If you register, you can do a lot more. And become an active part of our growing community. You'll have access to hidden forums, and enjoy the ability of replying and starting conversations.

Spring/Summer/Autumn 2018 CMEs

Discussion in 'What's Going On' started by 1020 Shireman, May 9, 2018.

  1. henrywinskill

    henrywinskill Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2005
    Messages:
    2,245
    Likes Received:
    3,537
    Occupation:
    Transgender toilet attendant
    Location:
    North East
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Yes Steve I was about and the only thing better than BILs performance was admiring a waitress serving us at an unnamed establishment between trains.Sure our Swiss friend will agree.:Drool:
     
  2. sgthompson

    sgthompson Part of the furniture Friend

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2008
    Messages:
    3,861
    Likes Received:
    9,238
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Tobacco manufacturing
    Location:
    Kendal
    Benny hill strikes again lol
     
  3. iancawthorne

    iancawthorne Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2010
    Messages:
    1,739
    Likes Received:
    5,679
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Brampton, Cumbria
    Brings a whole new imagination to the term "gricer". No need to thank me for putting that thought in your head. :Cigar:
     
    Shep Woolley and sgthompson like this.
  4. Kylchap

    Kylchap Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2015
    Messages:
    463
    Likes Received:
    840
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    East Anglia
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    I booked on this because of the superb recent performances of Galatea, which I was expecting on this trip! No doubt I can enjoy the jube some other time.

    This was a superb run with 35018, fast and apparently faultless. No hint of Bulleid wheelslip, smooth and confident acceleration. The crew seem to have got to know the loco well and know how to get the best out of her, though she did not appear to be worked very hard, blowing off at times climbing Shap! The official on-board dyno recorded 39.6mph at the summit. I don't know if anyone else noticed, but the driver shut off briefly just before we reached the summit! Somebody else mentioned something similar near the top of Wilpshire. Is this an aspect of driving technique? Could he have been making adjustments for the descent before we got to the top?

    In addition to the performance, I was very impressed by the quality of the paint job and fit of components. At the risk of upsetting others, 35018 has the best finish I've seen on a MN.

    Well done to all at Carnforth. I'm sure they've got another winner here.
     
  5. Swiss Toni

    Swiss Toni Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2008
    Messages:
    1,905
    Likes Received:
    3,328
    Location:
    Switzshire
    Not guilty your honor, I suffer from a condition known as advancing prefrontality and am seeking treatment for it. :(
     
    henrywinskill likes this.
  6. 45581

    45581 Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2007
    Messages:
    3,120
    Likes Received:
    652
    The easing at the summits could be to ensure the water level in the boiler was high enough to cover the fusible plug with the gradient change and possible water surge forwards.
     
  7. 1020 Shireman

    1020 Shireman Part of the furniture Friend

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2013
    Messages:
    2,836
    Likes Received:
    2,677
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Relaxingly retired
    Location:
    Deep in the country
    Understandably lots of talk about the climb of Shap and Appleby to Ais Gill, but what about the climb of Grayrigg? Anyone got a log that betters it from a Carnforth U&DGL start? 51.2 at the summit; mp13 to the summit at mp26 in 12m 44s? Better than an even time on a seriously long demanding climb.
     
  8. Where's Mazeppa?

    Where's Mazeppa? Member

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2013
    Messages:
    485
    Likes Received:
    494
    Gender:
    Male
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    The "log that betters it from a Carnforth U&DGL start" would probably be the closely comparable Load 11/ 388/415 Tornado run with the July 2014 Border Raider.

    Published in Steam Railway around that time (sorry details not immediately to hand, so I hope I've interpreted my notes correctly) the log shows just about a cigarette-paper's worth of difference between the two runs from MP13 to MP26. Tornado's speed at MP13 was recorded as 73 mph in 9'59" from the standing start (versus BIL's 59.1 mph and 11'32"). Thence the comparison onward from MP13 with BIL's run is virtually identical - 12m 37s with Tornado to Grayrigg/ MP26 surmounted at min 53 mph, compared with BIL's 12m 44s/ 51.2 min.

