troll, in fact I said that I didn't think you were. What I did say was that, by constantly repeating the request for "another viewpoint" unchanged, no matter how many other viewpoints other posters made, you were reading like one. Sad to say, the sort of red mist, knee-jerk response you made is another troll-like characteristic. You may not intend to be a troll, but if you continue to sound like one, then the difference becomes somewhat academic.
     
  14. Robin Moira White

    Robin Moira White Resident of Nat Pres

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2014
    Messages:
    11,246
    Likes Received:
    17,946
    Gender:
    Female
    Occupation:
    Barrister
    Location:
    Stogumber
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    My view is that the role of Directors on heritage railways is twofold:

    (1) to lead the discussion which decides strategy (involving all significant stakeholders in that discussion), and then

    (2) clearing logjams out of the way which arise to prevent managers and staff (volunteer and paid) implementing that strategy.

    It’s working pretty well in Kent but as we know, the laws of physics are different in other parts of the universe.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2021
    Great Western, Romsey, Paul42 and 8 others like this.
  15. Monkey Magic

    Monkey Magic Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2018
    Messages:
    3,498
    Likes Received:
    6,845
    Location:
    Here, there, everywhere
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    I think @martin1656's point is correct as the chair is also the GM at the moment.

    What is striking about the WSR considering how large it is as an organisation is how many people wear multiple hats and have multiple roles.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2021
  16. 35B

    35B Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2011
    Messages:
    25,483
    Likes Received:
    23,713
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Grantham
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    I'm not so sure I see the two as being exclusive, or that the difference is desirable. If we look at the template for large corporates, there's a difference on boards between "executive" and "non-executive" directors, where the "executive" directors are managers in the business, and "non executive" are outsiders brought in for an independent viewpoint. Those execs, in my experience, get very heavily involved in the day to day, albeit from the 50,000ft level.

    I don't like too many barriers between shop floor and the top, and directors being arms length feels like one such. The challenge is how to ensure that they have enough space left to deal with strategic as well as tactical matters.
     
    The Dainton Banker and jnc like this.
  17. nanstallon

    nanstallon Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2005
    Messages:
    4,323
    Likes Received:
    2,397
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Westcountry
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    So that certain individuals can then buy the assets at firesale prices, and then have their private trainset.

    Cock-up or conspiracy; take your pick.
     
    Great Western likes this.
  18. andrewtoplis

    andrewtoplis Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2006
    Messages:
    1,357
    Likes Received:
    816
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    I'd add 3, to provide 'air cover' for the professional managers so they can focus on the day job!
     
  19. andrewtoplis

    andrewtoplis Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2006
    Messages:
    1,357
    Likes Received:
    816
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Should they be dealing with 'tactical matters' though? Should this not be for the relevant department manager to deal with?

    I always think 'executive directors' is a bit of a funny one, as we have come to use the word Director to mean 'very senior manager', especially in wholly owned companies. I think the IOW has something closer to the Victorian idea of a board of directors who were essentially elected shareholder reps (and may or may not have relevant expertise), which gives instruction to a paid General Manager, who then cascades it to the managers for rolling stock, track etc.
     
    cav1975 likes this.
  20. D1039

    D1039 Guest

    That's something about which I remain to be convinced.

    Patrick
     
    ghost, 35B and Steve Edge like this.

Share This Page