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Swanage Railway General Discussion

Discussion in 'Heritage Railways & Centres in the UK' started by Rumpole, Oct 10, 2012.

  1. stephenvane

    stephenvane Member

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    Exactly. The Swanage Railway was incredibly lucky to find a company that could make these parts at all. Taking legal action against them certainly won’t inspire them to help the SR in future.
     
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2018
  2. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    To what end? Suppose you go down that route - you run the risk of spending a lot of money, without actually materially bringing the commencement date any closer, and potentially jeopardising a rather fragile infrastructure of suppliers in the heritage market. It might be really frustrating, but it's hard too see how embarking on any kind of legal action improves the situation. Surely the key issue is to make sure that the communication is good with the key stakeholders (especially Dorset CC) so they have realistic expectations of when it would be possible for the service to recommence.

    Tom
     
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  3. nanstallon

    nanstallon Part of the furniture

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    ... and presumably the firm doesn't get paid in full until the job has been finished.
     
  4. 30854

    30854 Resident of Nat Pres

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    It's clear enough what hasn't happened, but has there been any information on why it hasn't happened yet?

    This seems to have been dragging on for a long time already. Is there any indication of a specific technical issue? Or is this a case of a fairly small non-standard order not receiving the sort of priority to meet the original delivery date? I'd have thought the answer would directly affect future soucing decisions by other owners of 1st gen dmmu's.
     
  5. gwalkeriow

    gwalkeriow Well-Known Member

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    In the heritage market virtually all of the parts are only used in the heritage market. Finding companies that have the ability and the interest to service small orders used to take up a good proportion of my and others time. Having a demanding or sarcastic manner with a supplier is only counterproductive, you have to build up a good relationship with them.

    The bearing may not have been manufactured for a number of decades and none of the present employees may have been involved with their production, so a little bit of gentle persuasion and cajoling goes along way .
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2018
  6. Gladiator 5076

    Gladiator 5076 Part of the furniture

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    From someone who spent 41 years in Procurement for a FTSE 100 company the chances of successfully pursuing a late delivery claim against a supplier come next to nil. Even with contracts we wrote with input from our internal legal department there will nearly always be something that you have forgotten, or failed to make clear in the specification, or a new legal requirement (normally safety) has come along during the course of the contract. This will give the supplier a good reason to claim a legitimate delay. I have no idea under which law the contract may have be written if the supplier is overseas, or if it was a Swanage Railway contract or as part of the total overhaul package at Eastleigh. That is without all the very valid points already made that Swanage or other Heritage lines may need this suppliers services.
    It is I suspect very similar to how trying to support Concorde was in its final years, one (or no) supplier for a part, who did not really want to make it anyway, and had to be "convinced" to produce it.
     
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  7. Dan Bennett

    Dan Bennett Member

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    The bearings have to come from Timken in the USA as they're imperial and only available to order. The wheels and tyres came from South Africa and there was no problem with the delivery of these
     
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  8. 30854

    30854 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Well I, at least, certainly wasn't being sarcastic Gary. With several previous orders for tyres being successfully sourced from S.Africa over the last few years, the question was an honest one. The post above by @Dan Bennett concerning imperial standards explains things. Having 'done time' in the supplies department of a flight simulator manufacturer, I can appreciate the kind of issues arising from complex international supply chains (and stroppy customs wallahs!).

    In all honesty, given the amount of 1st gen kit in preservation for the last couple of decades, I'm quite surprised this situation hadn't cropped up already. Fingers crossed, engine parts remain easier to procure than is evidently the case for Napier 'deltic' power units.
     
  9. stephenvane

    stephenvane Member

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    In this case the problem has occurred because whilst the original wheel sets and bearings were fine for 25mph heritage line use, they were not up to the standards required for the main line.

    Mk1 and 2 coaches, and heritage diesels running in the mainline might have encountered this problem. I suppose the difference is that these have remained in constant use (albeit in small numbers now) so there has always been a constant demand and supply of parts for them. Unlike the class 117s, which were withdrawn many years ago so there was no market for new wheel sets and bearings until now.
     
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  10. 30854

    30854 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Indeed ..... but surely at some point .... ??
     
  11. gwalkeriow

    gwalkeriow Well-Known Member

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    I didn't mean you personally Howard it was a reply more about the general tone of comments that the suppliers should be sued! If you do that your reputation will soon go down the pan ! You may well find that no one will deal with you.
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2018
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  12. 30854

    30854 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Cheers Gary. As the Swanage job seems to be unprecedented in preservation terms, with luck the pitfalls have been identified and it will form the template for other lines where some 'big railway' operation may beckon. Whitby and (just possibly) Taunton* spring to mind, at some point down the road.

    *Kindly note, I did say 'just possibly' folks! ;)
     
  13. gwr4090

    gwr4090 Part of the furniture

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    There has already been enough through running from the WSR to Taunton (and beyond) to confirm that running WSR trains to Taunton makes little economic sense, and hence the preferred solution now being pursued to encourage the local ToC to run services through to the WSR instead. This makes me wonder if the Swanage is following the best option. I have yet to see the economic case?
     
  14. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    I can see your point of view; however, surely the significant difference is the third rail. In other words, while it may be (comparatively!) simple for FGW to extend a diesel that was terminating at Taunton to run the extra few miles to Bishops Lydeard, that option isn't possible for SWR to extend a Wareham train to Norden. So for SWR to run a service from somewhere to Norden, they would have to use DMUs that aren't generally running anywhere near that area (the closest I assume would be the units used on Salisbury / Romsey / Southampton services, some miles away).

    Tom
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2018
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  15. 30854

    30854 Resident of Nat Pres

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    ...... hence the "Kindly note" :)
     
  16. Wenlock

    Wenlock Well-Known Member Friend

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    You're not meant to mention the "Warhead trains" they're supposed to be secret.;)
     
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  17. Bean-counter

    Bean-counter Part of the furniture

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    'Preserved' trains have been running to Whitby and at up to 45mph to Battersby as well for over a decade now. OK, nothing like as busy a line but one of the issues that forces the costs of the national network up is that it is a network with one set of standards. You may be able to gain exemption from some, and where you want to operate will undoubtedly affect that, but the standards are the same for the SW mainline and the Esk Valley line.

    Steven
     
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  18. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    Damn predictive text! I'm rarely in favour of the nuclear option as a solution to anything...

    Tom
     
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  19. stephenvane

    stephenvane Member

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    Quite recently SWT (as they were) were starting to make noises about running some 159s to Wareham on normal services anyway. It might have been Brockenhurst to Wareham, can’t quite remember now. So continuing down to Swanage might be an option.

    All academic really though, Swanage will want to get their moneys worth out of the 117 and bubble car first.
     
  20. Mogul

    Mogul Member

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    This 'third party' operation is the 'third option I referred to earlier HERE. It causes a fair abstraction issue which damages the economic case for it. It may also cause pathing issues for the SR's own Heritage services. This a an important part of the reason Swanage has chosen to go this route.

    Are the WSR encouraging the ToC to run the full lenght to Minehead or is it just envisaged as an 'end on' connection at Bishops Lydeard? If full line, have the extraction and pathing issues issues been fully considered?
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2018

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