    Well, you did ask!! Doesn't in any way diminish BIL's magnificent achievement yesterday, though. Just underscores how high the bar is set with a representative standard of actual 8P performance that these runs exhibit, perhaps illustrating the point that Big Al makes in Post No. 42 up-thread about where our expectations of standards of performance should sensibly be pitched.
     
  9. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    May 30, 2009
    Messages:
    21,064
    Likes Received:
    20,773
    Location:
    1016
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Not a lot between Tornado and Merchant 18 on comparable loads. 43 over Shap and 65 minutes from Carnforth Loop to Carlisle in 2014. And that probably illustrates quite well the point about taking steam over Shap contrasted with the S&C where a more leisurely pace can be taken without compromising the passage of other services. It is, of course, a great spectacle for photographers and students of loco performance to witness the struggle up the hill with ribbons of dark smoke being thrown over the shoulder of the train. However the occasional ponderous climbs and the looping at Grayrigg or elsewhere tells you that it's not always ideal for the other traffic on this line.

    10A has needed a Class 8 for some time and now it has one. That must make the management of charters over the Fells a slightly less uncertain business for West Coast so let's hope that the MN gets a few more outings.
     
    Haighie, gricerdon and 26D_M like this.
  10. 1020 Shireman

    1020 Shireman Part of the furniture Friend

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2013
    Messages:
    2,836
    Likes Received:
    2,677
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Relaxingly retired
    Location:
    Deep in the country
    I did indeed and thanks for that. Tornado had been run in on the mainline for 5 years by then so for BIL to match it first up running in is really something.
     
  11. 1020 Shireman

    1020 Shireman Part of the furniture Friend

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2013
    Messages:
    2,836
    Likes Received:
    2,677
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Relaxingly retired
    Location:
    Deep in the country
    Thought I'd add this 'on the train' view for those who didn't want to pick the bones out of the timing sheets.

    35018 British India Line CME 12th May 2018

    Ray Mason's late post on NatPres on Friday night confirmed 35018 as our motive power so we were looking forward to a bit of a special day with only the 2nd run of a rebuilt Merchant Navy over Grayrigg and Shap in the preservation era, my 'steam age'.

    Our day started well at Crewe as we watched Lord Dowding depart for Cardiff. Then it went pear shaped rapidly as we heard the announcement that the Manchester Pendolino service was delayed due to cattle on the line. The next announcement told us it was in the Rugeley area, so we would be affected. Some trains were cancelled and finally RTT showed trains on the move some 40+ mins late. On train they were told there was a possibility of being diverted via Coventry but that didn't happen and with the cattle back where they belonged, Les Ross brought the 10 coach train in 52 late. Could have been worse as there would be the 'hour later' slot for us to drop into at Carnforth. We didn't want to be let out between trains as in all probability we'd be looped at Grayrigg.

    Common sense prevailed and we left Carnforth U&DGL an hour late with 35018 in charge with a sensible 11 up for a first attack on Grayrigg and Shap. Our crew was driver Steve Chipperfield with fireman Chris Holmes. it didn't take long for the distinctive three cylinder beat to make itself heard rather loudly as Steve and Chris set about Yealand Bank, the irritating 2 1/2 miles of 1in134 a mile out with a cold fire. They hit the climb at 32.4 and worked hard over the summit at 38. They meant business and the engine responded beautifully over the 3 1/2 mile down/level grades to mp13, the start of the climb to Grayrigg Summit, 13 miles away. This is a long and demanding climb for any fireman and Chris did an excellent job providing the steam for Steve to use. We passed mp13 at 69 and attacked the first 4 miles are at 1in173. 35018 responded superbly with our speed only falling back to 64.3. The racket from the front was really something. The steepening 3/4 mile at 1in153 saw a slight fall to 63.6 but the 3/4 mile easing to 1in392 took it back to 65.

    This was getting seriously interesting to say the least. 35018 was opened up more as we tackled the mile of 1in111 that took speed down to 60. The gradient lessens through Oxenholme, over a mile of 1in176. Speed held on the tight curve and we hit the 3/4 mile of 1in104 at 59. It got noisier and we only lost 2 mph to the steeper grade. Speed held around 57 up the mile of 1in213/124 onto the 2 1/2 miles of 1in131. The Cumbrian Hills were getting used to the sound of the big Bulleid as 35018 refused to give much away, ending the section at 55.9. After 10 miles of hard firing Chris must have been overjoyed to hit the sting in the tail of Grayrigg, the 2 miles+ of 1in106. The noise level rose as 35018 charged towards the summit in spectacular style, speed only falling to 52 and then as the big engine was eased, to 51.2 on the 1in396 passing mp26, the summit of the climb. A spectacular climb.

    In the Lune Gorge there was a TSR60 from mp26 1/2 to 28 1/4. Fortunately this is where the crew are generally tending to the fire and filling the boiler before attacking the foot of Shap at Tebay. Not the quickest pick up, but we hit 73 as we past mp31 1/2, the start of the mile and a half at 1in146. Our speed fell slowly and we took 67 onto the fearsome 4 miles+ of 1in75 to Shap Summit. We were hoping for a 40 mph+ speed at the summit and passing Scout Green at 52 it seemed possible. But Shap is a serious test of man and machine and began to bite. A mile further in we were doing 46.6 passing mp36, and the engine note changed as they faced the final mile and a quarter. Speeds then went like this: mp36 1/4 45.7; 36 1/2 45.2; 36 3/4 43.8; 37 42.3; and 37 1/4, the 'climbing summit' at 40.7 coinciding with what felt like slight slip with accompanying safety valves lift before Steve eased 35018 past the plateau summit board at 39.4. An excellent first time climb with an unfamiliar engine.

    Not very interested in the downhill bits but as we were still rather late we passed mp46 at 75 on the long 1in125 down grade; Penrith North Lakes at 69; mp54 at 78 and stayed thereabouts down through Calthwaite and down to mp66 before braking and passing Upperby Jn at 56. We drifted into Carlisle Citadel 65mins 10.52secs after leaving Carnforth against a schedule of 77 mins.

    We were still 50 down and were asked to be back for our booked 1425 departure. We managed to get a quick lunch and a pint in the Woodrow Wilson. One of our group had been up front talking to Steve on the footplate who told him the regulator was a bit stiff and didn't open fully.

    We were back at the station just before 1410 but there was no sign of 35018. With Mick Kelly driving and Mick Middleton firing we were ready to leave close to 1440, the old departure time, and left at 1445. With nothing near in front the running to Appleby was quicker than usual. There's 4 miles of 1in132 as the line deviates right from Petterill Bridge Jn. A mile in we passed Cumwhinton at 47; Howe & Co SB a mile further at 50. We crossed Eden Brow 'viaduct' at 48; Low House Crossing at 52.6 and charged through Armathwaite at 60. We ran in the high 50s over the undulating gradients to Culgaith, passed at 56, and as we passed Long Marton at 59 it was obvious we weren't stopping at Appleby. We climbed the mile and a half of 1in120 in fine style, leaving it at 54. 35018 was being worked quite hard through the station at 53.6 and Mick used the down grade past the site of the old dairy to hit the first stretch of 1in100 at mp275 1/4 at 60.9.

    So what would 35018 make of the climb to Ais Gill? We passed mp275, the start of the Blue Riband section if the train had stopped at Appleby at 60.2. Despite what must have been hard firing by Mick, speed had dropped to 53 as we entered Helm Tunnel. We left it at 51 and lost speed slowly to 49.4 as we passed mp272, the end of the section. The engine note changed as Mick K used the mile + of 1in166 down to increase speed to 52; then down the mile+ of 1in200/200 to 59 before we hit a max of 62 on the level as we charged into Crosby Garrett Tunnel. With the exception of a short section of 1in264 through Kirkby Stephen, the next 5 miles or so is a constant 1in100. Even 10 back we heard the noise from the front as 35018 dug in. Speed fell to 53.7 as we approached Kirkby Stephen and we didn't pick up any speed on the short 1 in 264.

    Mick M must have been working seriously hard to provide the steam as speed rose to 54.4 as we passed mp266. We entered Birkett Tunnel, a mile and half further into the climb at 52.4, and passed mp264 at 52.3. There's a short break in the 1in100, 3/4 of a mile at 1in330, and Mick K used it well and we hit the 3 miles of 1in100 to the summit at 57.7. This was turning into some climb and 50 at the summit seemed a distinct possibility. 35018 thundered around Mallerstang at 55/54. We crossed Ais Gill viaduct at 53.5 and rounded the final left hand curve to pass the climbing summit at mp260 at an excellent 53, a speed held past the Summit Board, only 58 mins 46.82 secs after leaving Carlisle.

    Not much chance to make up time on the run down to Settle Jn as it's a 60 mph railway. In fact it was a slowish run down; Horton passed at 52.4; Settle at 47 and the junction signal box at 52. We left Hellifield on time and we had the final bank, Wilpshire to look forward to. We were slowed as usual through Clitheroe, 14.3 but hit the start of the 3 miles or so of 1 in 82 1/2 through Whalley station, around mp17 1/2 at 44.3. We left the Arches at 38.5 and our speed fell a little to 36.7 passing mp17. Over the next mile 35018 climbed superbly and we passed mp16 at 35.7. speed picked up to 36.5 through Langho and we took that onto the 1/2 mile of 1 in 88 to Wilpshire Tunnel. Our speed fell to 35.4 by mp14 and we entered the tunnel at that speed. We left the tunnel at 32 and on the 1in86 speed had fallen to 28.5 through the old Wilpshire station. We passed mp13 1/4 on Ramsgreave and Wilpshire station at 26 and passed mp13, which seems to be the summit at 29.5. Good climb to Wilpshire Tunnel but a bit of an unexpected fall to the summit.

    Into and out of Blackburn early and a 14 minute early arrival at Farington Junction where 35018 was detached. We left early and the big engine looked magnificent as we passed it. What a paint finish. One of the best ever. Congrats to the paint shop at Carnforth. After all the issues of the morning we actually arrived in Crewe 14 early. If we hadn't been slowed then held outside Crewe to cross to P12 we might even have caught the 1908 Cardiff Service. The train was held for its booked path out.

    A brilliant day out with the big rebuilt Bulleid. Thanks to David Smith for making our day and letting BIL out. Apparently it was a late decision on Friday and one really appreciated.

    As Big Al said, 35018 did what you'd expect of a Class 8 with 11. And that's the point, it did what was expected of it, and in some style. Kudos to the engineering staff at Carnforth. Thanks to WCR for their management on the day and to Steve, Chris and the 2 Micks who were excellent as we have come to expect, especially as they were handling an unfamiliar engine. Thanks to Nigel who we wish a speedy recovery, and all at RTC. Shame that yet again this year the train wasn't full, though that was good for me as a timer to have facing seats milepost sides all day. And our thanks must go to Network Rail Signallers for their sensible approach to pathing the train in difficult circumstances, especially from Carnforth to give us the best run to Carlisle.

    Really looking forward to the Merchant getting better and better with time and doing the same or better with 12 or more. Wonder what will haul the train on 23rd June?
     
    RayMason, Shoddy127, 30567 and 15 others like this.
  12. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    May 30, 2009
    Messages:
    21,064
    Likes Received:
    20,773
    Location:
    1016
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Thanks for that account. Yes, it was perhaps a trip to have been on but you can't pick up everything. It must be acknowledged again that the Carnforth team seems now to have got the MN where they want it and that's excellent news for all. Still a bit bemused down south by one or two (only a few I have to say) who are pleasantly surprised at seeing what happens when you ask a Bulleid Pacific and a Merchant Navy in particular to go quickly up a hill. It is, after all, what they have done for years........
     
    banana patch likes this.
  13. gricerdon

    gricerdon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2018
    Messages:
    1,572
    Likes Received:
    726
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Gricer and Grandad
    Location:
    Wallers Ash
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Like 76 mph at Roundwood with 455 tons on 4th April 1965.
     
  14. 30567

    30567 Part of the furniture Friend

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2012
    Messages:
    5,608
    Likes Received:
    3,510
    It all just goes to show how little class 8 power utilised at anything like full bore there has been in the north over the last few years. But it's not just the power, it's the size of the water cart. Look at the relative ease with which BIL pulled back the 60 mins down at Carnforth. Now work out what Galatea putting up one of the customary good runs would have achieved. It's difficult to imagine that train being less than 30L back at Farington and given traffic in the Clitheroe and Blackburn area, it could have been 60L through no fault whatever of the loco.

    Obviously it's not good news for the Friends of the S and C and the ice cream vendors of Appleby, but in terms of the bigger picture, surely what has happened in the last week must be one of the best bits of news for a while for steam on the main line.
     
    Haighie, andalfi1 and 26D_M like this.
  15. IamDaniel

    IamDaniel Member

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2017
    Messages:
    219
    Likes Received:
    117
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    UK
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't there a £20 off code for the entire CME season? Any idea what it is?
     
  16. pjhliners

    pjhliners Member Friend

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2009
    Messages:
    568
    Likes Received:
    448
    Hi Daniel, is this what you were thinking of? This is a quote from an email from RTC:

    Mayday Sale


    We are pleased to offer you the opportunity to book on any of our forthcoming daytrips or holidays using our special Mayday Sale code to obtain a discount of £25 per person on any daytrip booking or £100 per person on any holiday booking.


    This special discount is available throughout the Bank Holiday weekend from now until midnight on Monday 7th May.


    To claim your discount for daytrip bookings please quote code MAYS to receive your £25 per person discount.


    For holiday bookings the code to quote for a £100 per person discount is MAYT.



    Please note there is no limit on the number of bookings you can make using these codes over the Bank Holiday Weekend. This offer is subject to availability, for new bookings only and cannot be used in conjunction with any other offer.


    For your information our office will be closed on Bank Holiday Monday, bookings can be made throughout the weekend online at http://www.railwaytouring.net


    Kind regards


    The Railway Touring Company​

    Unfortunately the offer was only valid over the Bank Holiday weekend, so I'm afraid you've missed it.

    Best wishes

    Peter on another lovely sunny day in Manchester
    http://pjhtransportpix.zenfolio.com/
     
  17. Gladiator 5076

    Gladiator 5076 Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2015
    Messages:
    6,074
    Likes Received:
    4,889
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Swanage
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    After the stunning run over Grayrigg and Shap 35018 pushes it support coach through the dappled sunlight coming through the new roof at Carlisle Citadel.
    IMG_1010.JPG
     
    andalfi1, banana patch, 46223 and 2 others like this.
  18. gricerdon

    gricerdon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2018
    Messages:
    1,572
    Likes Received:
    726
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Gricer and Grandad
    Location:
    Wallers Ash
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Different return times for this Saturdays' CME mean we probably have to drive to MK if we go
     
  19. leander

    leander Member

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2007
    Messages:
    801
    Likes Received:
    40
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Wymington Beds
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Times for Saturday on RTT shows water stop at Appleby
     
  20. gricerdon

    gricerdon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2018
    Messages:
    1,572
    Likes Received:
    726
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Gricer and Grandad
    Location:
    Wallers Ash
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Plus 1500 ex Carlisle instead of 1425
     

Share This Page